To be fed up of having to work Christmas because I don't have children

[boogiewoogie24]

I work in a 24/7 sector so christmas day is a normal working day.

This year we have a new manager and we've been told that apart from christmas day and boxing day, we have to work our normal shifts. Those 2 days, we have to work either christmas or boxing day

I work weds-sun one week and weds-fri the other, so never work Mon and Tues. I've been informed I'm working christmas eve, which is a Tuesday. Of the 3 people who normally work the Tuesday late shift, 2 have very young children so are being allowed to either finish early (normal finish time is 11pm) or just don't have to work. The other person has older kids so is happy to work as normal.
So I've been told I'm working the Tuesday until 11pm. I questioned why when I don't work Tuesdays. Response was "you don't have kids" yeah that'll be because I've had 3 miscarriages over 10 years of trying for a baby.
I'm one of only 3 people who work at my place who don't have children. The other 2 are only in their early 20s so plenty of time for them to have in future. I'm nearly 40.

I'm also having to work both christmas and boxing day because it's Jane's first christmas as a mum so she can have both days off and Jill's got her kids this year and last year they were at their dad's so she can have both days off, and Mary's family are in Scotland (we are south england) so she can have the 2 days off to visit them. No doubt Sue and Karen will go off sick like normal... you get the picture.

I'm rambling I know. But basically I'm being penalised for being unable to have children. It doesn't matter that I find christmas incredibly hard and painful.

I think it's wrong that employer's don't treat everyone fairly when it comes to time off at Christmas. It should be done on a rota. So everyone works some days but also gets some off. I feel for you.

It's about being kind and fair and decent, not just saying 'its my right so stuff you all...'

Well this is why I’d happily step up to work Christmas most years in my work place because the parents aren’t entitled and don’t say “it’s my right to have Christmas off so stuff you all non-parents”. If they did, I definitely wouldn’t be picking up the slack
on principle.

So just to be clear “being kind and fair and decent”” does NOT equal parents being entitled to have Christmas off as the default and that is what the issue is. That would be mean-spirited and insensitive cruel and narrow minded.

I'm single and childfree. By your reckoning of decency, I should spend Christmas alone. How is that fair?

I was going to post pretty much this!

I have voted YABU but only because I think people's personal circumstances should be taken into account when deciding who has Christmas off and I do generally think those with young children should get preference as should those with very old or ill parents. Of course we never know when it's someone's last Christmas but I think we can all look back on significant Christmases in our lives and appreciate that they were more important than others.

I think in the past when almost everyone had children then these kinds of scenarios seemed more equitable because everyone's time would come where they would be prioritised because they had children. Now that there are more child free people then I do think a special effort should be made to make sure they get a fair number of Christmases off but I do think those with genuine special need should be prioritised.

I’d expect them to work something as everyone does. If they’re childless they don’t need to be off Xmas morning to see if santas been so could do the Xmas Eve night shift or Xmas day early and then be up/home for the afternoon and evening with family.

with mention of the Army: in my day they asked about who wanted leave and tried to make sure that people with kids got time off on either of the "Christmas" days and prioritised single folk for NYE. But.

They also tried to be fair and turn and turn about (insofar as they may move mid year and get lumped with Christmas duties anyway).

And at lunchtime on Christmas day, the cookhouse opened for a special Christmas lunch, with a can of beer for everyone who wanted one, and the officers and Senior NCOs either stepped in to cover the duties (gate guard, communications centre, med centre etc) or put on their mess dress and waited on those who were eating the Full Traditional Christmas Dinner.

and nobody moaned. And we all had a lot of fun trying to splash gravy on the colonel.

I'd argue back. You don't work Tuesday so have already made your plans in advance and can't cancel. I'd stick to that line and cc in hr. You simply aren't available to work the Tuesday as you don't work Tiesdays for a reason.

Likewise, I think most single people would rather give the leave to the mum who has a newborn than take their Frist Christmas from them.

So now it's not just the childless/childfree who are less important that a baby, but single people too? I

I LOVE how you know what single and childless people want when you are neither.

