To be fed up of the political manipulation on mumsnet

[ZenNudist]

It's incessant and it's wearing. It's been going on for years and I'm fed up of the massive amount of tory party generated and lobbying content blocking up mumsnet.

I appreciate mumsnet is seen as a key voter demographic but a lot of the threads being posted are so transparently fiction.

The billion VAT on school fees threads must have been a mix of real people and tory HQ.

Fake outrage started immediately and now well into saying that with less than 4 Months of government and before enacting their first budget the Labour Party are apparently making a mess of everything and reversing the great gains made during tory rule. What great gains? I don't know. I saw one post trying to take tory credit for reducing inflation like that was Rishi's doing, laughable.

I also have seen a few fake scenarios for adverse impact of the budget on inheritance and small business taxation. Speaking as someone who will be adversely affects by increasing employer NI and the reduction in business property relief I still support these changes. My friends who are small business owners feel the same way.

Labour promised not to put up the main rates of income tax and employee NI. They were clear that measures would need to be taken to increase the tax take. They still are trying to drive growth because at the end if the day increasing the tax base is the best way of increasing revenue to the exchequer.

I know a lot of mumsnetters say they can't spot trolls or AI threads. I also think a lot of people will not spot the blatant manipulation by lobbyists and tory campaigners.

Tory party now playing a long game.

The Tory party is funded by the rich for the benefit of the rich. The rest of the middle, the poor, the marginalised have almost no voice and no one funding a political machine to work in our favour.

It has always been the case that those on the left / far left are, on the whole, less tolerant of or understanding that theirs is not the only view than those in the centre or on the right. Because for some reason they think they have the moral highgound, even while wearing clothes paid for by someone else, in a flat owned by someone else before going to a show paid for by someone else. They see that as their 'right' and not to be questioned. Furthermore they almost never accept that their view isn't necessarily even 'right'. But that's silly and narrow minded, because very often there is no 'right' answer, just different ways of doing things, and different priorities.

But, I also think we all see the same things through different lenses and interpret them differently. I am sure those on the far left think that mumsnet is infiltrated by Tory bots, and those on the right think it's a hot-bed of champagne socialists, benefits claimants and well meaning but uninformed public sector drones.

The reality for those of us that sit either slighly left or right of the centre is that the hysteria is tiresome, and drowns out any sensible debate. Perhaps those on the far left and right find facts tiresome...because it means they have to think for themselves and not just toe the 'party' line, no matter how nonsensical.

And a fair few people IRL actively avoid discussing politics, for fear of someone like the OP accusing them of having wrongthink.

I find a declared interest just as suspicious as undeclared. The obvious format now will be "I voted Labour but am completely disillusioned". I am happy to accept there will be disillusioned Labour voters , but it's the disingenuous proliferation of the same kinds of threads designed to sway hearts and minds. Side note: does anyone remember the "I'm a remainer but..." threads designed to curry pro-brexit favour?

The tory party did such an awful job over such a long period getting worse and worse until you were nostalgic for earlier tories you previously hated as the next lot were worse. Hitting an absolute nadir with lying self interested BoJo and then the unfunny brief joke of Truss and nonentity Sunak. There wasnt the same froth then about their sins. There should have been. People were mainly bothered about the effects on their daily lives and not pointing the finger at those responsible.

Now Labour have not had time to do anything and there is such a screaming pitch of criticism. Not all of it is authentic and its certainly not remotely nuanced or realistic. How exactly do you turn around a country this far into the mire? How do yoh invest in public services without raising tax revenues?

There's a lot of intelligent people on mumsnet who are wary of agendas in what other people say. People who sift facts and weigh evidence because they really care. Then there are many well meaning people who could be easily influenced by a dominant narrative.

I'm saying there's a paid for contingent of lobbyists here. Not all bots, not all are single issue, freshly minted posters. There's a mix of varying quality of lobbying tools/posters mixed in with real people with their real views. The purpose of a fake post is to bring out the real posters in support.

Hey ho. If it weren't the Tories it'd be something else. Does anyone else get nostalgic for the well crafted creative writing trolls who used to do such interesting stories? You could tell they were fake but at least they were entertaining.

I also think a lot of people will not spot the blatant manipulation by lobbyists and tory campaigners.

If people are so stupid that they can't think and reason. then where they hear the "message" is irrelevant and it's a lost cause.

Why don't you register Labour posts?

