To think it’s obvious why the birth rate is falling

[workidoos]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnvj3j27nmro.amp

Life is prohibitively expensive in this country. We earn the UK average income each and can’t foresee being able to comfortably have a second child without the financial impact being too great. I understand sacrifices can be made but in addition to extortionate childcare and the essentials we want to be able to afford extracurriculars, birthday parties, Christmases, trips away for us and DD and some basic savings for her future. I’m not talking private school or extravagant holidays either. With another this would be harder, I’d have to definitely work full time and for longer to afford it and thus losing out on work life balance for what’s likely to be increased mental load and stress in some way or another.

On a local group someone was saying it’s over £100 for two adults and a child to enter a festive park nearby and see Santa. Mind boggling. As a family of 3 it then feels like the natural choice to stay that way, despite the fact we always saw ourselves with a bigger family.

Does this sound like anyone else’s situation? AIBU to think this news shouldn’t be a surprise?

I think the major reason birth rate is falling is money but I also think the push for people to go to university and equality meaning women have broader horizons than family planning and realistically are only 5 years or so into a career if they have kids at 30. You are far better off progressing your career before children so women are likely to have children later. Another factor is pension age. Where as years ago grandparents would often step in now if you have a 30 year old having their first child and their mother and father were 30 when they had them they have a few more years to go before they can retire. Childcare is crippling. I would rather have 1 child and provide a comfortable life than 2 or 3 and struggle

People don't like to breed in captivity.

Bit of a weird one, but I wonder if something is happening biologically. The practical reasons above for a declining birth rate make perfect sense, but when I was late 20s I was hit overnight with the most intense broodiness. Decisions about whether we were renting or had bought a house didn’t factor, it was an overwhelming need to have a baby.

We know that fertility rates are declining, even when accounting for the increased age of men and women when they start trying for a baby. I just wonder if there’s also been a dulling of women’s biological clocks too (alongside a tonne of practical/physical factors as mentioned in this thread!).

A surprisingly high percentage of pregnancies are unplanned.

Since 2005 the NHS has been actively encouraging long-acting reversible contraception (IUDs / implant) over short term ones like the pill. There are now fewer opportunities for contraceptive failure.

Male fertility is declining in young men. When we think of infertility we think of people actively trying to conceive, but it will be having an effect on the accidental pregnancy rates too.

Teenagers are having less sex. We have social media to thank for this one apparently.

@Foxblue I agree with you. Women can't help but see how useless men can be, especially when children come along.

I was chatting to my mum about this the other day. In her day, it wasn’t common to have foreign holidays, trips to theme parks and other days out, meals out happened on a special occasion only, furniture was second hand. Cars were bangers, people didn’t have the ‘latest’ technology when it came out because they can’t afford it (or they prioritised other things). Kids would have 1 or 2 days out in the summer, not multiple days out every week. Most of the summer was spent playing in the garden.

People live expensive lives nowadays, so it’s no wonder people struggle to be able to afford a second or third child

Partly because they don’t have access to contraception and the cost of living is not as high (but obviously the quality of life is lower too).

I think only a very priviledged and middle class minority of British society are choosing to not have children because of global warming...

A visit to Santa isn't a necessity. You can just do cheap/free things instead. If you want a second you make it work even if it means waiting until your eldest starts school.

Why is it a privileged persons choice?

It's hard to afford housing these days.

Council housing is hard to get.

Private rentals are insecure and particularly crap if you have kids at school and potentially have to move every 6-12 months

Private housing is typically hard to afford and small.

Grandparents are typically older and working longer themselves and less able to provide childcare.

I’m not privileged and global warming wasn’t part of my decision to not have children (I was only 3 when I decided and it wasn’t even something anyone talked about then), but it’s certainly a factor in why I never changed my mind and never will.

A lot of my colleagues want to have children but it isn't happening - or taking longer to happen. I get told as I am seen as the shoulder to cry on and older than many.
Most are working too hard, having to do post graduate qualifications, and commuting long distances as are their partners so are stressed (and possibly even too tired to do the deed). Eventually some get pregnant but struggle with childcare etc.
Their parents are living quite a distance away and often in other countries.

I totally agree its very obvious why the birth rate is falling.

Money is the main, but not the only reason.

Wages are pretty crap here & have stagnated for years.

"... i find myself wondering how much of a role feminism has played in it..."
I think this is unfair, women can't win any way we play the mens game.
"If the men in charge want us to have more children they are really going to have to step it up in terms of making it worth our while."
Or they could just remove women's rights altogether, and the ability to complain or protest about it (which by the way is happening right now).

Maybe, yes but I also think there’s a definite shift. We’re talking not even wanting to date / not sleeping with anyone / no romance stuff at all. This has been well documented (several people have said social media has resulted in less sex etc between younger people). People aren’t suddenly going to get to 35 and pop out 2.4 kids if they’re not even dating earlier than that. Society is really different now.

There is always clear correlation between educationevel and number of children born per women in statistics.

I genuinely think women are having fewer children now because they want more from life than just being a mother. I love my daughter but I don't want any more children because if I had more I would have to start giving up my hobbies and personal interests and probably move to a smaller house to reduce the mortgage, and I don't want to!

Women with lower education levels tend to have more children in developed countries despite having fewer resources and I think that is because they don't see other things for them in life other than having children so they have more, because they have less to give up to do so.

In essence when you give women lots of options, the option of multiple children instead of everything else available to them if they have none or one is less attractive.

Agree with lots of others that it’s the cost of living. I went part time after my first so when my second maternity leave came around we barely got through it financially. We are stuck in a house we will outgrow even without having a third. I’m happy with two but wouldn’t really be able to have a third if we wanted to.

You were 3 years old when you decided to not have children?

We were fortunate and could have afforded to have two children and it not have a major impact on our lifestyle. But a rubbish pregnancy, awful birth and piss poor post natal care put me off having another so DS remained an only child.

Because plenty of very poor people have childen and plenty of abysmally poor countries don't have a problem with birth rates

In developing countries it makes sense to have more dc. Also dc in Sahara are not going to have a carbon footprint anything like adults in the UK.

I completely agree with you OP.

My husband and I are very fortunate to be high earners and bring home about £0.5m between us each year. Even so when I accidentally fell pregnant with our third I was stressed about the financials which I realise may sound insane but of course we have a high mortgage and I’d need to take time off work and have several more years of nursery costs.

I recently booked tickets to the winter wonderland in Hyde Park. I am aware it’s a treat but to get in, do some ice skating and book a few rides/activities for the four of us is in excess of £200 and that’s before we’ve had anything to eat/drink and without buying ride passes for the little ones. I bought it at the same time I ordered our Christmas tree and some decorations and was mindful I’d spent hundreds of pounds very easily - buying things most families would want for Christmas time.

Meh, I think people’s view of desire for ‘stuff’ over family is overblown.

I think what is more likely is people lack the time and space to have a decent quality of life, and in 2024 it’s not so acceptable to cram loads of kids in a small flat and make them share beds, not have time or resources to care for them and make sure they are successful in life.

When I was a kid we had lots of foreign holidays, new cars, a big house, private school, stay at home mum etc etc - and I want more than my parents and can’t afford a similar lifestyle. Just affording the house is frankly laughable - everyone on their street is a pensioner.

I've literally only ever heard extremely wealthy, usually left-wing and privileged people say they don't want children because of global warming.