My town has really changed

[CatbellsOnTheSeashore]

In a confusing and not very pleasant way.

It was gradually changing for the worse before covid, but the pandemic seemed to accelerate it, and I am wondering if anyone else has noticed anything like this.

It became more insular whilst more populated, the population increased quite a bit over the past 5 yrs. More and more dereliction, low council maintenance and an influx of troubled people housed around the town centre, which is now a no-go zone. Areas surrounding have steadily grown worse also, as it seems to be spilling out.

What does feel really different is that there are now lots of groups of men, hanging around drinking or sat on pavements together (not begging). Drugs took over the local nature paths and canal walks so now there are large groups of people out of their heads lying on old sofas at the locks, it's really grim. Women who used to cycle and run in these areas have more or less moved elsewhere or stopped.

More and more standard sized houses in low to middle income areas are becoming HMO's, yet with poor refuse organisation and not enough parking. I'm not exaggerating when I say there are literally trails of dog shit in the streets in many areas, too, which pretty much hangs in the air and the place stinks. That, and skunk.

We live in a decent part of town but it is coming closer, and I only have that perk due to inheriting my parents bungalow. More and more people are moving out.

On a walk to Sainsbury's yesterday two guys were holding onto a sign pole hovering over a bin. As I passed by one of them vomited into the bin and then spat/gobbed an inch from my feet - he didn't notice me particularly, but it was quite sudden or I'd have given them a wide berth.
This isn't unusual now.

I know people usually blame the cost of living and covid, etc, but this was definitely on the rise before. There is far more noise pollution as more buildings go up, usually industrial, and the roads are a nightmare. Infrastructure for actual people is decreasing.
That said, I don't think most of these people were thriving before, so it isn't a sudden change. It is as if a new kind of culture is growing, that doesn't care a damn about anything. Everything is vandalised or shat on. More and more windows are broken in properties close to the town centre, and I doubt most of these people were thriving before the pandemic hit.

Is this bad luck or is anything like it happening elsewhere?
We are definitely looking to move away.

Was that ‘Levelling Up’ money? If it was central government decided what it had to be spent on, local council had no say. It was take the money for pavements and road realignments or get nowt.

Yep, my small city has really gone downhill in the past few years due to lots of the bigger shops closing, more people wandering around with drink/drug/mental health problems, lots of people now living in shop doorways, the council constantly increasing parking fees and putting double yellow lines everywhere, which deters people from coming in.

Something about it just isn't nice so I rarely go into the centre. There's not many good shops left either (lots of empty shops or vaping shops).

Fact is we've only had 'uncontrolled immigration' when we had open border with EU citizens, since Brexit we haven't and its been the highest immigraiton in history, over 85% of it legal migration through visa's.

Crime and poverty are a home grown problem with the decimation of support for the working class and poor, it started with Thatcher , continued with Blair and got worse over the last 14 years ago. A culture of individualism that condems poor people as lazy or feckless.

Poor education, a media that encourages us to blame everyone except ourselves for the state of the country- illegal immigrants, legal immigrants, asylum seekers , all have merged into a great 'other' and we can blame the lack of housing , crime , child abuse, all at their door.

Its a road to nowhere and allows a culture amongst the native people of this country - non-responsibility for all the shit we are wadding in..

Well maybe it's different in your area but round here someone on out of work benefits can afford new clothes for them and kids, food, heating and holidays, TV subscription, phone contract. Similar to what someone on a low paid job would hope to afford in fact. Plus someone who doesn't work gets everything else free whereas the working person pays for their prescriptions, dentist, school meals etc.

To me out of work benefits should not stretch to luxuries, it should keep you off the street and fed and that's it.

Then you have about 20% of the working population also topped up with benefits, often to more than the average wage. This then ends up subsidising employers and landlords. But if the working person saves anything they lose their benefits so they're forever trapped in over priced rented accommodation.

It all means that work doesn't really pay and as a result education isn't valued either.

Not talking about disability benefits as that's a different issue but even there you have plenty of people claiming it for dubious mental health conditions such as anxiety that really just need a kick up the bum.

Never knew there were so many Wiganers on MN! Never nice to see your home slagged off, though.

Ah, if it's not the immigrants it's those on benefits... 🙄

Couldn't possibly be a market rigged to make the rich obscenely so and the poor as poor as possible without risking bloody revolution. Or politicians in it for the glamour and networking opportunities, with their own investment and property portfolios that they'redesperate to enhance. Oh no, couldn't possibly be any of that, could it?

