To just … not have toys?

[giveupontoys]

Obviously we’ll have to have some, but my DS(4) just doesn’t seem to play with them.

Christmas presents included a toy ice cream van and he just gets everything out and then it ends up discarded and thrown everywhere, so bits get lost and it’s unusable. This is the same as everything we get.

He has a few toy trucks / cars type things but doesn’t really seem to play with them.

I know people will say not to let him or to discipline him but he just ignores us … doesn’t solve anything.

I don’t know what to do really. It kind of seems pointless having toys if they end up unusable but on the other hand he has to have some things.

Reading this I'm wondering if the amount and type of toys are the biggest issue at the moment?

Could you put everything away and have literally 4 types of toys, each in their own basket for a little while?

If they get broken from being tipped are they maybe too fiddly / delicate?

The fact it can take an hour to tidy up makes me think there's just far too many?

It takes me two minutes to put away toys covering the rug into their baskets and so I'm wondering if you've simply got too much available. Likewise, if the bits are being tipped so violently that they're all going under couches and bookcases and getting lost it sounds like the sets are too complicated with too many little parts.

Could you start off really basic like:

1. A box of large building bricks (not little Lego things but the much larger foam bricks perhaps)
2. A box with a foldable car mat and three single toy cars
3. A box with the ice cream van and maybe two people and none of the extra bits to go with it?
4. A simple game like crocodile dentist (the kind where you press the teeth down instead of teeth that come out)

At this point, even if he tipped every single one of these on the floor it would be very quick to put them all away.

I totally get that you'd expect a four year old to be able to engage with toys but I wonder if this assumption has led you to sort of sit back and chill by yourself for a bit when the toys come out which has made him not want to play as he knows he will lose your attention?

In this case it's likely you can get to a point of independent play in the future but temporarily you will need to be heavily involved.

When you say you try to play and both get confused can you give an example of how you play and what you actually do when you sit down? Are there any friends or family members who visit the house and how does he respond if they try to engage in play with him?

Our pre-school playroom regularly looks like a bomb site. But all help to tidy up.

If you get the ice cream fuck out

cool typo

and he empties it all on the floor, then walks off, how long are you leaving it all there for it to get so trampled and broken and lost?

It really doesn’t take very long.

Why are people treading on them?

are we looking for an answer more detailed and thoughtful than ‘because I am a clumsy twat’?

What role does your partner have in playing and helping tidy up?

none

What does he say when you say ok let's tidy up now?

ignores me

What does he do instead?

climbs on something mostly

What is the consequence of him refusing to help tidy up?

Nothing really, which I know I’ll be judged to fuck for but nothing makes any difference. It’s easier to do it myself.

DS1 sounds like yours OP. He has basically never imagined in his life. We managed to capture on video the one time he did a voice for his truck, never did it before or again. He had buckets and buckets of Hotwheels and didn’t play with much else.

Until he discovered GAMES. Board games, card games, any sport, video games. I’d say he’s very playful. Just not imaginative play. He’ll do maths for fun, and other than that it’s games. Very very unlike his mother!

ETA - just seen update - emptying everything out because he’s very physical and DGAF about toys? Sounds fair enough tbh. YANBU to not have toys. Physical play is fine - making dens/soft play at home. When he’s older get him a Swedish ladder and chuck him outside on his bike. Tough for this type to be toddlers/young kids!

they’ve all been trodden on / kicked under bookcases / lost

This is what you need to change. You need one toy out at at time, always supervise the child, and tidy up after.
There should simply be no opportunity for stuff to get lost or kicked under bookcases: don't allow the child unsupervised free-reign when these toys with small bits are available.
They can have free access only to toys which are one large item, not bits.

You need to sometimes give him a chance to learn how to play with toys instead of just taking him out because its presumably easier just to go to the play park or do something physical.
Sit with him and model how to play with toys, build a big wooden train track or duplo model and talk to him as you do so, get him to pass you pieces or bricks, ask where he thinks you ought to play the next piece. Act out pretend scenarios, oh no! There's been a crash, the train's come off the tracks! Etc

Have you tried setting up a train set, farm set, garage etc the night before so it’s ready for him to play with straight away as he wakes up. I do it with my DC in the holidays sometimes. Stops them from getting distracted and wandering off when setting it up and engages them with playing for a bit.

