To be fed up of having to work Christmas because I don't have children

[boogiewoogie24]

I work in a 24/7 sector so christmas day is a normal working day.

This year we have a new manager and we've been told that apart from christmas day and boxing day, we have to work our normal shifts. Those 2 days, we have to work either christmas or boxing day

I work weds-sun one week and weds-fri the other, so never work Mon and Tues. I've been informed I'm working christmas eve, which is a Tuesday. Of the 3 people who normally work the Tuesday late shift, 2 have very young children so are being allowed to either finish early (normal finish time is 11pm) or just don't have to work. The other person has older kids so is happy to work as normal.
So I've been told I'm working the Tuesday until 11pm. I questioned why when I don't work Tuesdays. Response was "you don't have kids" yeah that'll be because I've had 3 miscarriages over 10 years of trying for a baby.
I'm one of only 3 people who work at my place who don't have children. The other 2 are only in their early 20s so plenty of time for them to have in future. I'm nearly 40.

I'm also having to work both christmas and boxing day because it's Jane's first christmas as a mum so she can have both days off and Jill's got her kids this year and last year they were at their dad's so she can have both days off, and Mary's family are in Scotland (we are south england) so she can have the 2 days off to visit them. No doubt Sue and Karen will go off sick like normal... you get the picture.

I'm rambling I know. But basically I'm being penalised for being unable to have children. It doesn't matter that I find christmas incredibly hard and painful.

The thing is, Christmas is about being with family and friends to celebrate, it's not just for those with children. It's for those with elderly relatives, siblings, in laws, best friends etc. When I'm offered leniency over Christmas because I have children, I reply "everybody has someone they want to be with over Christmas - I'll do my share, thank you". If you don't work Tuesdays, then you don't work Tuesdays. I'd be pushing (at least) to have your usual Tuesday (Christmas Eve) off, and also making the point that the default position should not be that the workers without children always work the Christmas days. Your line manager should have discussed Christmas with you all a few months ago and said it needs to be fair for everyone. And you should also point out how insensitive it is to makes remarks relating to you being childless. If it were me, I might even explain why for good measure!

Good post, Whatafustercluck.

The thing is, the op has said she finds Christmas painful so what would she do if not working? It might take her mind off her troubles. That's just a thought, I know I could be quite off the mark.

Feel free to shoot me down as I haven't read the whole thread, but several posters - including at least one person working in HR - have said that this is discriminatory.

Yes it is, but is it unlawful discrimination? Is there a law saying you can't discriminate against people without children? (I'm one myself and if there is I wish I'd known before retiring...)

I'd also agree it's unfair, but again, is there a law saying employer's policies must be "fair"? So long as they don't discriminate against a protected characteristic, does it matter that a policy is "unfair"?

It's quite an outdated thing as everyone is entitled to Christmas not just those with children. We had the problem of Sue wanted it off because she wanted to see her grandchildren, Emma wanted it off for her kids, Karen wanted it off to see her elderly parents. None of these take priority over each.
Our manager made it very clear that if we want Christmas off, the people who worked it last year gets first refusal if they want it off this year. I think it's fair.

OP could spend the day(s) doing something pleasant to take her mind off things, rather than being in work, which in this instance focuses her mind on her childless status, as that is why she is expected to work on the UKs biggest national holiday.

She could spend a day doing fun stuff with her partner. She could visit extended family, including neices and nephews who are extra important if you don't have children yourself. People without children do have worthwhile things to do.

Given that she didn't volunteer to work Christmas, and actually went to the lengths of posting here upset about it, we can reasonably assume work isn't some great distraction from her troubles.

ETA: vital typo!

I think you would have to look at in at having children isn't a protected characteristic ,so it doesn't make a person with children anymore deserving than those without

I wish people would stop throwing "discrimination" around willy nilly.

'Not having children' is not a protected characteristic, therefore there is no basis for a claim of discrimination.

What it could be seen as, is unfair. Lots of things in work and life are unfair without being illegal.

OP's manager communicated it poorly. If there is such a policy where she works, "We prioritise people with children on XYZ days, and we've already granted the max number of requests" would have been better.

All this "She's not contracted to work that day" is also almost certainly nonsense. If you work in a full coverage business (or many other kinds of shift work) there will undoubtedly be a clause in your contract around adjusting shifts to fit the needs of the business, and what notice will be given. I would be astounded if this wasn't the case with OP.

I think posters are using the word in a general sense, not strictly legal.

