Was my Christmas Day "abstemious"?

[romanfriendsandcountrywomen]

I'm a little bit nonplussed because my brother's new girlfriend apparently found Christmas Day at our house "nice but more abstemious than she's used to". However, I'm also now wondering if I was perhaps a bit boring....

Present on Xmas day : DH, me, DD (19), DS (15), my parents (late 70s), DB (43), DB newish girlfriend (30 something) my niece (DB's daughter, 16.)

People arrived at 11am. It's morning so I offered teas and proper coffees etc while we opened presents. At 12.00 I opened 2 bottles of M&S sloe gin fizz (admittedly only 4% alcohol but lovely and nicer than Buck's Fizz imo) and everyone had a glass while finishing opening the presents.

About 1.00 I we had champagne and nibbles- probably about 1.5 bottles of fizz and lots of nibbly things )

Full Xmas dinner at 3.00. (Turkey, pigs in blankets, 2 stuffings, roast potato, roast carrots and parsnips, sprouts, broccoli, cauliflower cheese, Yorkshires, Christmas pudding and chocolate log.) Opened 2 bottles of red wine.

After dinner we played games and finished off the red wine and champagne. I made the traditional Christmas snowball for the teenagers. Lots of adults had one as well despite laughing at them! (Advocat, lemonade, line juice, cocktail cherry perched artistically on top!)

About 9.00 we watched a film and had cheese. I offered to open more wine and we also offered port or baileys but people were full so most just had a cup of tea.

People went to bed or got an uber about midnight.

I thought it had been a lovely day so the abstemious comment had thrown me a bit. Girlfriend is from a bigger family with lots of siblings who all bring partners and apparently it's a more "adult" affair. She was surprised there were no spirits or cocktails as apparently she doesn't really drink wine and drinks vodka cranberry/ vodka coke. We don't drink spirits so it never occurred to me and I did wonder why she couldn't have brought her own but I haven't said anything.

So there were 7 adults and 2 teens and we had 4 bottles of wine/ fizz, a couple of bottles of low alcohol fizz and snowballs, port and baileys offered. Over 12 hours apparently this isn't a lot.

Be honest. Was my Xmas day a bit boring? I probably should have asked what she liked to drink...

No, the bottle per person included all that. A pp did the calculation, you can see it upthread.

I don't think I have a particularly great vocabulary, but it's a word I am familiar with and wouldn't assume someone was pretentious for using it. Just because you've never heard of it doesn't mean it's a posh word and it seems strange to be so overtly impacted by its use.

Apart from anything else, I can't think of a better word to describe the situation from the DGFs perspective. Stingy with the alcohol is possibly close, but implies the hosting was lacking, whereas abstemious makes it more of a deliberate choice.

@rookiemere, that poster also objected to the use of the word mellifluous. How anyone can equate the art of using the exactly appropriate word with lack of intelligence is beyond me.

Just to elaborate on why I say pretentious, insecure and lacking intelligence.

Pretentious: oh look I can use a big (uncommon) word.
Insecure: rather than use an everyday term, I will use a longer/uncommon word as that will make me sound more intelligent (the opposite is the case).
Lacking intelligence: knowing a word is basic knowledge, knowing how to best use a word to communicate clearly (ie. get your point across without folk having to Google it) is intelligence.

Intelligence manifests itself in many forms.

Pretentious, low intelligence and insecure could also be used to describe people who feel the need to kick off and insult people over the use of a relatively normal word. It’s rather old-fashioned but hardly obscure.

My father used it quite regularly. He would he was “very abstemious” as a joke. He came from a generation that regarded moderation, temperance, self-restraint as a virtue.

A whole bottle each is a lot

Of course a bottle of wine isn't a lot when it's spread over a whole day!

But that’s because you see it as “big” word and an “uncommon” one.

Others don’t see it as either. Nor would do they have friends who would have to Google it. So the above only applies in your head.

OP it sounds to me like you created an absolutely lovey Christmas Day for everyone. Please don’t let her comment worry you.

Most people wouldn’t have to google it, so you’re looking at this from your own (somewhat limited) perspective.

Girlfriend, brother and OP all knew exactly what the word meant so it was perfectly good communication for the purpose intended. Not showing off, because they were all on the same level of knowledge, not risking miscommunication, just using a specific word that's best fitted for the specific purposes.

