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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Colleague has complained about me using wrong pronouns

847 replies

CandyCane103 · 06/12/2024 09:23

Name changed but have been on mn for a fair while now.

I work in a role which requires me to do casework supporting vulnerable people. I am supporting a member of staff with some cases that fall under my specialism. We've always got along well and I've really enjoyed working with her. I've been here a number of years, she is 6 months in. One of her cases is a non binary person, and she emails me occasionally for advice as it is a long and complex case (has been ongoing for months now since before she joined the team). I usually get it right but have occasionally written 'she' by accident. They have a female name and I am not intentionally using 'she', it just naturally happens. Instead of speaking to me about it, she has made a complaint to my line manager, who has had a word. Line manager was fine about it and it wasn't a telling off. More of a passing on a message.

Now feels very awkward and think my line managers advice to her was that she should speak to me in the first instance. I really want to raise with my colleague that she should have spoken to me instead of running straight to my line manager. Not sure how to handle this as I've never had a complaint from a member of staff and it has ruffled my feathers.

Would you just leave it be?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
9
TheKeatingFive · 08/12/2024 10:11

Ultimately, if you want people to upend centuries of convention around use of pronouns, you have to state and win the argument around why that's better. For society as a whole, not just one small group.

'Do as I say otherwise you're a bigot' is not good enough. That's just bullying.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/12/2024 10:24

Quite @TheKeatingFive

CocoapuffPuff · 08/12/2024 11:31

I'm not going to mangle my native language because someone else says it'll upset them if I don't. But to be honest, it doesn't sound like the OP intended to take a stance, she intended follow the clients preferences, she just made a mistake. The issue afaics is that the colleague blew it up, out of proportion.
In this case, it seems to be very much a power play by a junior colleague - a great big slap as "punishment" rather than a gentle reminder. That's the true unpleasantness here. Its a shame that authoritarianism seems to be the instinctual response by that group, but I think that reflects the immaturity and emotional backwardness we see every day. It's an adult version of toddler tantrums and by god is it tiresome.

Errors · 08/12/2024 13:29

TheKeatingFive · 08/12/2024 10:11

Ultimately, if you want people to upend centuries of convention around use of pronouns, you have to state and win the argument around why that's better. For society as a whole, not just one small group.

'Do as I say otherwise you're a bigot' is not good enough. That's just bullying.

This completely.
I wouldn’t ever purposefully misgender someone but it’s so easy to make a mistake. It would put me off speaking to anyone who has ‘preferred pronouns’ because I can’t be arsed with the angst it causes

VegTrug · 08/12/2024 14:00

@TheKeatingFive Well said 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

twinklystar23 · 08/12/2024 14:31

Could be difficult OP if this is your specialism try to be aware of where you are reiterating previous advice surely after six months she should not need ongoing support or maybe her case transferred to another colleague?
Yes keep it all proffessional surely your own (heav caseload is your responsibility?

IdylicDay · 08/12/2024 23:19

Cheesytoastie · 07/12/2024 13:13

I don't fancy getting into a ruckus with angry women insulting me no.

That's exactly what has happened every time someone has answered any of the questions posed by the attack squad here.

The vitriol has chased away anyone who disagrees with you and shut down the conversation, well done!

angry women

Charming. That reads like something a misogynist male would say.

Do you really think women don't have the right to be angry?

Eviolle · 08/12/2024 23:34

This happened in my (previous) place of work too, where we only had female patients and then suddenly had an influx of nonbinary they/them patients or trans patients requesting he/him.

It took a while to stop automatically saying "she" for every patient.

It happens, it's understandable. I'd just let it go.

GotToGetDinner · 08/12/2024 23:36

FusionChefGeoff · 06/12/2024 09:30

As above! 'It's quicker and easier for me to correct myself if you just tell me when you spot a mistake'.

Sounds nice and unconfrontational

I.agree with this

GotToGetDinner · 08/12/2024 23:39

It's a huge pet hate or mine when someone goes to management and doesn't address something directly with me. Drives me nuts.

IdylicDay · 08/12/2024 23:52

Cheesytoastie · 07/12/2024 18:48

It's more like "Decapitate TERFs" Vs "They're all mentally ill, they're predators and criminals, i'll misgender them on purpose because I know it upsets them, ostracise them at work" though isn't it? It's not just "we don't get it".

I'm not saying that the name calling and aggression is equal. But two wrongs don't make a right. And you're never going to convert people to your cause by being nasty to people who haven't even threatened you, just disagreed with you like on this thread.