'Not having children' is not a protected characteristic, therefore there is no basis for a claim of discrimination.

I don't think it would be past a good employment lawyer to show how the OP is being treated differently because of her sex/marital status/ disability, if you really wanted to push a case. Several miscarriages and subsequent infertility might well be seen as a disability and a protected characteristic.

That argument is less ridiculous than @boogiewoogie24 's manager's argument that she must work a different shift pattern because she doesn't have children.

OP's manager communicated it poorly. If there is such a policy where she works, "We prioritise people with children on XYZ days, and we've already granted the max number of requests" would have been better.

That is still unsatisfactory and unfair. It is treating one employee differently because of her medical circumstances.

Well, my mother didn't select a career that required working on Christmas. So the kids whose mothers did, can blame that on mummy, not on co-workers who don't want to be treated like second-class citizens.

Also, up to four or five years old, the kids wouldn't know if it were Christmas, Easter or the August bank holiday if someone didn't tell them. So the parents of very young children can just as well have "Christmas magic" on December 23 or December 27 for all the kids will know. They don't have to celebrate on the very day, especially at the expense of co-workers.

I used to work in journalism, which while not the same as healthcare is a 24/7 business, and I flatly refused to be treated any lesser than people with kids. They knew what they were getting into and their personal issues were not my problem. I missed family events when it was my "turn" including the last Christmas Eve party at my gran's and they can jolly well miss out on things during their turns, too. My needs are not secondary to theirs or their offsprings'.

The baby is not going to know or care.

She's not looking for extra time off, she wants the manager to follow the rules.

Everyone was told that shifts were normal and that they have to work either Christmas Day or Boxing Day. Instead she's been told she must work a day she's never scheduled and she has to work BOTH Christmas Day AND Boxing Day because she doesn't have children. Maybe those who apparently can't follow the rules should be the ones to find another job.

In my workplace, a former worker who was dismissed due to not being able to work on Christmas Day/Boxing Day due to being a single parent (widowed) and no childcare being available/open, won a case of indirect sex discrimination against our employers.

This is completely unfair and I wouldn’t accept it. Christmas isn’t just for those with children, what about those with aging parents? Please complain to your manager and if they don’t help go higher ?

It’s completely insensitive because it’s very clear from OP’s posts that this is absolutely not her exact situation and you will never be in her shoes, which is obviously something you’re completely ignorant to.

I think this is ridiculous. People have the other 364 days of the year to source Christmas Day childcare, be that a professional nanny, neighbour, uni student, person of another faith who doesn't mind working Christmas, or whatever. Claiming that they can't find childcare is bullshit. They just don't want to.

Or what about those who just enjoy Christmas? We don't need the excuse of young children OR aging parents OR distance to want the day off.

Luckily the law doesn’t agree with you. Parents/carers are actually protected under the equalities act and can’t be discriminated against because of caring commitments.

Escalate. Tuesday is your non-working day. You will work either Boxing day or Christmas day (as per the Christmas guidelines) but not both.

It is not for her to decide the rules do not apply to you for her convenience. It sounds like she has not really set up a proper rule for holiday schedules and is hoping you'll fall in line so she can be the good guy for other staff.

BTW, I do have young children and am on call on Christmas Day (9am to 9am Boxing Day). My turn. Though on call is not the same as doing a full shift.

On a wider point, I do wonder how some industries plan this. Childcare at Christmas is near impossible, if you have a single parent with young children they are going to need the time off as part of caring responsibilities. You cannot leave a 5 or 6 year old home alone.

Something for people to think about when taking the job?

Perhaps - but there are obvious 24/7 industries where we want as many good people as possible (anything medical for example!) I think this likely just flags that some key industries are massively understaffed.

Or if you want to imagine things @JudesBiggestFan - imagine your husband of forty years died two months ago and you’re spending Christmas Day on your own with no support because your only child is working.

Imagine that this is the one day of the year your extended family, nieces, nephews, grandparents, parents get together - and you’re the only member of the family who won’t be there to share it with them because you happen not to have children.

Imagine that you and your partner have just moved to a new country where you know no one and they spend Christmas alone as you’re working.

Nothing is ideal, and it would be lovely for everyone to have what they want on Christmas Day - but we need emergency services etc so taking turns is fair.

Be that as it may, people who claim they "can't find childcare" are being extremely disingenuous. If they were sufficiently motivated, they'd do so. But it's easier to stick it to everyone else and take the day off. I hope they don't think they are fooling anyone.

What good are they if they aren't available in crunch times?