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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be confused why DIL has suddenly changed in how she treats me

668 replies

helpamilout · 12/11/2024 20:23

My son is in his mid-30s and has been with his wife for nearly a decade. They dated for 3-4 years before getting married. When they were dating, she was lovely—chatty, friendly and extremely polite, almost overly so, often saying things like, “Do you mind if I use your bathroom?” or “Thank you very much” for even small gestures.

After they got engaged, everything still seemed fine. But a couple of weeks before the wedding, they told us she was six weeks pregnant, and that’s when things began to change. She became more private and somewhat secretive about the pregnancy (which is of course her right—it was just very different from how she had been before). She was quieter in conversations and didn’t reach out to us as much as she used to. I don’t believe we did anything to cause this; we avoided giving unsolicited advice and tried to be supportive. The only thing I can think of is that I once mentioned C-sections having longer recovery times when she shared she was considering it, but that seems minor.

We also expressed that we were very excited to meet the baby, though we didn’t pressure them with specific timing. We ended up meeting our grandchild when they were one month old, while her mom met the baby in the hospital and her dad when the baby was just three days old. When she was pregnant with their second, they didn’t tell us until she was 20 weeks along, even though it seemed her close friends already knew.

They never ask us to babysit but often ask her parents. They visit her parents once a month, but they only come to see us once or twice a year, despite us living the same distance away (a couple of hours, though in the opposite direction). I do see them a bit more often because I go to visit them, but they never invite me to stay overnight, whereas her mom often stays with them.

It’s perhaps worth noting that my daughter-in-law is a stay-at-home mom, and my son works long hours, sometimes on weekends. While arranging visits should ideally be a joint effort, it often falls on her since my son can’t really insist on her seeing us when he isn’t around. My son does make an effort to plan visits with us when he’s off work, but when I do visit, she seems distant and disengaged. I’ve heard her mention that the drive to us is “far,” yet she drives the same distance to her parents regularly. During visits, she often seems uninterested and sometimes responds quite shortly. For instance, when I asked how long the baby typically naps, she just shrugged and said, “Depends.” And when I brought a homemade banana cake for everyone to share, she laughed and said he doesn’t like bananas anymore.

I’m confused what has caused this. I’ve asked my son but he says everything is fine. Should I ask her? If so, how? Can MNers see what I’ve made done wrong or help me guess?

OP posts:
Whiteskies · 15/11/2024 08:52

Just listening to a Democrat talking on Radio 4 about the reasons they lost the election. On of the reasons he suggests is the narrative of ´Toxic Masculinity' they focused on during the election. It didn't do them any favours with the male or even the female electorate. He pointed out that it doesn't dilute concern for women by acknowledging the issues faced by men.
The hopefully declining number of women in the UK who don't work outside the home and act as gatekeepers to their children, would do well to think about the whole family unit and not deliberately exclude the male side of the family.

ToSleepPurchancetoDream · 15/11/2024 08:53

She is being very thoughtless.

She's organised her life as she wants and it doesn't matter to her if you are excluded because you're not her mother.

I think both spouses do have a responsibility to support and engage with the relationship with their in laws. That should be viewed as being part of the wider family. And while she's a sahm she should pick up more responsibility for this.
She should be doing it for her husband and her kids if not for you.

But she's not. Because she doesn't want to.

It's not necessarily that you've done anything wrong, it's just she doesn't want to. She has more important priorities.

That's hard
But I wouldn't raise it with her.
That could actually fracture the relationship.

I'd try to make the most of the time you do have with them. Make it a happy time, be positive and supportive.

This period will pass and she will probably as her children grow become less narrowly focused and she'll appreciate the relationship in different ways.

I'm sorry this is hard for you. It's very unfair, but don't make it worse. If you can maintain a positive even distant relationship there is always hope you'll become closer again.

ToSleepPurchancetoDream · 15/11/2024 08:58

Also raising it with her, places your son in a very difficult position of being between his wife and mother. A terrible thing for him.

And wives always 'win' in those situations. (No one really wins, but the husband and children definitely lose when a grandparent relationship is lost.)

It sounds like your son loves you and makes an effort to involve you. That is lovely.
Let him continue to do that and show you appreciate that even if you are sad you don't see them as much as you would like.

CocoDC · 15/11/2024 09:23

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LilyBartsHatShop · 15/11/2024 09:40

I don't understand where other posters are getting this information that DiL is stopping her husband organising time for him and kids to see OP?
OP has said several times that her son organises her monthly visits and sometimes organises for her to stay in a hotel.
It sounds to me like the ball is very much in his court. If he wanted his mum around more often he'd organise more visits.

