Embarrassed/Shamed by colleague

[loveydoveyloon]

So, i'm fuming!

I run 1 of 3 remote sites and we have a head office further down the country. An email went out last week asking all Managers if they would like to contribute a set amount toward the GM's birthday (not a significant birthday). If you wanted to contribute to email back and bank details would be sent out. I did not respond. We don't get any perks with the company, they have stopped wfh flexibility and to be fair don't like the guy, bit of a sleaze, that's another story.

Yesterday, the colleague who was arranging his present called me up, from an office she shares with several managers and HR, I could hear everyone in the background, it sounded like she had me on loud speaker, asking if I would not be contributing and why not, so I had to explain that cash is a bit tight at the moment and Christmas is round the corner plus 3 family birthdays.

I felt embarrassed to admit in front of colleagues I have meetings with everyday that I could not afford to contribute towards his present.

AIBU to be angry. She could have emailed or spoke to me discretely.

I’m quite blunt in these situations and would have just said I don’t do gifts and I don’t expect them back. End of.

I would have stuttered too in your position, but in case it happens again you might want to have a response ready. A startled pause followed by 'I'm really surprised you are asking me this. Are you keeping tabs on who has contributed what?' might do the trick.

It's very unprofessional not to tell someone you've called that you're on speaker-phone. Car or office.

Because she was put on the spot and felt she had when asked if she was contributing.

It’s absolutely shit. My work does whip arounds (very frequently as everyone is leaving) but no one is ever individually asked or put under pressure. I’d call acas, I’d also make a diary of this and your memory of the exchange and how it made you feel (ask acas what you need to keep note of) and diarise any other instances in the future with unprofessional practice in case you need it.

Absolutely! - this woman is being an arse kisser i suspect she'll try to wedge in that 'she organised/chose' etc the gift so is trying to get as much money as possible

I wouldn't have donated - don't like or place gift expectations.

But why are people saying complain to HR? You are an adult. You probably realise now that you should just have said " No, sorry" amd left it.

It just seems a trend now, that people on mumsnet always recommend calling the police/ council/ HR over things which they should be able to sort out with a conversation. Or, as in your case, just think that didn't go well but I will forget about it as its not a big deal

Tbh, I might have said money's tight just as an excuse, so if I overheard someone else say the same, I wouldn't assume they'd told the truth, not that it would matter one way or the other. It's a voluntary contribution, not money owed.

She shouldn't have done it, but I would try not to worry about it. Anyone who could have heard and judged you for this is a nasty piece of work and not worth a second thought.

I've witnessed and been on the end of enough HR manoeuvres to be very confident that it's not a trope, just the truth.
One phone call asking why you're not contributing to a voluntary whip-round is perhaps not harassment on its own (although it's definitely inappropriate), but then someone else calling about it? That's crossing a line.
I don't care what HR people consider to be the 'modern HR approach', I don't have to agree with it. I'd kick up a stink about this. And to answer someone else's question about what should happen, those two people's manager(s) should apologise to the OP on behalf of their staff and make clear that no one from their team will in future be making any phone calls asking about informal voluntary activities.

Me too on on the HR front. They've never been much use to me.

And to answer someone else's question about what should happen, those two people's manager(s) should apologise to the OP on behalf of their staff and make clear that no one from their team will in future be making any phone calls asking about informal voluntary activities.

This is what should happen. It is so completely inappropriate.

It was cheeky and unprofessional of her, and yes, I think you could complain and in doing so ask for her to be reminded that contributions for birthdays etc. are voluntary, not obligatory. She shouldn't be putting people on the spot like that.

There was no need at all to explain yourself and offer up explanations. A simple "no, I won't be contributing" would be sufficient. Then just goodbye and end the call. Your financial situation is none of her business.

Gosh. So a grown adult needs to ask two other grown adults’ managers to say sorry for something they likely did of their own volition?

Where do you live? Toytown?

People “on the end of enough HR manoeuvres” generally have trouble seeing their own issues. The vast majority of people never have any direct engagement with HR. You must be a Very Special One indeed.

I don't know what the Very Special One comment means. I certainly did have direct involvement with several of my HR colleagues. The issue was that my job was got rid of in a dubious restructure and I was offered an 'equivalent', 'suitable' one that I felt was neither. My lawyer agreed with me and my employers wouldn't make me redundant but (eventually) paid me a settlement. They clearly didn't feel that their argument would stand up in a tribunal or against an employment lawyer.

