WWYD Ambushed By Ex's Family

[LoneWolfOfThePack]

Hi,

I have a previous thread on here about ex and contact with my dd so won't go into too much detail again about it here to try to keep it as short, but for context I have a 10 week old DD, haven't been with her dad since I found out about the pregnancy and has had no contact so far. Social services have completed a risk assessment on him and have recommended supervised contact in a contact center funded by him... there has been no action on this so far and the last interaction I had with him was over 2 weeks ago when I told him to seek legal advice if he wasnt happy with what the ss recommended for court. He threw a strop, got abusive and I had to block him again.

The issue... today I went with a family member and their child to a local market stall type event. I saw 1 of exs sisters there and attempted the best I could to avoid her until she approached me and asked if I was lonepack, I said yes and she immediately picked up my sleeping DD out of her pram. A couple seconds later exs mother, other sister and 8 kids (assuming theirs) surrounded me and the pram so I couldn't move and proceeded to pass DD between them. Still not once did they ask if that was okay.

They then bombarded me with questions about why they can't have contact, they can't get in touch with the social worker, etc etc. They also confirmed (unintentionally I think) that ex had indeed been continuing to lie to myself and social services to downplay his risk.

They say that they want contact with my DD without ex knowing or being present. In a panic to get DD back so I could leave I said I'd think about it and gave them my number then practically ran away before I had an anxiety attack or worse they contacted ex to join in the ambush.

I will be notifying SS of this interaction tomorrow but I don't know what to do moving forward. Its shook me up abit as I've not had any interaction with any of them (apart from exs harassment) in almost a year until today.

Does anyone have any advice moving forward? WWYD in my situation? Do I let them have contact in the agreement that ex has no knowledge or involvement?

Honestly, they have shown you who they are - if they had of shown some respect to you and asked to pick her up and waited until you had said yes, then I would consider it. But they fact they did it without waiting for you to agree shows to me they care more about what they want then what you think is best for your DD.
My mother discovered through ancestry DNA that my brother's step daughter, who he has lost contact with about 10 years prior, was actually her biological granddaughter. This girl's mother had told my brother her ex husband was the dad not him and this was later proved not to be true through ancestor DNA, but this was only because my parents had put their DNA into the database a few years after this girl's dad had so everyone suspected the girl did not know the truth.
This girl lived 10mins from my mum but my mum respected my brother's view that the girl did likely not now know her dad was not her biological dad, and since she was in her teen years, no one wanted to throw a grenade into her life but waltzing back into her life with the news.
When she was 18 contact started again and now she knows that she is part of our family.

They acted like a pack. They think your DD belongs to their pack. You do not.

That makes them a serious threat. They can conspire against you and have all their numbers to back up their own version of anything that happened.

Use a ring doorbell or move- ideally both.

Keep your DD harnessed in her pram. Get a cover for the clip. Next time you won’t be taken by surprise and can leave before they see you, or simply don’t stop if they see you first. They’ll struggle to get the baby out of she’s strapped in, with a clip cover and a blanket, and you keep moving.

You don’t need to have SS involved to go to a contact centre.

SS are involved because of your past but they won’t be for long because you are doing everything right.

However, even when SS aren’t involved, you can still refuse ex contact unless it’s in a contact centre because SS have deemed him high risk.

If ex went to court demanding access and you’ve got proof that SS have deemed him high risk then that’s all the judge will need to know.
They would in no way allow him to have contact unsupervised.

You can also request that the family have supervised visits because you cannot guarantee that they won’t let him see her.

Just maintain that if anyone wants contact, they will have to go through the contact centres and blame SS and say you want to do it all by the book.

OP, is it possible to move away? There was someone close to my family in a similar situation a few years ago and without going into the horrible details, it didn't end well for the DC.

If it is possible to move away, and change your surname so you can't be found by them then I would do it. The whole family sounds unhinged and dangerous.

It’s good that your ex has refused contact with baby in a contact centre unless you are-there. Because that shows social services ( and perhaps later a court ) that he doesn’t care about his DD.

Now you know that your exs family are stalking you on social media, so you need to delete all your accounts or make them totally private. And get your family members to do the same . Don’t let ANYONE post any photos of your DD online , lots of Grandparents do this without understanding who can see these photos eg friends of friends.

it’s very easy to post photos with things in the background that give a clue to location , it can be simple to track someone down.

