To think men and women are actually programmed differently?

[Isittjustme]

I have spent many years believing a lot of men just don’t get on with things in the same way women do (ie ‘seeing’ the jobs to do in the house etc) because they are socially conditioned not to. But… since having ds and watching my partner really do his best but basically be far less good at parenting than me, I have started to wonder if men and women are actually just programmed differently.

DP really does try (at least I believe so). But he doesn’t get a good system going with ds when doing a nappy, just one example, he will often be flailing around or forget to wash his hands etc. He will forget to blow on the food every once in a while.. there’s so many more examples and they are small things I guess, but in contrast I rarely do these things. And I’m not saying I’m a perfect parent, I’m not. But I recognise this with my friends and the men in their lives too, it’s the same sort of thing.

DP has a good job and does it well. He’s quite a sincere man and I think he really does try his best. This makes me think perhaps some of it is innate for women and not for men?

The examples you give are simply exercising organisation skills (getting changing things ready) and remembering important steps in a task (hand washing and cooling food). If your DH holds down even the most straightforward of paid jobs, I can promise you he is as capable of transferring those basic skills to childcare as you are. He might appear to be trying his best, but he isn't. He's being complacent, nor bothering to prep or paying enough attention to remember the steps, because he thinks it's easy/not as vital to get right as his paid tasks/you will step in.

People fall over themselves to make excuses for men to be inadequate, especially when it comes to parenting and housework. Funny that.

Of course it’s social conditioning.

But also a higher proportion of women are the main child carer though, so it would make statistical sense for more women to be better at it as they have more practice. Like you say, it doesn’t mean they are in innately better, just more have had the sole experience of it.

its a good book

So you automatically knew what to do with a newborn? You didn't get any advice, read any books or learn on the job. It came out of you fully fledged.🤔

My husband didn’t forget to wash his hands after changing a nappy. It’s not something men are programmed to do but it is a way that men can look ineffectual so the woman in their life takes over because you’re just much better at it.

Women aren’t necessarily better at care roles. I’m sure you forgot to blow on your son’s food or didn’t quite get the temperature right the first few times. Your son cried, you dealt with it because your partner is off being an important man somewhere and there was no other option. You get better at knowing the right temp. Your partner forgets or gets the temperature wrong and he suddenly doesn’t know what to do and you’re much better at blaming DS (because you spend more time with him). The only way your partner is going to get better is he learns through trial and error, like most women are doing. Although I think most men and women are washing their hands after changing a nappy.

I think they are but not in the way you’re describing. In our house, it’s me who doesn’t see the jobs that need doing and my husband is the one who takes the lion’s share of housework/life admin. I know other couples the same.

I think men and women are wired differently as parents though. I feel as though there is an identity shift for women when they become mothers that men just don’t experience.

It really isn’t

My husband has managed to never fail at those things.

It’s shit

I often wonder this. It’s a huge bone of contention in my household and frustrates the hell out of me! My DP is a skilled tradesman, very meticulous in his job and aims for perfection. Yet at home quite the opposite. He always says he’s the ‘practice and logical’ one yet to watch him perform any household tasks it’s quite the opposite. He doesn’t have any ‘systems’ like hanging up the washing for example, so haphazard. I’m constantly battling in my brain whether it’s that he can’t do it or whether he can’t be arsed to do it.

I think you are describing one man, your husband, and his character traits/habits/abilities are massively unlikely to be replicated throughout all men, so yes - YABU.

For background, as a woman who didn’t/doesn’t act in a ‘feminine’ way I am so, so tired of these tropes. Being lazy at housework doesn’t make you a man. Liking dresses doesn’t make you a woman. The sooner we move away from these tropes, the fairer a society we will have. Sorry op, don’t want to rant on your thread - just read the first sentence :-) it’s just it really hacks me off.

Wholeheartedly agree. I find gender tropes tiresome.
There is no robust evidence to support that men are innately rubbish at parenting

I disagree. My DH has always been far more natural and better at parenting than me. It's always been a chore to me, whilst he seems to relish in it.

I have no system for hanging out the washing; I do not have a penis and I definitely have no fucks.

I don’t have one either. I’m fairly sure I’m female.

Don’t ever let yourself be fooled that your man’s shitness is inherent.

It is always intentional and purposeful.

Why would you choose a well planned system to change nappies when you could do a crap job and know that every one you fail makes you less and less likely to have to change another?

Men are assholes but they are also geniuses.

(It’s because I can’t be arsed, not because I’m incapable. Like most men)

I think men and women are wired differently as parents though. I feel as though there is an identity shift for women when they become mothers that men just don’t experience.

This is so true! I pretty much lost myself in becoming a mother after I had dd1. It took me until dd2 was in her early teens before I realised how much of myself I'd lost.

Even my cousin who had moderate learning disabilities is capable of learning how to change a nappy.

Are you suggesting your DP has less learning capacity than someone with moderate LD? No? Then the other obvious answer is this is weaponised incompetence at its finest! How can you not see that?

Indeed. With a side order of ‘Men can’t see dirt, bless their hearts’. Whereas possessing a vagina means you are automatically programmed to change nappies.

Topped off with a cheeky women are more nurturing than men chaser

It's socialisation. Anyone who thinks it's biology has unfortunately swallowed years and years and years of societal conditioning to make you think that it's biology. People always go 'i see xx behaviour in all men so it must be biology' or it's the fact that societies across different cultures are overwhelmingly skewed towards the woman as caregiver model? (Yes yes, not your Nigel, and yes that one particular country is more equal etc - none of these detract from the fact that women as caregiver is overwhelmingly the expectation and model)

'He can never remember that baby will need fresh clothes for the week ahead'
'What does your husband do?'
'Oh he runs a large operational division of xx suplier'

You are being fucking had. If men were actually struggling with remembering/biology, it would be incredibly common to hear of men making lists of things to do in each scenario (or their reminder trick of choice) to make sure they were doing it right, asking to do more of bedtime/bathttime so it was really ingrained in their brains... but that's vanishingly rare. Yet they will do these things at work... funny that.

“do his best but basically be far less good at parenting than me”

aren’t you sweet. Maybe he thinks some of the things you do are mediocre too.

for example, it’s likely if you’re parenting a son when you believe that men just can’t do these important things, you’re not as great a parent as you think you are.

Gender is just a construct.