I don't understand the language of infantilisation on this thread where if someone raises something that's a concern at work, they're 'running to the teacher' or are not a 'grown adult'. I personally was pleased to leave behind the world of going behind people's backs, along with favouritism, cliquery, and ganging up and bullying, when I left school. I find it much more adult to be transparent about issues that involve me, my colleagues and our work culture and to have them brought into the light and discussed.
How many more people apart from the OP might have been phoned up and harassed/intimidated about this issue of contributing to presents? Is that likely to conduce to a positive and harmonious work environment, and might managers not like to know about events that might affect their staff's relationships and morale? What is not 'grown up' about that?

The issue was that my job was got rid of in a dubious restructure and I was offered an 'equivalent', 'suitable' one that I felt was neither. My lawyer agreed with me and my employers wouldn't make me redundant but (eventually) paid me a settlement. They clearly didn't feel that their argument would stand up in a tribunal or against an employment lawyer.

means nothing of the sort. They’re often used to get rid of problem employees without too much fuss or to limit how much time (and money) we spend arguing with them.

Well, aren't you just a delight?
You're not doing much to improve how I feel about HR people.
I wasn't a 'problem employee', well, except to the new spreadsheet-wielding crop of middle managers who were parachuted in to carve up our previously happy and functional workplace. My other colleagues who they decided they wanted to get rid of were only a 'problem' to them too.

Anyway, that's just a derail really. My thoughts about what a transparent, positive and harmonious work environment might look like and how one might achieve that, and why it's not 'running to the teacher' or any other Mean Girls-inflected remarks along those lines, are much more to the point.

What she did (putting you on loudspeaker so everyone could hear) is nothing short of bullying.she deliberately set out to challenge you , if I was her boss and I got to hear about what she did I'd haul her in and make her apologise to you and put her on a warning.

No is a full sentence

“Am I on speaker?”

whatever the person is trying to shame you with. Shame her back using the way she/he tries to do it.
usually does the trick. And they don’t come back. They are angry birds after though coz they might have thought they won’t be caught.

Stand proud. You've just told a whole load of Senior Management that you can't be bullied into contributing money for someone you don't like. That you don't think he's worth it. And that they don't pay you enough for you to be able to...

She was trying to shame you into giving money. Probably because they've bought the present already and will need to ask others for more money if you don't cough up.

You could've also donated 50p...

she COULD have done, but not being able to afford something ISN'T something to be ashamed of. not being well off ISN'T something to be ashamed or embarrassed about, and people need to stop treating it like it is. it's a reality for many people, not a character flaw.

She was trying to bullly you into giving cash and probably trying to embarrass you in the process. I have recently been in a similar situation but not to do with money. I would be speaking or emailing her to explain she was unprofessional the way she asked you.

It is not a part of your job description to pay for birthday presents or be involved in a telephone meeting which is a trap laid for you. Honestly I would leave the company which has bullying culture by announcing my resignation on that very phone call. However you still need money lol so I would just say "My salary given to me by XYZ COMPANY does not stretch far enough to use for social events." Or "I will not be contributing due to personal reasons I do not need to share with you. Please do not ask me non professional questions again. Thank you" What I really want to say is "If you wanna licker the boss's but go ahead but keep me out of these things"

I can’t believe you’ve been hounded again for this. Contributions should be put in an envelope anonymously so that there’s no pressure or comparing. I’d seriously be saying, “I’ve been asked three times. It now sounds like it’s not voluntary and you’d quite like to just deduct it directly from my salary!”

Oh PLEASE. Don't dump it on HR - it's not their role to manage interactions between adults; deal with it at the source, don't expect HR to "be the parent", they have enough to do as it is.
If you felt uncomfortable discussing the matter publicly, then it would have been reasonable to say I don't want to talk about this at the moment and I'll get back to you. You can then follow up with an e-mail to say that for personal reasons you don't wish to discuss, it isn't possible for you to make a contribution and you would have preferred that the OP hadn't forced that conversation to take place publicly as it made it very difficult for you. Put the emotion back on the OP and if they don't get it, don't sweat about it but congratulate yourself that you took control of the situation.

What do you mean " dump it on HR"?

Surely an important function of HR is to clamp down on work place bullying? And to try to shame someone into making what should be a voluntary contribution in front of other colleagues is bullying.

Do you work in HR by any chance and are anxious to keep your work load as light as possible?

😂😂😂😂😂

I worked 8:30am till 11:30pm last night. HR doesn’t have “light workload”.

Not are we there to “clamp down” on anything. Managers manage, HR supports. Ideally the grown ups we employ are able to have grown up conversations when they don’t like something, without needing to call on someone else to do it for them.