Apolloneuro · 15/11/2024 09:46

I’m afraid I think it’s as simple as the fact that @helpamilout‘s son is at work a lot and the DIL doesn’t feel like she wants to socialise with her MIL without him.

Whiteskies · 15/11/2024 09:49

@LilyBartsHatShop
The OP's husband works full time. The OP is a SAHM. He probably hasn't got a lot of spare time. I said up thread that it is much easier to see family if you are at home all day with little ones. He is probably running hard to stay still if he is the only financial provider.
My niece works out of the home,her husband works from home for himself. She found it hard that he would have his parents round frequently to pick up children from nursery and give them tea etc. She wanted her parents included. He is a nice guy so he made an effort to include them. I suspect many women would not be so nice.

CocoDC · 15/11/2024 09:58

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helpamilout · 15/11/2024 11:55

A few people asking about wealth gap - yes. DIL's family were able to privately educate 2 kids, 5-6 holidays a year family. We had all 4 children in grammar schools, 1-2 holidays per year.

Questions about DS working hard, DIL being a SAHM, does she want to be a SAHM, is he happy working this hard. Even in the early years DIL would say that her main goal is to become a mum, she'd love to be a SAHM, doesn't like nurseries for kids. I've never heard her say that this has to be the case or she refuses to work but she's commented many times that she would LIKE to be a SAHM. And, from what I can tell, she's a great mum - very loving to her children, seems to really enjoy time with them, patient, caring. DS was always very driven, hard working, ambitious. He started the business before they met, he's always worked hard on it, he worked a similar schedule when they were getting engaged / married. I would assume they both knew what they were getting into - DIL presumably saw that DS was working long and not always predictable hours, that he was very dedicated, but also that he's making enough for her to be a SAHM and live comfortably. DS presumably heard the many many mentions of her wanting to be a SAHM and realised that's what would make her happy. So I don't think in this scenario either of them wants to change up their work / activity / level of business.

Someone mentioned that since I have other children in London maybe DS and DIL assume I should stay there... but DD1 is my child in the same way DS is. They live in opposite sides of town (although closer from each other than from me to London). I do it occasionally.

Also people asking what's the issue with 1 visit per month. It's the whole thing together: the atmosphere on the visits, the short responses, the not inviting us for a month (a question on why we didn't ask - we didn't want to push any further. We said before the birth that we are ready and very excited to meet the baby, but don't want to invite ourselves or make anyone uncomfortable so will wait for an invitation when they are ready), treating presents from us like we've brought bombs into the house...

Oh and the question about whether I asked my son about why I didn't visit for a month. He said (even during the month, in private WhatsApp chat with us or phone calls rather than group WhatsApp) that he is desperate for us to meet but DIL wants to be fully recovered physically, at some points he even said she wants to wait until her 6 week check but in practice it was earlier than 6 weeks. Presumably he insisted his parents meet the baby sooner than 6 weeks, although I'm unsure what changed.

OP posts:
Apolloneuro · 15/11/2024 11:59

That’s so sad about meeting the baby, when he wanted you to. He needs to put his big boy pants on, sounds like.

Apolloneuro · 15/11/2024 12:03

You’re not going to like this @helpamilout but I don’t think anything is going to change. The DIL prefers her family and your son doesn’t have enough time or clout to intervene.

I think you’re going to have to change your mindset and be happy with what you’ve got, and remember that grandchildren grow up and you can develop a good, independent relationship with them in the future.

I can’t remember if you have other grandchildren. If you do, focus on them for the near future.

You have very little influence over the situation, in reality, I’m afraid.

thepariscrimefiles · 15/11/2024 12:25

helpamilout · 15/11/2024 11:55

A few people asking about wealth gap - yes. DIL's family were able to privately educate 2 kids, 5-6 holidays a year family. We had all 4 children in grammar schools, 1-2 holidays per year.

Questions about DS working hard, DIL being a SAHM, does she want to be a SAHM, is he happy working this hard. Even in the early years DIL would say that her main goal is to become a mum, she'd love to be a SAHM, doesn't like nurseries for kids. I've never heard her say that this has to be the case or she refuses to work but she's commented many times that she would LIKE to be a SAHM. And, from what I can tell, she's a great mum - very loving to her children, seems to really enjoy time with them, patient, caring. DS was always very driven, hard working, ambitious. He started the business before they met, he's always worked hard on it, he worked a similar schedule when they were getting engaged / married. I would assume they both knew what they were getting into - DIL presumably saw that DS was working long and not always predictable hours, that he was very dedicated, but also that he's making enough for her to be a SAHM and live comfortably. DS presumably heard the many many mentions of her wanting to be a SAHM and realised that's what would make her happy. So I don't think in this scenario either of them wants to change up their work / activity / level of business.

