To think this attack on London Jewish schoolchildren should have been headline news

[ThisPerkySheep]

I have been waiting for this story to go mainstream, and I’m shocked that it hasn’t.

So far, it seems only the Daily Mail has reported on it - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14142235/amp/Jewish-children-terrified-thugs-London-bus-rocks-Israel.html.

When are we going to start taking the threats against Jews in the UK seriously and actually do something about it?

I think it was my post where I said anti semetism often comes from a different demographic of people than some other types of racism. At no point did I say that anti semetism is worse than other kinds of racism. I would actually never say that. I'm a secular non practising Jew with mixed race DC...I'm sure you can imagine I'm concerned about all types of racism equally. I am well aware that as a white British secular woman that affords me some protection from anti semetism. No one knows my Jewish heritage unless I actually tell them... although this has meant in the past I have heard people express some vile view on Jewish people assuming that I'm not and will nod along.

I was responding to a poster who described her area as very liberal and diverse who said it would probably be very welcoming to Jewish people. I was making the point that actually often anti semetism comes from people who are on the left, liberal types. I am honestly baffled as to how that was interpreted as me saying that Jewish people have it worse. I was just saying that for Jewish people living in areas like that may not necessarily be the answer.

Thanks to the poster who defended my point....wow, some of you were up early/late depending on how you see it!

The way in which you made the comparison could and was interpreted by me, a Black woman, to be offensive. I explained the reason why. (Well allowed Chat GPT to) It summed up the essence of what I was thinking and I stand by it.

The hierarchical nature of the comparison IS indefensible IMO as a Black woman. Context is everything.

All you have done is double down on who you are. Nice.

For you @Comedycook and @Socrateswasrightaboutvoting

I just had an interesting thought: I wondered what ChatGPT would say in answer to the question "Is it racist to believe that antisemitism sometimes comes from a different demographic than other forms of racism?"

Lo and behold, look what it said (I have put some important points in bold):

Believing that antisemitism sometimes comes from different demographics than other forms of racism is not inherently racist. In fact, it can be a legitimate observation rooted in the distinct historical and social dynamics of antisemitism.
^^
Antisemitism has a long and complex history, and it often manifests in particular ways that differ from other forms of racism. For example, it may stem from both traditional religious prejudice and modern political or ideological sources, and it has been historically perpetuated by different groups at different times (e.g., European Christian societies, various political ideologies, and even contemporary far-right and far-left movements). As a result, some people argue that antisemitism has unique features that make it different from other racial prejudices.
^^
However, it’s important to approach this distinction carefully. Acknowledging that antisemitism can come from different sources or demographics does not justify or minimize the severity of racism in general, nor does it imply that any particular group is more or less racist than others. It should be framed within the context of a broader commitment to combating all forms of racism and discrimination.
^^
In short, recognizing that antisemitism may come from specific demographics doesn’t itself constitute racism, but it’s essential to ensure the conversation is respectful, avoids stereotypes, and remains focused on addressing all forms of bigotry.

Well well well!

As I have not seen anyone on this thread try to justify or minimise the severity of racism in general, or imply that any particular group is more or less racist than others, or use stereotypes etc., that seems to settle the issue, doesn’t it (for anyone thinking ChatGPT is the ultimate arbiter, anyway)?

@Socrateswasrightaboutvoting : do you agree?

On what exactly do you base your opinion that anything in this thread showed "the hierarchical nature of the comparison"?

Do tell me if I am wrong but I can’t see anything remotely suggesting that. In the absence of any such evidence, it would seem to be something you are imputing to others on the basis of simply your own wish to perceive them as racists. Nice.

<<Yawn>>

I take it that means that you have no evidence to justify your unpleasant assertion, but don’t have the honesty or decency to say so.

I hope everything is going well for you. Have a lovely weekend.

Hopefully the scumbags get locked up.

As the ‘scumbags’
were children, and the facts have yet to be established I think that highly unlikely.

If the facts are proved I think they should be treated just as severely and publicly as the Southport related rioters (which was not very punitively in the cases of children), and for the same reasons. But there is definitely a school of thought that says anti-semitic incidents should not be publicised too much to avoid copycat attacks. I expect there is a national policy on this, and the Jewish community has an input into that policy. So people who think it is the wrong policy to downplay such things need to say so to community leaders.

I expect it’s got nothing to do with national policy, and more the fact that it may have been nothing much more than a spat between 2 rival schools - despite the language used.

