DH is a Freemason and it makes me cringe

[YerJokin]

He takes it so seriously. He's always gone through hobby phases but he's done this for years now and takes it very seriously. He's currently on the phone discussing 'Bretheryn' and it gives me the major ick, I actually want to cry listening to it.

I've tried to stand by him as he takes it so seriously so i attend events and smile encouragingly but I can't bear it. Never knew when I married him that he wanted to do this. It's not the worst thing he could do of course but it's an old boys club and we're only in our 30s!

He has lots of friends and other hobbies so it's not even his only social outlet, no idea why he needs this in his life and treats it like a second job.

if you can get a copy
try reading the aims and relationships of the craft which must be read out in every lodge once a year
it will give most open minded a better idea of the craft

I haven’t subscribed to any unfounded allegations
if you read my posts.
Im not interested in unusual customs and beliefs ( if indeed they have any, it’s of no interest to me ) as they are irrelevant to my thoughts on the FM as I said

Im interested in equality and I’m interested in their actual finances which are clear as day for all to see
If you read my posts

Agree
There have been other posts on here pointing out similar experiences in their field.
That’s an equality red flag

And each of the allegations are without any evidence, when asked for evidence all we get is “that was the rumour” or “it was an open secret” it’s just perpetuation of a myth.

Misogynistic and secretive. 'Annual ladies' night' - how patronising! No, no, no.

Ah, you’re interested in equality. Son assume you stand against the many unfounded allegations on this thread that perpetuates. The type of narrative that leads to the persecution of Freemasons. If you want to see an example of where those narratives can lead, you can look at 1930s Germany. That’s an interesting place y to o start when investigating equality and the Freemasons and is an actual real event.

The Catholic Church are against the Freemasons because of blasphemy
It would be unusual for one to be a member as it goes against canon law
Of course, technically, they can hide their participation so ……..

I think asking for evidence of personal experience is pointless.
How, in the real world, do you expect people to provide evidence
We don’t all record our daily lives.

Yes
Im interested in all equality, including if Freemasons were discriminated against by the Nazi regime along with so many others

However being a victim in all cases doesn’t mean one should subscribe to an organisation that then perpetuates inequality in other ways.
Two wrongs do not make a right

Have you actually read the papal bull dictating that Roman Catholics can’t join the craft and the reasons.
i have and you are talking rubbish.
but i am glad that you have confirmed that it is the Roman Catholic Church that is against Freemasons and not the other way round

I have read it. No idea why you’re calling my post rubbish despite the fact others on here say the FM exclude Catholics I don’t see fit to call their posts rubbish even though they are incorrect. I am polite and state the facts

The Church is against Freemasonry as I said and has been for a long time.

The church !! there is more than one church
you mean the blasphemous Roman rite way of worshiping .
it was you that said a non religious organisation is blasphemous
and if you had read the papal bull you would not be continuing along those line

As I said in my first post on this thread, I don't comment on Mumsnet very often because I know it not really a site for men. I do feel like I am intruding somewhat but I felt prompted to respond to this thread because I am a Freemason and care about the fraternity I am a member of. Do you not think it understandable that I would wish to counter the misconceptions and falsehoods being stated about us and explain a little of what we are really about?

You accused people like myself of trying to "control the narrative" by making a response. Surely that would more accurately describe those who think the negative comments on this thread should be allowed to go unchallenged.

I apologise unreservedly for misgendering you and I apologise that my post appears to have contravened MN guidelines.

I am genuinely interested to learn more about the FMs, because I have an interest and qualifictions in psychology and I find people fascinating.

As a woman, how do you know so much about Freemasonry, as it seems to be men-only, and it would appear that you have a lot of in-depth experience? I'm not a conspiracy theorist 😂but I do have reservations about organisations that need to keep secrets, as it means they can avoid scrutiny. Fair enough for the security of the country, but anything else.....not convinced. But I really am interested in your understanding of why the rituals and vows need to remain confidential in this situation?

I absolutely do not see evidence of @JamesPeterson or others trying to 'control the narrative' - to me it seems they are people with lived experience of the Freemasons who are contributing their own personal experiences to counter some of the unfounded narrative on this thread. Seems fairly reasonable and balanced to me. 🤷‍♀️

There are women's lodges and have been for many years

You didn’t say that though. You said UK, not Ireland. Would have been better to say both imho.

They're quite pleasant evenings actually

@JamesPeterson You have acquitted yourself very well on this thread and have won the argument for Freemasonry as far as I am concerned. But I will never join.

My Grandfather was a Mason. I just remember my Grsbdmother and Mum getting dressed up for the Ladies Nights. Didn’t have a clue what they got up to on these Ladies Nights though.
Fast forward a fair few years and my FIL joins the Masons and I get invited to a Ladies Night myself. It was awful, cringy, embarrassing and I’ve turned down every subsequent invitation to join in. The speeches are patronising and there’s a ladies song thanking the wives basically for looking after the home and hearth so that the Masons can belong to their little club. It’s excruciating.

And you are rightly correcting me on something you know more about than i do
just the same as I and others are doing about freemasonry

I find your posts interesting and informative. I don't know how I feel about Freemasonry, I go backwards and forwards on it. 50-50 at the moment. But I am enjoying the discussion on here. I knew a Freemason as a child, and he was one of the quietest, most gentlest man I've ever known. A real pilar of the town, and well-respected (think Alf Stewart in Home and Away, but without the temper). He died from mesothelioma and his funeral was packed in the church and standing room outside the church and churchgrounds and at the gravesite. And this was a small rural town. There was nothing he wouldn't do for people and would give money to people who needed it out of his own wallet, even giving money to people if they just wanted to go to the pub. So I'm not going to write off Freemasons as cold and secretive corrupt people. Alternatively, I find some of it a bit worrying. This thread is really informative and has challenged my views in many ways.

Ladies Song

No worries. As I said, the best place to start in respect of Freemasonry is the Freemasons museum in Freemasons Hall London. They also have an excellent library of documents and the most helpful librarian ever. All you need to do is register as a reader and that’s open to everyone. They do tours round Freemasons Hall too (lovely cafe) .

Ive found the best way to find out is to ask people (respectfully) about it. There is not the level of secrecy overall that people like to think. Like other initiatory groups there is some secrecy round actual rituals to ensure others have the same experience.

I’ve joined zoom calls run by various side groups because I have an interest in the esoteric (as you might have seen if you have searched my posting history).

In The 1800s several masons established the Hermetic order of the Golden Dawn and quite a few of their rituals and system were based on Freemasonry (and indeed there is still a decent cross over of membership of the various GD legacy groups and Freemasons. The GD was set up from the start to have equality of membership between men and women as was eventually headed by a woman - There’s a wonderful book - The women of the Golden Dawn by Mary Greer (herself a very ardent feminist) many of the women of that group and its legacy groups were strongly involved in the sufferage movement and Fabian society. If you’re interested in the psychology of such groups you would love them, not least the (unfortunately probably urban myth) of the poet WB Yeats wrestling the self proclaimed wildest man in the world alistair Crowley down a flight of stairs in Blythe Road.

Im generally interested in esoteric history, esp Rosicrucianism as an underpinning of he intellectual history of Europe. It’s led me to some interesting places and some interesting and lovely people inc Freemasons.

Theres a couple of really interesting Books by a chap called Ben Zion that sets out some of the ritual stuff and looks at then from an interesting perspective too.

Happy to point you in the direction of anything else. Of course if you’re looking at psychology and the esoteric Carl Jung is the place to start. Many of these rituals actually are being found to be beneficial psychologically.

It's a no from me!