Someone mentioned that since I have other children in London maybe DS and DIL assume I should stay there... but DD1 is my child in the same way DS is. They live in opposite sides of town (although closer from each other than from me to London). I do it occasionally.

Also people asking what's the issue with 1 visit per month. It's the whole thing together: the atmosphere on the visits, the short responses, the not inviting us for a month (a question on why we didn't ask - we didn't want to push any further. We said before the birth that we are ready and very excited to meet the baby, but don't want to invite ourselves or make anyone uncomfortable so will wait for an invitation when they are ready), treating presents from us like we've brought bombs into the house...

Oh and the question about whether I asked my son about why I didn't visit for a month. He said (even during the month, in private WhatsApp chat with us or phone calls rather than group WhatsApp) that he is desperate for us to meet but DIL wants to be fully recovered physically, at some points he even said she wants to wait until her 6 week check but in practice it was earlier than 6 weeks. Presumably he insisted his parents meet the baby sooner than 6 weeks, although I'm unsure what changed.

It is obvious that your DIL doesn't really feel comfortable with you and I don't think that there is anything you can do about that. Raising it with your son or your DIL will probably just make things worse.

If you try and enjoy the good things about the monthly visits and don't put any pressure on your son or your DIL, hopefully things will improve as the children get older and your DIL feels more relaxed. Maybe then she will be happy to let your son visit you with the children.

Some posters may tell you to pull back and 'wait until your DIL needs you more than you need her e.g. for childcare or babysitting'. Given your DIL's closeness to her own parents and that fact that your son/DIL and her family are pretty wealthy, I don't think that will happen.

lemonstolemonade · 15/11/2024 13:15

Did your DIL have a c section in the end? Did she wait until she felt recovered because you were negative about the recovery?

Blahdeblah24 · 15/11/2024 13:21

@helpamilout reading through your threads a simmering resentment towards your DIL is apparent & just as you sense an atmosphere when you are together she probably does too which is why she only wants to be around you when her husband/your son is there.

It would help to know:

  1. Did your DS's twin or his sister who lives nearby them get to meet your sons DC1 or DC2 before you?
  2. You have offered to babysit 'many, many times' how old are the DC involved?
  3. When your son only has 2 free weekends a month do you think it's fair to expect to see him on more than one of those?
helpamilout · 15/11/2024 13:28

lemonstolemonade · 15/11/2024 13:15

Did your DIL have a c section in the end? Did she wait until she felt recovered because you were negative about the recovery?

She didn't have a c section in either case, 1st or 2nd. She decided from very early on in her pregnancy that she wanted a vaginal birth (and freely volunteered this info without me asking) if things go to plan. Then she shared the birth story quite openly - it was a vaginal birth.

OP posts:
ABirdsEyeView · 15/11/2024 13:33

@Blahdeblah24 how does one not feel resentment at someone who treats them as dil treats the OP?
I thought the OPs posts have been fair and measured. Buts she's not going to love someone who so clearly treats her like shit!

helpamilout · 15/11/2024 13:34

Blahdeblah24 · 15/11/2024 13:21

@helpamilout reading through your threads a simmering resentment towards your DIL is apparent & just as you sense an atmosphere when you are together she probably does too which is why she only wants to be around you when her husband/your son is there.

It would help to know:

  1. Did your DS's twin or his sister who lives nearby them get to meet your sons DC1 or DC2 before you?
  2. You have offered to babysit 'many, many times' how old are the DC involved?
  3. When your son only has 2 free weekends a month do you think it's fair to expect to see him on more than one of those?
  1. Did your DS's twin or his sister who lives nearby them get to meet your sons DC1 or DC2 before you?
    None of them were "allowed" to meet the baby until after a month. DS said his brother will meet the baby, DIL said she'd like to be recovered before ... in short DS just arranged to meet his twin on a walk when he took the baby out / DIL was resting at home and informed DIL of this rather than asked her permission. I know this led to a big argument.

  2. You have offered to babysit 'many, many times' how old are the DC involved?
    The older DC is 3, the youngest will turn 1 next month.