Once an investigation has been undertaken the facts will come out, and if it was a hate crime then the culprits will be dealt with. Buses have excellent CCTV, the children will all be identifiable by school uniform.

Right now the only actual report of via the JC which is hardly an unbiased outlet.

It was mainstream news. You have posted from a mainstream outlet.

Some people will go to ridiculous lengths to deny antisemitism. People shouted "Fuck Israel" and attacked her because they were simply children from a rival school, can't possibly be antisemitic scumbags. I'm sure the reason Jewish schools have so much security is because other schools might spat with them.

Paddymcpaddy · Today 12:24
I expect it’s got nothing to do with national policy, and more the fact that it may have been nothing much more than a spat between 2 rival schools - despite the language used

Getting on a school bus of kids from a Jewish school and yelling “F Israel”, then getting on the bus to carry on shouting antisemitic insults, is nothing to do with rivalry. It’s antisemitic hate crime. If someone hurled rocks at a school bus of kids from an Islamic school and yelled ‘F Palestine’ , then got on the bus and continued making Islamophobic insults, that would be Islamophobic hate crime. Let’s just stop downplaying it because it happened to Jewish kids, and call it what it was.

Good point. However bad it is to throw things and shout at kids on a his, it is worse because the ‘thugs’ went onto the bus and threw things and shouted.

No matter who the children (because they are children) this kind of abuse is unacceptable. We live in a democratic country and I for one will always stand up against any kind of discrimination or abuse (and have).

What happened to these Jewish children is abhorrent. The deflection and desire to minimise by other continent conflicts which have no direct responsibility of children in the UK is the definition of disgusting.

i seriously worry about those who in any way try to justify by deflection or ridiculous responsibility placement.

Daily Mail is now reporting. I would suggest that the JC got the sorry first as it is mostly likely closer to the issue and other outlets have started to pick it up.

Deflection isn’t necessarily going to road to being right.

Completely agree. I don’t like Diane Abbot per se but he’s not because of her politics and political views and nothing to do with her being Black or a woman.

Britain is not a welcoming place. Brexit made it worse as has other conflicts around the world.

I am a foreign, white, native English speaker and encounter prejudice on a very regular basis. Very regular basis. Let that sink in. Every time it happens I think about how it is a drop in the ocean to what others have to deal with. I can only imagine.

I’m not. And if it was a racist attack And the only actual report was from a very biased source I would be saying the same.
The JC just can’t be trusted to report properly anymore, many of their own columnists recently quit because of their bias.
THe OPs original question was why isn’t this headline news - and the answer may be because there isn’t actually a headline yet.
When the police investigate and find that what JC are saying is true, THEN it’s a headline.

‘Some of you aren't even pretending to hide it anymore.’

I’d be saying EXACTLY the same if it was Muslim kids and Jewish kids allegedly doing this, or Catholic kids allegedly attacking Protestant kids, or white kids in black kids, or black kids on Asian kids etc etc etc
It’s not news because the facts haven’t been established. It’s all alleged.

when I was a teen I was at faith grammar school. The kids from the local opposite faith secondary school used to yell at us, call names etc sometimes throw stuff. All very sectarian.
It came to a head one winter when they ‘attacked’ a load of kids with snowballs, and it got rough.

The schools got our year and their equivalent together in a school hall to talk to us all. This went in weekly for a while. It turned out that they didn’t actually care that we were the other faith. They thought we were ‘posh’ and nerds because it was a grammar. We weren’t really either. It wasn’t really about religion. It was one uniform and the other, us and them.

30 years later the two schools still have regular politics, history. Community meetings together

things aren’t always what they seem.

@Paddymcpaddy
It doesn't matter even if it was "just" rivalry between two schools - surely you can see that it was racism??? Racism is racism, even if that racism started out as rivalry. And racism is unacceptable even if it is coming from rival school children. Unless you think the video evidence is inaccurate and they didn't shout racist abuse?

This was a racist attack by racists against Jewish school children on a school bus. Which school the racists attend is completely irrelevant as no rivalry should ever resort to racism. It's really not that complicated or worth trying to defend.

yes of course it should be headline news antisemitism is not acceptable

regardless of your beliefs around the actions of Israeli government

@Paddymcpaddy
Maybe try watching the videos the racists themselves recorded since you seem unwilling to believe the victims