I'd also challenge the idea that an ice cream van is unusable with no ice creams? Just the van itself and imagination is really enough and sometimes I wonder if the sets with so many little bits are actually not helpful for imagination.

It sounds like sets getting separated or losing bits of sets causes you a lot of stress and so perhaps it would be good to avoid these kinds of toys until the both of you become more comfortable with playing?

You need to lift him off whatever he's climbing, lead him over to what's on the floor. Guide his hand with yours to the items, show him how to pick them up and place in a box. Don't let him just go again and climb, keep lifting him back down firmly 'we are tidying now not climbing'.
Tbh it sounds like just need to get more involved, get down on the floor with your child and actually parent

If anyone’s ND it’s OP based on these comments.

Ruin is a strong word for that. The next playtime the ice cream truck sells fewer types of ice cream but also a toy lettuce, a yellow block "bread roll" and books as it is a mobile library ice cream van... Many kids love that kind of imaginative mixing, the toy doesn't have to be the way the adults designed it. The ice creams can return next time you clean under the sofa...

But maybe he's just not into imaginative play, it's okay to focus on other things.

Does DS like drawing OP? We have just bought one of these for Christmas - basically colour it in, stick things on it, play with it until it’s crumpled and then can be recycled.

https://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/colour-in-cardboard-rocket/6746551000.html

My DS is 10 now and was just the same didn’t play with toys at all, I realised after a while his interest just didn’t include playing with toys but he loved to kick a football, throw a ball about and just generally be outside.

Ah op you sound like me with my kids. None of us could do imaginative play or toys. The house was always a tip. One of my kids liked to organise and order things and come up with rules for invented games that never got played, the other liked to tear about, climb, hang upside down, throw himself off things etc.
It's got a lot easier now they're older as we all love board games and physical stuff like biking and bouldering, and we're extremely playful and joke around a lot, so we're still having fun.
And yes...all diagnosed ND.

But how can bits of a toy get lost or broken so quickly? I honestly don't remember ever losing a single component of a toy like that when my daughter was young - I sat on the floor and played with her and her toys and made sure that I pulled anything out that got knocked under a piece of furniture. I don't understand how toys are getting broken either - most children's toys are fairly robust and can withstand being dropped or sat on, and I would imagine that many things wouldn't be ruined if a small child stood on them indoors without shoes on.

If he likes climbing why not try soft play pieces or indoor climbing frame? They don't create much mess but in our house soft play is used to build dens or castles, slides, play the floor is lava, an assault course. Our girls are 2 and 5 and they both love them! Our nephew and niece who are now 8 also still love to play on them when they come round

https://www.softplay2you.co.uk/product/v-11-block-set-white-grey/?utmterm=&utmmcampaign=Pmax+UK+Shopp+SP2Y&utmsource=adwords&utmmmedium=ppc&hsaacc=9121211327&hsaacam=13159897148&hsagrp=&hsaaad=&hsasrc=x&hsaatgt=&hsakw=&hsaamt=&hsanet=adwords&hsaaver=3&gadsource=1&gbraid=0AAAAADx450d7vZLvRdnVIxTXjDNVTKs4h&gclid=CjwKCAiAmrS7BhBJEiwAei59i16mNa2HdE1JlhEOFP7ujVVCfpNMLOQOceC220fgK98cd5zUxM-8BoCyfgQAvDD_BwE

We also use the ikea kallax boxes to store things like mega blocks, building blocks, play food, etc so they can just be emptied out, played with and then easily tidied away.

Haha well I bet it feels like an ice cream fuck when it's all over the floor 🤣🤣

Ok so the main issue is your partner is bloody useless.

I know you mentioned too small rooms so it's definitely worth thinking about blocking up the scatter holes - the fronts of sofas and bookcases etc. or invest in a long stick to drag it under as it doesn't sound like there's space to move the furniture more.

Is it possible to limit play to rooms that ZZ z up, having twins helps cos I make it competitive. Who does this first gets a kiss, a raspberry on their belly etc

I'd also forget To rotate toys so I'd just try and reduce them down. Were trying with mid Dec birthdays, it's depressing what hasn't been played with but passing it on if decent helps.

If bots of toys get lost they just play without it. Fewer ice cream choices, it becomes a teddy transport van etc.