Surely it's also obvious that not all trans or non binary people are like the ones saying decapitate TERFs, there are extremists in every class of people, we don't hate all men because of incels do we? Most non binary/trans people are just normal people who wish you no harm and want to be treated with respect and dignity which is often denied them. Oppression often leads to radicalisation.

Unsurprisingly, when people like this are challenged they retort with they hate us and want to deny us our rights so fuck them. It goes about as well as asking any minority to be nice to the people who hate them simply for what they are.

I condemn bad behaviour on both sides and there is certainly bad behaviour here as pointed out by many posters not just me.

I've said my piece. As I said I have no intention to argue with you all. I don't care if you disagree.

So you read GC people understandably being angry because our rights are removed, and then sided with the other mob? Because we are angry? But the other mob give us rape threats and death threats, and you didn't turn away from them and side with us?

Make it make sense. You're being hypocritical and not making sense. Rape threats and death threats (all of which no GC has ever given as we don't go around threatening to rape other women) weren't enough to stop you siding with them? Baloney.

Its women that are oppressed. Male in dresses are not 'oppressed'. Males are the oppressor sex class, in or out of a dress or suit and tie. Its taking the piss and absolutely fucking insulting to say that males feel 'oppressed' so their anger is justifiable. But ours isn't.

GoldsolesLugs · 08/12/2024 23:57

CocoapuffPuff · 08/12/2024 11:31

I'm not going to mangle my native language because someone else says it'll upset them if I don't. But to be honest, it doesn't sound like the OP intended to take a stance, she intended follow the clients preferences, she just made a mistake. The issue afaics is that the colleague blew it up, out of proportion.
In this case, it seems to be very much a power play by a junior colleague - a great big slap as "punishment" rather than a gentle reminder. That's the true unpleasantness here. Its a shame that authoritarianism seems to be the instinctual response by that group, but I think that reflects the immaturity and emotional backwardness we see every day. It's an adult version of toddler tantrums and by god is it tiresome.

Edited

You will happily mangle your native language to post on mumsnet though.
The following might be helpful:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma

IdylicDay · 09/12/2024 00:02

Cheesytoastie · 07/12/2024 23:34

Those statements are all true.

Anyone disagreeing with the gender critical mob gets a mouthful.

It's happened time and again on this thread and countless threads like it. Rise to the bait and actually get angry and posts start getting deleted left right and centre and anyone defending non binary/trans people with too much zeal gets banned. I've seen it over and over, which is why I'm refusing to argue with you. You can pretend that's not what happens all you like, but it is true.

One poster stated that it is kind and respectful to use people's chosen pronouns and to deliberately not do it to prove a point is hurtful. A fair point. But she got a torrent of abuse for it and now people are apologising to the poster who hurled the abuse? Amazing. Yes she gave a snarky reply, hardly surprising considering what was barked at her.

Those statements are all true.

And everything we've all said is true, too.

Cheesytoastie · 09/12/2024 00:10

Ereshkigalangcleg · 07/12/2024 23:43

I'm not going to indulge your DARVO derailing any further.

You're finally going to leave me alone then? Great!

SorcererGaheris · 09/12/2024 00:54

SerenePeach · 06/12/2024 13:43

I would say the vast minority of discussion on this thread is about the colleagues behaviour.

The majority of discussion on this thread is about how stupid non binary people are, how society has gone mad and lots of advice to bully this woman to put her in her placeqnd ice out the non binary person to make sure they know OP disapproves of them, because they are activists/have an agenda/whatever other made up shit people have decided the NB person to be. Despite never meeting them and not knowing anything about them. So yes I would call that hated. A thread about behaviour has been completely derailed to a thread about gender and how much mumsnetters hate anything to do with gender or language. Again.

The butter wouldn't melt "we don't hate people we're just having a discussion" claims don't wash. You have a problem with non binary people. Just own it.

@SerenePeach You say that some people have suggested that the OP "ice out the non binary person."

As far, as I can see, no one has recommended that the OP ice out the person who is non-binary. People have suggested that the OP freeze out her colleague who reported her. The colleague is not the non-binary person. The non-binary individual is a client who has nothing to do with this situation themselves.

I am personally in full agreement that people should do their best to use other people's preferred pronouns because I think it's an issue of basic respect/good manners. However, I also realise that people can be doing their best and still make mistakes by accident. People err without meaning to, it's only human.