It's odd that, and from pp that they really only react to stuff that they don't agree with when Labour really do feature heavily and use various ways to do so.

Oh dear. I’m afraid that’s probably me. 🫣

This in buckets.

Well the fact that I thought this thread would be about all the left leaning posters forever bashing the Tories shows you that mumsnet must actually be a good mix!

a debate is fine. I have to say I get suss on people who put their personal circumstances first or make it personal quickly. We all have different lives, so what does it add except to shut down an actual debate? If someone has political views then usually they will have an idea about how they think the country should be managed (left or right). If it’s just about how they are personally affected then most suspicious of the motives.

A bit ironic that you've created a post supporting labour OP

Well said.

Have you seen the sterling pound performance today?
Stop being so obsessed about the Tories. Unless you are new to Mumsnet. The amount of vitriol towards the Tories and specifically Boris Johnson and Liz Truss was insane for a long time. The Tories are not the party you should be worry about it.

It's dangerous, actually, to underestimate the average person.

there used to be lots written about how the BBC was massively left leaning - despite the fact that Nick Robinson was the political editor at the time. ( he was in the young conservatives at uni)

and over the course of the last Tory government, there was a procession of BBC managers and editors leaving to be comms directors for the PM and wider Conservative Party.

Nope, I think MN represents a fair range of views. I know lots of people rich/poor, rural/urban and left/right. I don't live in a bubble.

The left have always been a 'big tent' and the more centrist left can be tarnished by the behaviours of their 'noisy' extremes.

Same is true of the right - sorry, but immigration has little or no impact on the majority, yet it has become a toxic, noisy debate.

We only ever hear the more extreme voices in the media, and this includes BBC, ITV, Sky, etc., not just social media.

The reality is that UK elections are won from the centre and always have been. That's why Corbyn didn't win, and May lost her majority.

I'm centrist, left-ish on some issues, right-ish on others. Like many, I feel politically homeless right now.

I can spot them a mile off ("Is anyone else... is it just me or...") but I don't really understand it right now because fortunately there won't be another election for years. So they can tilt at windmills against an imaginary opponent if they wish.

Why do you need to come on their defence if they are doing great? Did you expect mumsnetters to give them a free pass when poorly performing? I do not see much praise anywhere either newspapers or magazines or tv. They are being crucified everywhere. Even in international media so brace yourself.

To be honest I read yours as exactly the same.

Being a long term poster, doesn’t really matter. You could just be a long term real person doing it.

You talk about made up situations, loads of people post made up situations for all sorts of reasons. Often simple rage baiting. You may find a lot of these ‘Tory bots’ are simply trolls, rage baiting.

Your claim that loads of small business owners are adversely impacted and also quite happy about it, doesn’t ring true. Its sounds like all the people who post saying they are happy to pay more tax, but never volunteer to actually pay more tax.

If people are adversely impacted why would they be happy? If the outcome IS a better NHS (as an example) you might be happy further down the line. But you don’t know what the outcome will be.

If your small business isn’t really going to be impacted, then the point doesn’t make sense.

My advice would be if you think they are bots engage with the thread and dispute what they are saying. Or report it. But quite honestly, I can’t imagine anyone voting because a poster they don’t know posted something on mumsnet.

Boris Johnson killed 20,000 people in all but name by his inactions over Covid in early March 2020.

Liz Truss was bad, but nowhere near that.

@dottiehens and who would that be saying anything positive then- it's certainly not going to be the mainstream uk press and the guardian appears geared up to 22 year old very woo students these day-

I don’t agree with this but really don’t want to keep having to defend Johnson!

Lockdowns arguably did more harm than good. But this isn’t a covid thread.

It has been getting worse ever since the Mumsnet biscuit question (McVitie's digestive, obviously) moved from being light-hearted to something that every politician put to a focus group to see which one made them most likeable.

Quite rightly they are, and the markets have reacted as predicted they would, yet still people say you cannot criticise Labour or if you do you are a Tory, Reform or Russian bot.

No, I think it is fairly well split on here. I am fairly centre in my politics, though I have never voted conservative or for anyone right of them.
BTW before being elected Starmer just stated he would not raise NI. He did not separate into into employers and employees. I believed him. This is why I am so cross. I still would not have voted Conservative. I just can’t believe the corruption of the last few years.

I wish someone who thinks MN is so leftist would actually say what made them think so.