  3. When your son only has 2 free weekends a month do you think it's fair to expect to see him on more than one of those?
    I've explained that it really varies from month to month. When he is working 2 full weekends (rare) then yes it's not fair for us to occupy one whole weekend of those 2 weekends... but as I've also said we rarely stay overnight or see them both days, it's more of "has happened occasionally" rather than the norm.
    If he's working a full weekends or one weekend each of 2 weekends, I don't think there's anything wrong with us coming for a day once a month or even staying overnight in a nearby hotel (which, again, as I've said, rarely happens). And there's certainly nothing wrong with DIL making the effort to be polite. There's also nothing wrong with us visiting for an hour or two during the week if we're in London anyway, regardless of whether DS is there or not.

OP posts:
ASimpleLampoon · 15/11/2024 13:39

I think you have answered your own question.

She's a stay at home mum

Son works long hours

It falls to her to make the arrangements

You need to be encouraging your son to take on this particular mental load. Your son needs to make the time and effort to facilitate your relationship with your grandchild.

Whcjsveh · 15/11/2024 13:40

Clearly your DIL doesn't want to see you without your son so mid week won't happen and you already see them once per month.

Suzuki76 · 15/11/2024 13:42

Given she was shitty about her DH's entire family including his twin meeting the baby for a whole month, I would recommend you actually take this less personally than I initially thought!

sleepandcoffee · 15/11/2024 13:48

Are you a family of smokers or heavy drinkers ? I'm just wondering if there's something that is clouding her view of you all ?
Are you all outgoing people whereas perhaps she's more reserved ?
This does sound like it's not a problem she has with you personally but just the whole family 🤔

Blahdeblah24 · 15/11/2024 13:48

ABirdsEyeView · 15/11/2024 13:33

@Blahdeblah24 how does one not feel resentment at someone who treats them as dil treats the OP?
I thought the OPs posts have been fair and measured. Buts she's not going to love someone who so clearly treats her like shit!

Treats her like shit? Well we don't know that to be fact do we as there are two sides to every story...

I think seeing them on a monthly basis is very much in the realms of normal. We didn't see my PILs or indeed my own parents that much. If they lived around the corner it would be a bit stranger but as the OP lives a couple of hours away from London travel will indeed be a key consideration with preschool age DC.

As for babysitting the DIL will have had DC1 and possibly been breastfeeding, then been pregnant again, then had second DC and possibly be (and still be breastfeeding) so it's entirely reasonable that she hasn't taken up the OP's 'many many' requests to babysit. The DCs ages are possibly another reason why they don't want to have to travel with them as it's a palaver at that stage and why the son doesn't take them to his parents by himself for the weekend.

" There's also nothing wrong with us visiting for an hour or two during the week if we're in London anyway, regardless of whether DS is there or not."
According to you. If your DIL invited you but she hasn't which is her prerogative.

helpamilout · 15/11/2024 13:51

sleepandcoffee · 15/11/2024 13:48

Are you a family of smokers or heavy drinkers ? I'm just wondering if there's something that is clouding her view of you all ?
Are you all outgoing people whereas perhaps she's more reserved ?
This does sound like it's not a problem she has with you personally but just the whole family 🤔

None of my children, myself or my husband smoke. DH and I drink maybe 2-3 glasses of wine each once every couple of weeks with a nice meal / if we celebrate, but nothing excessive.
We are close as a family, and happy to see each other, chatty, but not loud in the sense of anyone having a particularly loud voice, shouting, playing loud music.

OP posts:
Wellingtonspie · 15/11/2024 13:54

Honestly the amount of times I’ve effectively hosted mil to see the grandchildren without dh is zero.

We have nothing in common bar dh and the children and honestly that leads to a very very boring conversation.

Clearly something was going on with her during that one month where she didn’t want to see any you after birth.

At 3 and nearly one I can again see why she wouldn’t want unnecessary babysitting. Let’s be honest here you’d probably judge her for it too since you already made points about having a cleaner and cook. What could she possibly need a sitter for.

helpamilout · 15/11/2024 13:55

Suzuki76 · 15/11/2024 13:42

Given she was shitty about her DH's entire family including his twin meeting the baby for a whole month, I would recommend you actually take this less personally than I initially thought!

I think from everything I've said, how I've seen the twins interact throughout their life and in adulthood, how DIL is around DS2... she doesn't dare come in between the two brothers as much or doesn't object to DS2 being around because she knows (very correctly) that DS1 is very protective of his relationship with DS2, and it may not end well for her if she was to make it a "he's not allowed in our house" type thing.
So I think if DS took the baby to "secretly" meet me instead of DS2 or announced I'm coming without asking her "permission" there would be even more drama.

OP posts: