To be so disappointed in people - Trump voters especially

[notsorighteousthesedays]

I feel absolutely stunned that despite all that has been said and done Trump is likely to get the chance to make the world burn a little faster.

I am afraid for a future so full of anger and hate.

True … they peddle easy soundbites for complicated problems, with no real solutions.

Luckily for us Farage had little actual power in this country - the nonsense he peddled about Brexit was enough .. half-truths and outright lies.

To the poster who said that the election wasn't won/lost on trans issues -

Directly - no
Indirectly - yes.

As soon as someone comes out and says something as silly as men can be women, I doubt every single other thing they say.
I won't be the only one who thinks that if someone can lie or pretend to believe that, then they can't be trusted on other issues.

He seems to have won the popular vote across all demographics so her race and gender can’t be the only reason

I'm confident it isn't, @Combattingthemoaners, but then the alleged bias falls apart when we consider folks' insistence - probably justified - that Michelle Obama could have won

So much easier though to wave the racism/misogyny flag than to look at what really went wrong

That's not what people here are saying though, is it? There have been good and bad republican and democrat presidents. Just as there have been good and bad Labour and Tory PMs. Most occupy the centre ground. I'm not a supporter of Conservative policies, and have never voted Conservative. But until the Brexit fiasco, I was prepared to think that Cameron, as a moderate, was an OK PM. Likewise, I should think that many republicans will concede to Obama having been a good president, even if they didn't agree with his policies. What people here are saying is that Trump is abhorrent, an innately shitty individual as well as as a convicted criminal. We had similar in Johnson, of course, and when people called out just what a nefarious and incompetent PM he was, they were accused of 'othering' and 'shutting down' Tory voters. No, he was just a terrible, awful, despicable human 'in charge of' a country. I prefer world leaders to have some redeeming qualities, whatever their political flavour.

And Obama increased the use of drones by a factor of 10 in comparison to Bush.

But the media minimise that and continue to uphold Obama as this infallible figure.

Unfortunately a lot of voters seem to have bought the line that US economic woes were due to the Democrat government rather than the geopolitical landscape. Add to that a number of missteps by the incumbent government. The Democratic Party didn't have a plan B if Biden didn't run and left it too late to make Harris their candidate. Trump is a vile, self-serving criminal and I am worried about the impact of his foreign policy on the rest of the world. I remember the relief when he was no longer president.

Thanks for clarifying. I completely agree with you.

fluffy71 · Today 10:33

Riapia · Today 07:23
I was surprised when Trump won in 2016. Well, now he’s done it again.
Never underestimate the stupidity of so many people.

How condescending

Just stating the obvious.

"But other PPs have said the Dems need a better candidate .. and I too would like to know what people mean by that? It feels like there is an undercurrent, of 'better candidate' = old white man."

I wouldn't say that at all. If they had put up somebody like Gretchen Whitmer (Michigan Governor) or Josh Shapiro (Pennsylvania Governor) or Wes Moore (Maryland Governor) I think they would have stood a much better chance.

OK, yes, one of those is a white man. But none are particularly old, they're in their early 50s or late 40s now so will still be in their 50s in four years time. I wouldn't call mid/late 50s "old".

I don’t think it’s as simple as people are awful/idiots for voting for Trump @notsorighteousthesedays

1. Biden should have announced one term only early on. There would’ve been time to find and embed a good candidate - instead of throwing Kamala in at the last minute - especially when she has zero personality - speaking as someone so excited for the first female president I’ve barely made it through her speeches.

2. calling people who support Trump Nazi’s and Racist’s etc was never going to sway people to the democrats if they were undecided.

3. women’s rights are about more than access to abortion. Women’s rights are being completely trampled over by the democrats in favour of a small group of trans people. Children’s rights to a healthy childhood also massively at risk. As a parent, why would I vote for a party who agree that I shouldn’t be informed if my child is ‘changing gender’ - a stepping stone to infertility and ill health, needless operations and a life of medication in a perfectly healthy child (Gavin Newsom).

It amazes me that anyone in Europe still thinks Obama was great when every day we are living with the catastrophic effects of the US destruction of Libya alone... let alone all their other lucrative and immoral wars

@ItsFunToBeAVampire , I felt that to a degree about the British Labour Party. If they can lie that a man can be a woman, what else will they lie about ?

^THIS SO MUCH^

I'm not American but even in the UK, every single workplace I've worked in I've had to smile and nod along to lefties and remainers who would have ripped your throat open if you expressed even a moderate, non-far left opinion, and that was the acceptable norm. It seems the only voice that people have anymore is the one in the voting booth, and recent elections in both UK and US (albeit labour still won in the UK) have shown that.

Only if you believe that it was an act of senseless aggression. Truth is, Ukrainian and Russian history is very deeply nuanced and intertwined. Putin has his own agenda yes, it doesn’t make it right to invade a sovereign country - no. However, Russia doesn’t have an appetite or resources to go past that point… the have to bring North Korea army at this point?!? Putin has been warning NATO for ages not to get too close to Russia’s borders. It’s a different topic altogether though about what happens on the world arena. However fact is, if you look at Putin’s actions he’s far from a mad man BBC is making him sound as. He’s very well educated, poised and calculated. None of his actions in the past suggest that he’s dreaming of Imperialist Russia. He wants it to have a say in the world politics, because the big boys in the G8 summit don’t want to share … but then, I digress… basically, no need to panic just yet. A dog that barks doesn’t bite .. or whatever the saying is

Plenty of people consider Republicans and Fascists to be synonymous. The discourse is so toxic and tribalistic.

People don’t vote for the bottom of the ticket. They weren’t voting for Harris to be VP, they voted for Biden (white, male, old) to be President.

No one cares about the VP, to paraphrase fictional VP John Hoynes - a VPs only constitutional duty is to have a pulse.

It's obviously more nuanced that just race and gender, but they certainly were factors. I'm sure the fact she's a woman of colour would have helped Trump amp up his anti-immigration rhetoric and made it more believable that Harris would just have let all the immigrants in, as he claimed. It's the classic thing of right wing populists making sure their working and middle class voters are punching down instead of looking upwards at who's punching THEM down.

But he was also obviously voted for as the chaos candidate, and because he's essentially built up a cult around him - and because the Democrats, for unknown reasons, didn't field anywhere near good enough candidates in Biden or Harris.

I support abortion rights.

I find it hypocritical of the Democrats that they have claimed to be the great saviour of abortion rights when they didn't care about them enough to keep previous election promises of Obama to codify them. The fact that Roe v Wade was vulnerable to be overturned by Trump stacking the Senate was known yet it wasn't seen as a important enough. But don't let that ruin your narrative.

The Democrats in the run up to this election used Abortion rights that they haven't cared enough about in the past as the 'women's rights issue' whilst fawning over men who claim a stereotypical and offensive version of 'woman hood', ruining women's sport, and calling eveyone who reasonably objects bigots.

It is a lie to claim that the Democrats are the saviours of women's right.

Obviously the Republicans are at least as bad.

Calling women who recognise these issues and who have their own reasons to vote Trump vile and stupid plays right into his hands.

Stop being so self righteous and start engaging your brain and thinking critically.

Right, but my point wasn't that Obama was a saintly individual. Bush - starts bombing; Obama - increases bombing; Trump - removes oversight from bombing meaning people can do whatever; Biden - brings Whitehouse oversight back. Reduces bombing. All good/bad depending on how you spin it. But the criticism of Trump isn't the same as the criticisms usually levelled at Republicans because he isn't like them. Also - are deportations good or bad? Kamala Harris was bad because there weren't enough, but Obama is no saint because he did too many. Its not a concrete line of attack, Its just grievance.

Apart from tax cuts for billionaires, huge tariffs, and mass deportations on day 1, what are his policies? I've listened to his speeches at his rallies and I am none the wiser.

First they came for…..
be careful what you ‘stay out’ of

Read your own post and give your head a wobble.

I try not to. But it's hard when Trump is claiming that immigrants are dining on dogs and cats. As an immigrant in this country, and with immigrant family in the US, I have seen how this kind of demonisation works.

Having said that many immigrants and minorities have voted for Trump. Because he focused on the economy and perhaps because they don't want to feel like victims.

If anyone has a spare 30 mins I’d recommend the latest TRIP US which was recorded as PA was called for Trump.

Whilst both Katty Kay and Mooch have always been clear that they supported Harris, they are critical of the way the Dems ran the campaign and acknowledge that Trump is a great campaigner.

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-rest-is-politics-us/id1743030473?i=1000675875360

@MuchuseasaChocolateTeapot how about we get involved if they actually come for us though ?