The OP uses it in her MN post because it's the word used. If she paraphrased then she'd get into a mess of people nitpicking "it's ridiculous to say it was "sober" when everyone was drinking" or whatever and have to clarify.

You appear to be suggesting that two people who know what a word means shouldn't use it in private between each other because you, a thousand miles away in another house, don't know it.

I've just come back to this thread and I'm amazed about the discussion of abstemious. For me it is very much an everyday word. I would definitely use it from time to time. I'm 60, it may be generational.

Reading back five or six pages, "inverted snobbery" has been aimed at those criticising its usage.

It has nothing to do with that. It's not the use of the term, it's the misuse.

An uncommon term should not be used in everyday speech. It's that simple.

Since it exists there obviously is a use for such a word (academia, and possibly a job interview if you think the interviewer will grasp what you are saying). Outside of that, nope.

Language is used to communicate. We misuse language when we don't communicate clearly, and using uncommon terms that folk have to Google to understand is poor communication.

Oh, give over. The vast majority of people would gave had no difficulty with that word.
It’s not from some ancient, arcane dialect, it’s a perfectly normal word.

I think your Christmas Day sounds perfectly balanced and wonderful. Baring in mind you had two teenagers there of whom have got to experience a special, magical Christmas without adults having to get themselves drunk to enjoy it, therefore reinforcing the fact that we don’t need alcohol to have fun and enjoy company. Sounds perfect, perhaps if brothers gf wants to get drunk at Christmas she should go to the pub In the evening or bring her own drinks?

An uncommon term should not be used in everyday speech. It's that simple.

a. It’s not uncommon and b. According to whom?

Obviously you can’t police other people’s vocab and I don’t think you would take kindly to others insisting you level up just as you insist others level down.

I’m not going to dumb down my language so someone with a limited vocabulary can understand it when most of the people I communicate with on a regular basis will understand perfectly. And if they don’t will delight in learning a new word.

And lol at the numpty who said Shankly "sounds thick".

Bill Shankly is one of the greatest communicators Britain has ever produced.

Oh and Orwell, whose "work is characterised by lucid prose", a man who The Times named the second-greatest British writer since 1945, he too knew a thing or two about how to use the English language.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/nov/09/georgeorwell

There were 13 of us for Christmas Day and a mix of generations from 80s to late teens. We have a few heavier drinkers who like all games, lots of indulgence etc through to non drinkers and drivers who aren’t really games people and want to be quieter / chill afterwards so we quite often split in to two rooms so people can choose what to do. I think the tricky part is catering to different ‘needs’ in that way but we seem to have got the balance after a long time. Some of the more ‘party’ ones can sometimes think the others a being a bit boring but accept it.

There will be a lot of puddings and cheese flowing with our Christmas as well as the wine but gin & tonics tend to be the only spirit / mixer drinks that come out and my brothers will sometimes do a whisky or brandy after dinner. I would say maybe to always open another bottle of wine as an option so it’s there whereas sometimes ‘shall I open another?’ Is a bit tricky because no one wants to be the one to say yes! But we don’t do cocktails, vodka etc and it’s always alcohol drunk sensibly with soft drinks and tea/coffee etc in between.

In general your Christmas sounds lovely! It sounds like you’re in a ‘change’ period for it as your kids get partners etc which is probably why it’s on your mind.

Did you read your own link? Orwell comments on slovenly use of English:

'A man may take to drink because he feels himself to be a failure, and then fail all the more completely because he drinks. It is rather the same thing that is happening to the English language. It becomes ugly and inaccurate because our thoughts are foolish, but the slovenliness of our language makes it easier for us to have foolish thoughts.'

All I read is alcohol, alcohol, alcohol.

The quality of the conversation is more important to me. The right people can have fun anywhere.

Orwell was saying exactly the opposite to you. He decried “slovenly language”, you’re advocating it.

It would be a poor use of language for the girlfriend to use it in a KS1 class (although even there there's a place for sometimes modelling use of passive vocabulary and widening vocabulary with more nuance). It would be a poor use of language to use it in a casual conversation at the bus stop or in the hairdresser where there's a highish probability that it will be misunderstood.

Would I use it to (proudly) describe my New Year to my workmates? Probably not.

Would I use it in conversation with my DH or DF who I'm completely confident understand it? Yep. How could that possibly be inappropriate?

They did communicate clearly though, as the girlfriend, DB, OP - none of them had to google the term. All understood what was meant.

What word would you have used instead?