It should be sorted out in a fair way.

But yabu to some extent because it's not just about who gets to have a nice time, childcare can be non existent over Christmas. Sometimes parents are simply unable to work because there's no school/nursery and no childcare.

OP said one of her colleagues has a newborn and another has her children this year and last year they were with her ex.

I would feel really mean being off knowing these colleagues had missed out. I can be off next year.

It's kinda me to do what's right. But if people are happy to have Christmas off knowing a mum will miss out on their first Christmas with their newborn, or knowing their colleagues kids won't get to see mum again this year. Then fine! Crack on. I'm glad OP isn't my colleague!

And do you think people with children will decide it’s the kind and decent thing to do is to allow Sandra to have Christmas off given that she has worked it for several years on the trot now? Because IME that does not happen. The kindness and decency only goes one way.

My family live 300 miles away. It's not one size fits all for those without children.

lack of childcare at Christmas - which often comes as a surprise to the colleagues with tiny children, having never listened to colleagues with children talking about it fir years - is not a reason to discriminate against other people.

Precisely. For example, I was single one year. Had to travel by train a few days before Christmas to get to my besties house who lives a few hours away and wasn’t able to get back via train until the 27th. So couldn’t work Christmas.

If I had worked Christmas I’d have came home to an empty house. I don’t necessarily mind that personally but many people do. How is that hard to understand?

Bottom line is everyone’s situation is unique and it shouldn’t be understood as the default that kids = getting Christmas off.

I think it’s very unfair you are expected to work Christmas because you don’t have children, and I say this as a Christmas lover with young DC. I don’t think it is right to assume you value time off over Christmas less just because you don’t have children. There needs to be a fairer more equitable system.

The fact that he has openly said to you that you don't get Christmas off because you don't have children should send you straight to HR if you have one.

All these posts about 'what I would do, because I'm a saint' are immaterial. He simply cannot allocate leave on this basis. It reminds me of the time I had a job interview in my late twenties, and was asked if I was likely to have children soon. At least that was back in the 1970s. In this day and age, it's simply not allowed, and neither is OP 's manager's statement.

What part of this do you struggle with? Spending time with family is a “special reason” and it also doesn’t matter if the person is sitting on the sofa in their pants eating chocolate.

And she doesn’t work a Tuesday normally so why should she apply for it off?

I am working Christmas Eve and day this year and my youngest is ten. I’ve been fortunate to have had many, many Christmas’s off and I can’t complain I’m working even though it’s my first post separation and I will hardly see my kids over Christmas. But when you work in an industry that require 24/7 cover then you can’t complain at working.

Well you just have to plan your travel, they come to you and arrive when you finish or you travel to them after work and spend Xmas night and Boxing Day with them. If you work in a 24/7 job it’s business as usual regardless of Xmas.

Report to HR. Seems fair that you work the days you would usually work. So if you are not, that would not be fair.

This is one of the reasons I left the NHS. Also weekend cover, every Saturday night and Sunday morning there’d be me and my gay colleague bonding over the assumption that we had nothing in our lives outside of work.
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I didn’t have the painful history you have either OP, but any time anyone said anything along the lines of it being fine because I had no children, I felt angry on behalf of those for whom that is a great sadness. I’m sorry your manager is such an insensitive arse. It does sound like an HR issue.

Like I said. If you are happy to let someone miss out on a first Christmas with their newborn, or for children to miss out on having Christmas with mum like they did last year because they were at dads, then fine! Crack on. It's your 'right'. I'm just saying I couldn't enjoy my day if this were me and I caused my colleagues to miss out.

No - the employee books time off work in the same way as anyone in the organisation.

'Not having children' is not a protected characteristic, so while it may not be morally fair (to some), it is not legally discrimination in and of itself.

If two employees worked at the same place in the same team for 10 years, one with kids and one without, you would obviously expect there to be some give and take it both wanted it off.

I do work in a 24/7 job and luckily my colleagues have a more benevolent attitude to Christmas duties, regardless of who has children and who doesn't.

How do you propose someone travel 300 miles on Christmas day also also be available for work?