Is it unreasonable to expect a 5 year old to occupy himself for periods of time?!

[Overwhelmed123]

My DS5 has never been good at occupying himself. Eg this morning he woke up, we had a cuddle and a chat, then I said I'm going to have a shower. He had a huge meltdown that he had noone to play with.
This isn't unusual.
If I say I want some time alone and he needs to occupy himself he'll just sit there hugging his teddy and stare at me. I normally put up with it, empathise and then firmly tell him he needs to give me some space to look after myself (which works)...but today I just felt too empty to listen to him cry over such a trivial need of mine.

I did train him to occupy himself for short periods of time and had words with him about accomodating other people's needs....and he got...okay...at it...but since school started he's reverted back to type...and this morning I just lost my tether as I haven't had a minute to myself for 10 days...
...I feel like this puts a lot of strain on me and DH ...
...is it normal at 5?

My absolute dream would be if we could have a couple of hours in the morning where I could shower, exercise and journal while he's in the same room pottering around with whatever he enjoys...and then we can convene and play together for the rest of the day...but at the moment it's such hard work to get even 10- 20 minutes 🙈

He doesn't like watching TV, and if I put an audiobook on he'll only listen to it if I'm with him, he doesn't like colouring or drawing or Lego either. Almost all the games he'll get into and actually focus on require interaction. He can focus for hours if he's not being asked to do something alone - eg played monopoly for 5 hours on holiday one day.

He loves cutting paper so if I had given him a pile before my shower it would have given me a few minutes respite but I don't feel like it's unreasonable to ask him to find something to do himself. Or he loves sorting numbers out so I could have given him some numbers to put in order - again though, the "lonely" feeling means he only focuses on something he enjoys, it I'm not there, for a few minutes. Its a problem in the classroom too...he's fine with 1:1 attention (the teacher takes it in turns to teach each child 1:1) but struggles to focus on something if the teacher isn't with him....which is the majority of the day! He just spends the whole time eavesdropping on the other 1:1 lessons.

It's really difficult for me to relate to him as I spent hours playing on my own as a child and would have been a bit flustered if I hadn't had that space!

If the teachers are also struggling it's unlikely to be anything you've done wrong. DS likes routine so that can work for us. We still need to be nearby but he is used to DH eating breakfast while I shower for example so he tends to play independently for that short time. If you have a time in the day when he's happier to do a couple of minutes you might find you can turn that into a daily thing and then extend it. When DS was at preschool I also used to set the expectation that he did an activity at the table while I cooked (which didn't always work out, but the routine of it meant that sometimes it did and he knew it was then going to be dinner). It was usually a sensory thing like play doh or kinetic sand. He's quite tired since starting school so he usually has the iPad now but I'm hoping to go back to that at some point.

It helps with my DD when I use timers, e.g., I tell her I'm going to put a timer on and play with her for 15 minutes and then I'm going to put a timer on for 15 minutes and she'll need to play by herself during that time while I put on a load of washing (for example) and then I'll be able to play again. (15 mins example length of time). Something you could try? No idea if will be helpful / work with possibility of SEND that's been discussed though.

It's not unreasonable or unrealistic, because when we were kids we did it. For hours sometimes. It just wasn't an expectation that our parents entertained us 24/7. Unfortunately, it seems that something we've done has made this generation unwilling to do it, I don't know what that is or I would have avoided it.

I have a (just turned) five year old. She has a big brother, so not having to occupy herself so much but she will definitely allow me 20 minutes to shower and get dressed. I may have to direct her a bit from the shower - "I'll pop that dress on your doll when I get out."/"Your new Lego is on the window sill." Sometimes she'll play for half an hour in a make believe world but not often. She'll do crafts for 45 minutes but she will need input every five minutes to keep her going. Same with dancing to Siri tunes. The largest chunks of self-directed play are outdoors with other kids but then, you know, I am sitting outdoors too! Your child sounds normal to me. My five year old needs a lot of cuddles, chats, check-ins etc. We let her watch video while we make dinner. That gives us a good chunk of time (for chores!).

I came on to say DD is similar but actually nowhere near the same level as your ds. She will watch tv and have iPad occasionally. I really feel for you as I am fairly drained by DD's neediness

YANBU to want time to yourself and definitely feels like he should be able to entertain himself for some time. My DC is just turned 6, only child and has pretty much been occupying themselves since they opened the first toy yesterday. Had to drag DC out of their room for meals because too busy playing. I realize my DC is kind of strange though!

I agree with all of this.

DS1 was the same until age 8 when he discovered a love of Minecraft. He's since been diagnised with Aut/DHD. ExDH and I had to take turns in getting alone time in order for us to function properly. DS2 is NT and could occupy himself for short periods as soon as he was born! Or so it seemed in comparison. Feel for you, it's really tough when you don't get a second to yourself.