I wouldn't fret over ND. Plenty of ND kids play normally with toys & plenty of NT kids have odd habits/interests.
If he's interacting well with other kids & nursery/school aren't concerned then don't pressure him into playing the 'correct way'

My asd kids just liked opening the boxes, tipping everything out, then moving to the next box/ drawer to empty out. 0 imagination.

Surely it's not that hard to imagine? Some of us have calm children who sit and play and some of us.....don't!

Also, we have the Melissa and Doug ice cream shop, the kids love it. If bits go missing and they aren't put back, I don't hunt for them. I wait until they ask where something has gone, and we have a game of find the "ice cream cone" or whatever!

Kids make mess, doesn't mean we take their things away. If we did, how would they learn to take care of their stuff?

Apologies for not having time to read the whole thread before replying but two massive things jump out to me here after reading the first 2 pages:-

1. How is he suppose to know how to play with an ice cream truck if you haven't shown him? Many children need to be 'taught' how to play. If you're not willing to get down on the floor and engage with him, how do you expect him to know what to do? Don't just dismiss the notion with "I don't know how". If you don't know then he certainly won't. Learn together! You at least have the life experience to know how nice cream trucks work. He doesn't, unless shown. Pick up his toys, talk through what you're doing with them, make up storylines etc. You may find he takes your lead and joins in. You may even enjoy yourself! Even if you don't and it's your idea of hell, it's something you need to suck up for the sake of your child. So many people sadly don't play with their children for fear of feeling silly. If that's the case you just need to get over yourself I'm afraid. Literally nobody is watching apart from your child and, far from judging you, he'll be learning from you.

2. You need to expect mess I'm afraid. Tipping out all the contents is part of the play. Most children make some form of mess when playing. If you're getting stressed by the notion of mess, he's picking up on that and is perhaps put off the idea of actually playing with the pieces. He wants to explore it all, to see what he's got. If you're stressing the moment it all comes out, it takes all the fun out of it. Let him make mess. As long as you teach him to tidy it all up when he's finished, what's the big deal? Too many parents sadly seem to want show homes where their children neatly fit in without much evidence that they or their toys are there. That's not realistic. If you have young children, you're going to have to expect there to some form of toy mess while they're actually awake and playing I'm afraid. A tidy house is for bedtime. An immaculate house, while children are awake, is a childhood being wasted imo. Too many children these days are sat on devices while their parents enjoy a mess free home. You need to reevaluate your priorities if you value a tidy house over your child being able to freely play.

I totally agree with those saying you need to try a variety of toys. Not every child will be in to imaginative small world or role play toys. Playdough, construction such as duplo or magnetic blocks, sand/water play, crafts, dressing up, jigsaws etc may be far more up his street and may appeal more to you too in terms of playing with him? Many adults hate tedious imaginative role play but find it much more enjoyable to colour with their child, make models, play simple board games etc.

He sounds very similar to my oldest. At 4 he still needed a lot of support and guidance in knowing what to actually do with his toys. He has never been into imaginative role play style games- he would have treated an ice cream truck toy in a very similar way I suspect. In an ideal world I fee some sort of toy rotation system would have worked well for him but I am far too disorganised to do it (and also have no space to store stuff!).
what has been worked well for us is tidying everything away at the end of the day, I have big A3 pencil case type things to try and keep sets together as much as possible and keep them out of sight. Getting one toy out after bed time and leaving it out as an ‘invitation to play’, eg partially setting up the train set. It is only now he is nearly 7 he is starting to take more responsibility for play and tidying.
in contrast my 4 year old would spend hours doing imaginative play and role play, and would definitely absolutely love a toy ice cream truck! All kids are different!

I've read all of OP posts. I think your expectations are too high. Just because your other child did play and tidy doesn't mean your DS at 4 will. It's like one child eating anything and one being a fussy eater, but both parented the same way.
My DS used to take random toys and make a line of them round the room and that was it. In reception class he didn't go in the craft corner and was mostly outside with a TA playing with sand and water. Like a PP's child, he liked outside and balls. Fast forward to at uni now. Loads of friends, plays multiple sports and has a p/t bar job.

Have a look a play schemas a lot of boring weird actions that don't look fun are play. It's easier then to find things they enjoy because you understand the motivation/ what they enjoy in the actions they do - like emptying.