To think this is an unacceptable wage?

[Youthiswastedontheyoung]

I'm a qualified teacher with 21 years' experience who has just started supply so flexibility with a poorly husband and three kids of my own.
Just did a full day supply (8.30-3.30) and came out with £112 net.
Hubby thinks decent wage, I think piss-take!
Opinions please!

Even more difficult when you look at self employed as there's holiday time etc - when they aren't working.

Ultimately, the best way is to look at a year period, work out actual hows worked in that year -actually doing work, not being on holiday or having breaks, and work out the pay for that year divided by actual hours worked

I think that's how doctors worked out their effective hourly pay

You compared how other jobs such as a locum gp get paid more then a gp and i said that is because they do the same job whether they are filling in or permanent. But a supply teacher does not do the same job as a permanent teacher. Unless all teachers have been lying for years about the extra work and hours they do outside the classroom

I just did some calculations based on my teaching experience - and some generosity with hours worked in evening / weekend / holiday time.

About 1900 hours* spent doing teaching work - class work, planning, marking, working over holidays etc. It could be less than that but I am not sure if I could make it more.

On £43,000, that is £21.57 an hour all in

On my current salary of £41,000, I get £21.75 IF you just look at my contracted hours worked during the year and the holiday hours. If you ignore those and just look at actual hours worked, then it's £25 an hour.

Supply teaching - 8.30 - 3.30 = 7 hours. Take away lunch and that's 6.5 hours.

In that time, an experienced teacher would have earnt £140 (6.5 x £21.57)

So a supply teacher who has far less responsibility is earning £119 (just 15% less) than a teacher with full class responsibilities.. Which is not too bad really.

*Actual hours worked in a year might vary between teacher

The Supply Teaching daily rate was slashed years ago. Once you could earn a fortune but not any more. Is it worth the stress of dealing with unruly pupils or schools that leave no schemes of work or lesson plans to work from. Ignored in the staff room, given the worst classes to teach, I don't think so.

I suggest you try that yourself. Supply teachers are entitled to paid holiday by law. They may also be entitled to statutory sick pay, but not the enhanced sick pay in the Burgundy Book.

Teachers get paid over the holidays, but not for the holidays. So we get paid for the hours we do (1265 per year) 9 months or so, over 12 months.

@WhoWhereWhatWhy I did teaching recruitment for years and the agency wouldn't take a cut out of the teacher's pay, they would inflate their charge to the client and add on a percentage to cover their costs without it affecting what was being paid to the teacher. I.e if the teacher rate of pay was £16 per hour they would add on say an additional £6-£10ish to the charge rate

Definitely not! My cleaner and babysitter gets around that with no qualifications.

You’re mixing gross and net figures there. The OP is using net pay (wrongly).

Plus the pro rata amount of 5.6 weeks holiday pay.

I don't think this is unusual at all.

I am a professor and am well paid for what I do. But if I gave up my job and taught undergraduate students on an hourly basis I'd get paid the same as a PhD student starting out. That's because I wouldn't have any of the many responsibilities I have now (course design, mentoring, leadership, strategic responsibilities, keeping the organisation running, a full diary and email inbox etc) and the university wouldn't be profiting from my experience in the way that it currently does.

There’s a possibility of other variables here too. What is your tax code? Have you taken early retirement or have other incomes, all of this may give you a tax code where you are paying more tax via PAYE, you need to look at the gross rate. Check your tax code is correct!
Also if going through an agency maybe have a chat with them, you may get a better rate….many recruiters work on commission, so if they can get you to accept a low rate, and the client to pay more, they’re quids in.

Nope. Going rate outside of London is more. 11+ is around £45-50. GCSE £50-55, A Level £60 but some go over £100+ ph. You then can write off expenses and pay less tax as a self employed person.

This is shocking, assuming there is no pension contribution being made and you are working outside of London it is equivalent to M3, which you’d expect to be earning after 2 years teaching.
However, surely you knew what the day rate would be before completing the days work and could have specified that you would only except work paying the equivalent of M6, for example. Despite your vast experience you couldn’t expect more than M6 with no responsibilities outside of the classroom.

This is great advice! Sorry this was in response to someone much earlier in the feed saying to check the tax on your supply role.

I think after 34 pages of thread, this is the cut to the chase!

OP doesn't like what she's got left after tax. She'd rather earn £16/hour cleaning on the black market, not declare it to HMRC, and feel like she's had some massive 'win' while depriving the country of taxes for public services (like teachers!).

The hourly rate she's being paid isn't actually that much different from her normal payscale, given supply has no additional work to do outside classroom hours.

But she keeps comparing what she has left after taxes with what other jobs pay BEFORE tax deductions.

She's just a bit dark she's had to pay the full tax burden on her second job.

Join the queue love!

You're right - so if you compare the Gross pay the OP is on, then that's not bad - given how many hours a teacher works during the year.

And also, if people don't pay tax, then the wages won't have a chance of being paid....

Really strange how you’re often going on about being a feminist, your example of that is going by Ms rather than Mrs, when the way you’ve spoken about women as a collective on this thread is completely misogynistic. I see you ignored the other thread regarding £1700 not being enough for food and utilities but you’re actually earning even more than you were making out so you have even more disposable income than you let on. Why are you pleading poverty, it’s insincere.

Haven't read the full thread but two possible suggestions for you. Approach schools directly re supply cover (including your current school) as you won't have to give you part of the daily rate to a supply agency. Also tutoring, if you can get in 3 hours in an afternoon/evening that is more than you get paid for a supply day. You could also look at tutoring children who aren't in school and then you could do this during the day.

Approach schools directly re supply cover (including your current school) as you won't have to give you part of the daily rate to a supply agency.

Interestingly, the last two schools I worked at only used agencies for supply as it was cheaper for them to do that, than pay staff on their pay scale-presumably as paying that plus on costs, pension etc was so high. So, part timers who wanted extra days to bump up their pay (even to cover their own class when their jobshare partner was ill) would be a flat agency rate. Most didn’t bother!

Bank workers aren’t eligible for pension.

@Goneandwent I'm a feminist but believe this means fighting for equality for women - not women taking advantage of men because they have "choices." It happens a lot.

Which they have due to feminism. How are men being taking advantage of?

I'll leave all you women with wealthy husbands to snipe to yourselves.

MN is clearly the place to come if you enjoy caterwauling and have nothing of use to add to a debate isn't it?
I suppose it's to be expected when the majority of posters are women.

Wouldn't it be great to have more men on this site to give useful contributions rather than snide/sarky ones?

Men are often so much kinder and well-considered than women.

And sites like MN reiterate to me just why I prefer men to women. They are, in the main, much more decent human beings. Yes you get some nasty ones, but you get some nasty women. I think men are far less bitchy.
But I know so many of you are also men-haters. Probably the same ones going by the title of Mrs at the same time.

Which of these posts were the feminist ones exactly? No one reading your posts thinks you're a feminist. Your contempt for women who have the temerity to disagree with you is very clear.