Next time he waits for d c to wake and takes him with
Orcomes back before he wakes
Why is it all on op?

"I say I want some time alone and he needs to occupy himself"

Unfortunately at age 5 he's likely experiencing this as "go away I don't like you".
The more he feels pushed away the more he will be upset and cling. Likewise "asking him to be in a different room".

Does your DH ever ask you to be in a different room because he tells you he "needs to be in a different room" from you?
How would that feel to you?

That's a separate conversation me and DH have already had now. School term time I wouldnt mind and he didn't clock on I'd be more drained in the hols. But I wanted to ask whether it was reasonable still at age 5 to be needing to take shifts etc

Yeh actually if me or DH need time to ourselves we just tell each other?
"Sorry I've had a really busy day and need a bit of time alone".
The sentence I wrote comes with lots of background on the differences between introverts and extroverts, that love is spending time together but that people need to feel comfortable in their bodies first, etc...dc is quite bright so he gets it...but perhaps emotionally it still feels like rejection...

Also I did the different room thing on the direction of the teachers who said he needs to learn to be away from me 🙈
I personally prefer "parallel play" as it feels like less of a leap

Perfectly normal to ask another adult for some space. If you take offence to that that's your problem.

There's a bluey episode where mum 'just needs 20 minutes' and the dad supports her with that. Watch that together and start feeding it in to your day? I've done that

Thanks it's good to know about the constant input needed every few minutes and that it's normal

Yeh this is what I feel! I remember my parents occupied with chores/work/napping while I played. We played together as a family too but not all day

I would start leaving him to occupy himself for 5 minutes with a timer, tell him not to interrupt you. And then build up. Most children have to learn to occupy themselves.

Yeh I do feel like when he learns how to read more fluently there will be a breakthrough...I think mornings are hardest for him (and me!) so I need to be more understanding of that window in the day...he's getting a lot better at other parts of the day

Oo thanks I'll take a look!

My eldest DD is like this. (Incidentally now being assessed for Autism/adhd). My youngest will happily occupy herself for 20 mins age 5.

The only way I had time to myself was to agree to play with her, start something together, then when she was engrossed pop off briefly (but not be far) and keep checking in. So could fit a shower in.

When I say “you go play, I’m doing X” it would cause a fight.
That said TV or a tablet would at least occupy her for 15 mins by 5, that’s quite unusual. if it’s the separation or rejection he’s bothered by I’d try those incremental minutes of nipping away whilst notionally being engaged together and build up.

But it’s hard. Some kids require so much more input !

Yeh...this was the parent I was trying to be and have completely failed 🙈😅

No way would my eldest play for 2 hours without interaction at that age. Even now (8) she'd play for about 45 minutes, and then want 5 minutes to tell me about her game, then go back to playing for another 45 minutes. she likes to check in with me. Isn't that normal? If DH and I are both in the house and at leisure we'd occasionally speak to each other. I think that's normal and polite.

Children without siblings are likely to want you for company now and then.

I just don't know. The nursery were concerned and we got referred to a paediatrician but they said they'd only assess at 5.5 as she didn't have concerns in the clinic. He can focus on conversations with adults and older kids, doesnt know how to interact with kids his own age (we're working on this but it's very "cognitive" for him where I feel like other kids just seem to know?)
He loves playing games like monopoly and cheat, he loves role play, reading books together, cutting paper, painting...
...he's our only child so I don't know how much we've been adapting without realising it

Yes some children could entertain themselves at 5. Yours can't so expecting it is unreasonable.

You need to tag team with your dh to carve out time for your self.

In terms of your son playing independently find solo activities he enjoys like the paper cutting. Role model the activity and support him to do it. When he is able to do it independently leave him a couple of minutes then return. Increase this gradually until you can leave him several minutes without him getting distressed. Then you have your break.

My son has asd he is nine he needs support with dressing, homework, playing games/crafts. He can do his switch, watchtv, eat and sleep independently . Most other things he needs support with.

Two hours would be the dream, but am wondering whether being left alone while I shower for 10-20 mins should cause such distress. And I'm happy with check ins, it's more that he wants long and constant conversing and gets distressed if I want to do something quietly (together or apart).

I was about for write this

Too many kids can't play alone as have never been left alone to play

Maybe I'm lucky but yes dd now 7 but from 18mths or so would happily play with toys alone for a while

Obv as got older she would play for longer

Can he read ? Dd loves reading and will often take her self off to playroom /bedroom and have a read to chill but I love reading and have read to her every day from Tiny