The OP has stated that her referral of the client as a "she" was a genuine accident. So I can understand why people think that the colleague reporting this to the line manager was over-the-top or unnecessarily harsh.

StiffyByngsDogBartholomew · 09/12/2024 01:01

I would want to change all my pronouns to something ridiculous abd then when she gets it wrong you can return the favour.

DissidentDaughter · 09/12/2024 02:29

Genuinely puzzled by @SorcererGaheris pronouncement that “I am personally in full agreement that people should do their best to use other people's preferred pronouns because I think it's an issue of basic respect/good manners.”

Obviously you’re entitled to your opinion, but this sounds like a directive, loaded with your own subjective moral value/judgment. You cannot ‘consent’ on my behalf.

As for ‘erring’ I’m not easily spooked by authoritarian reframing (probably explains why I don’t fall for the insistent Black Friday advertising nonsense lol).

In the meantime, the Equality Act protects both your beliefs and mine.

MrBungle · 09/12/2024 06:28

Cheesytoastie · 09/12/2024 00:10

You're finally going to leave me alone then? Great!

Address the points above. Like why did you side against women because they are angry?

Poppins21 · 09/12/2024 06:31

xILikeJamx · 06/12/2024 09:31

Just leave it.

Your manager seems to have dealt with it the right way - informally - and politely told your colleague not to do that again. No point making any more out of it

Be on the look out for anything your colleague does wrong and return the favour?

TheKeatingFive · 09/12/2024 07:30

It's women that are oppressed. Male in dresses are not 'oppressed'. Males are the oppressor sex class, in or out of a dress or suit and tie. Its taking the piss and absolutely fucking insulting to say that males feel 'oppressed' so their anger is justifiable. But ours isn't.

I don't understand how @Cheesytoastie is fronting this position with a straight face. The hypocrisy is off the charts.

Teateaandmoretea · 09/12/2024 07:58

DissidentDaughter · 09/12/2024 02:29

Genuinely puzzled by @SorcererGaheris pronouncement that “I am personally in full agreement that people should do their best to use other people's preferred pronouns because I think it's an issue of basic respect/good manners.”

Obviously you’re entitled to your opinion, but this sounds like a directive, loaded with your own subjective moral value/judgment. You cannot ‘consent’ on my behalf.

As for ‘erring’ I’m not easily spooked by authoritarian reframing (probably explains why I don’t fall for the insistent Black Friday advertising nonsense lol).

In the meantime, the Equality Act protects both your beliefs and mine.

No it doesn’t it quite clearly says it is her personal belief.

Teateaandmoretea · 09/12/2024 07:59

GotToGetDinner · 08/12/2024 23:39

It's a huge pet hate or mine when someone goes to management and doesn't address something directly with me. Drives me nuts.

Are you very young? It’s a very odd thing to get so wound up about.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/12/2024 08:07

Teateaandmoretea · 09/12/2024 07:59

Are you very young? It’s a very odd thing to get so wound up about.

Edited

Very young?

I'm nearly 40 and I would be more likely to assume that someone who was incapable of using their words and saying, "I just noticed that you referred to this service user as "she" but they identify as non binary and prefer to be referred to as "they", do you think you could change it?" but instead felt the need to go running to the manager was "very young".

I'd be deeply irritated by it too and I'd want to say, "We're not in primary school, you don't need to go running to the teacher as soon as there is the smallest problem. We are both adults and can resolve these things between ourselves."

Londonrach1 · 09/12/2024 08:10

I'd leave it but wouldn't ever trust colleague now.

Teateaandmoretea · 09/12/2024 08:13

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 09/12/2024 08:07

Very young?

I'm nearly 40 and I would be more likely to assume that someone who was incapable of using their words and saying, "I just noticed that you referred to this service user as "she" but they identify as non binary and prefer to be referred to as "they", do you think you could change it?" but instead felt the need to go running to the manager was "very young".

I'd be deeply irritated by it too and I'd want to say, "We're not in primary school, you don't need to go running to the teacher as soon as there is the smallest problem. We are both adults and can resolve these things between ourselves."

People are perfectly entitled at work to talk to a manager if they feel more comfortable doing so.

Maybe because I am a manager and care about my team I can see that better. If a member of my team or a peer had an issue with me that they couldn’t tackle directly I would encourage them to talk to my manager. She would listen to them and we’d work out a way forward.

Work isn’t some weird hierarchical battle of egos, everyone gets things wrong.

It baffles me frankly the responses to this thread, maybe we have a particularly open culture.

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