I had a friend at university from Wigan and he was the nicest, kindest and most reliable friend I ever knew. That’s it. That’s all I know about Wigan and when your name comes up I think ‘ah, Dave P came from Wigan. Nice’.

MurdoMunro - no not levelling up money.

Sadly I think this decline you've described is becoming a general feature now, due to CoL crisis, reduction in public services etc and a general feeling of doom and gloom. It's really depressing to see 😣.
If you think the last 5 years have been grim, I think the next 5 years are likely to be worse.

You’re right - some play by the rules but our institutions are incapable of enforcing rule, so why would you follow rules?

I lived and worked in London borough of Newham when Labour were in government. It was still a shit hole then so can't say is simply due to Tories underfunding.

And with all this talk of poverty. Exactly how much money does it cost people to not drop crap on the floor or piss in the street? That's piss poor attitude and sod all to do with mobey

In dewsbury I say the tories have levelled down lol

Poverty has something to do with it and people with too much time on their hands but quite a lot has to do with the changing function of city centres. Far fewer dept stores, more cafes and boarded up shops.

Free school meals used to be for families with incomes lower than 16k now it's only 7.4k you have to be working an insanely small number of hours on minimum wage to only earn 7.4k.

In my opinion it should be raised back up to 16k.

Poor areas vote Labour and with poor areas is poverty.

That's no excusing anti-social behavour but it's a by-product of service cuts as well. Mess breeds mess when the council have less resources to keep roads clean; crime increases when police services are cut. It's all linked.

Newham was not a shit hole.

The town we used to live in became exactly the same. London councils were housing their homeless in the town as much cheaper than London. Lots of Victorian terraced houses became HMOs and the on-street parking became a nightmare. The change in the town over the last 5 years has been significant.

I think we start by getting out into the world and volunteering to do something- anything. Whether it’s helping with a community garden, running a youth club, reading with kids in school, working at a church food bank.
Also making sure city councillors and MOs are held to account. But we all have to take some personal responsibility to make it better. We can’t go down this road of each being individual units and staying in our bubble.

Fact is we've only had 'uncontrolled immigration' when we had open border with EU citizens, since Brexit we haven't and its been the highest immigraiton in history, over 85% of it legal migration through visa's.

Tbf Keir Starmer did just say we've been effectively running an open borders experiment over the last few years:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-immigration-figures-starmer-tories-b2655550.html

It will be interesting to see if he actually does anything about it though (highly unlikely)

I love this and I think you're right.

I’m in California, but the same thing happened to my sweet town.
It was a small farming town, surrounded by orchards and vineyards at the bottom of the Sierra Nevada mountains. In winter, it looks like you could reach out touch those glorious snow-capped mountains.
Maybe 5000 people. 3 elementary schools, 1 high school. 2 markets.
Then, Walmart (the huge chain owned by billionaires) built a gigantic “superstore” and within 2 months, all the sweet boutiques and shops closed and one market closed because they couldn’t compete. Now our once-sweet downtown looks like an abandoned ghost town.
The population swelled by 10,000 people.
We have to drive 7 miles to do a shop for decent veg & meat & fish.
Walmart’s parking lot is overflowing with every fast food restaurant known to mankind.
It sits on the road leading into town and is the ugliest welcome to visitors you’ve ever seen.
I hate Walmart. It laid waste to our beloved little town.

Well Said

Then you haven't travelled enough @Ablondiebutagoody

Whilst looking at houses in my humble price range, which is already some of the lowest in the U.K, I have seen some streets in such state & squalor that they almost resemble slums in ex-Soviet countries.

I opened the door to an alleyway in one house to see what's around the back alley (which estate agents always want to steer you away from).

It shocked even me. Weeds, rubbish flying, one or two things that looked like they could be pill wrappers, and sofas & chairs left to rot. It was almost like those 19th century sepia photographs of how streets used to look like in poverty.

The house next door was in such a state that I assumed it was derelict which could be a real problem. The roof of the old shed in the small back yard was totally caved in, and on top someone had strewn an old, now sodden mattress.

I was again shocked when I learnt it was lived in, and met the woman who rented the house and lived there with her young son.

We’re are a poorer country. We’re losing £100bn a year alone due to Brexit. Yet Farage is holding himself up as the answer to our problems. It’s madness but many will vote for him.

I don’t think the decline can be stopped as our non-don media are great at getting people to point fingers in the wrong direction whilst their friends strip the country bare.

We’ll end up with areas of the UK similar to Appalachia in America with endemic drug issues and poverty and no functioning health service or social services.