You do not answer their calls
You do not open the door, if you get trapped again say you have moved, changed number, & give them a false one.
Consider moving.

Basically the father is not on the birth cert, so they are not actually any kind of official relation.

You sound new to Mumhood. Do not be one bit afraid to decide who holds and does not hold your wee baby. You are the protector of your child. Nobody (relatives or otherwise) can come along and lift the child out of her cot or pushchair. For the future smile politely and say No she is not to be lifted/moved/ cuddled at the moment. "she is sleeping/tired/ just been fed/ ready for home/bed". Speak to the services and ask if one or two family can come with the Dad to the centre. Baby would still have contact only in a controlled safe environment. You will meet backlash/anger from you making decisions that do not always suit him/family but it is your baby on your terms. Bear in mind if you agree to "meet family for coffee" monthly the Dad would take the opportunity to push in and come along so start in the contact centre first and foremost. A wolf will always protect her cub..😊

They may not have been lying in wait but all of them rushing over, surrounding her and taking the baby out of the pram and passing her round is an ambush. She was overwhelmed and scared.

One of them at least is advocating for the abusive ex so OP does not feel that she and their baby are safe in their presence.

@LoneWolfOfThePack you should have left the moment you saw them and yelled for help when they grabbed your daughter. Per pp's I'd move. In the meantime, up your security, vary your routine and driving routes, provide a report of the incident to cps and file a police report insisting on action. You cannot spare any measure to protect your child. File before they do and petition for visitation.

This sounds sinister...can you move as far as possible OP away from this awful family? If not for you then for your daughter. I'd be changing name as well for you and your daughter and trying to be as untraceable as possible. They actually do sound dangerous..I'm sorry also anyone who picks up a baby out of the pram without the mother's approval, they are never in the right! What if she'd kidnapped the baby?! And your friend may just be shaken up by they don't sound particularly helpful in a moment when you could have done with support. They sound honestly like a travelling family I once had the displeasure of having to deal with. They all crowded round so I couldn't leave and intimidated me. It's obviously a tactic of theirs and sounds similar to the family you describe. It's intimidation. If it ever happens again scream and shout at the top of your lungs helllp they are kidnapping my baby! That will make them stop pretty damn quick if they are just about intimidation. I'm sorry for your situation but I would be getting the hell away from it if I were you. You shouldn't have to, but safety first and you have your beautiful child to think about! Well done on getting away in the first instance from an abusive relationship. Maybe more distance is needed! Next time someone asks are you so and so, say I'm sorry, who did you say you were? Whilst turning your pram to face you/leaning over your child to protect.

Gosh how awful to have a total stranger not only remove your little newborn from their pram but to also hand them onto another stranger.

I would buy a sling and in any time you leave the house on foot, put your baby in a sling.

Then I would move away from the area.

And block them all/change your number.

i wouldn't trust them.

i definitely wouldn't make any arrangements to meet them for coffee or anything else, or answer the door if i knew they were outside.

no idea what your living situation is, but if you're not tied to your curent house then moving might be a good idea - close enough to keep the same SS team but for his family not to know where to find you? if your DD ends up going to nursery/school locally, how likely is it that you'd run into his family members there? i'd consider moving to a different catchment area.

It's good that he isn't on the BC. hopfully he'll continue not making any effort to arrange contact through a contact centre, and end up with very little chance of being given any PR. i can't see anything good coming out of him or his family arranging contact with her; they obviously don't respect you, or her wellbeing.

This probably sums up why it's quite frightening to me moving forward. They/he has this huge hang of protectors on side. I have me and me alone to protect myself and my DD. My GP are elderly and in ill health so whilst can support in a sense they can't physically run to my aid if we need help, my mum I've very low contact with and has never had my back so couldn't guarantee any support from her, and the family member I was with today showed their ability to protect by agreeing with them (regardless of if it was a ploy to help they still did very little in my corner). I also have very few friends. The only person I had as a form of protector of my safety if I ever needed it was my uncle and he died in August so its a scary feeling to know that I'm now very much alone in being the sole protector of my own and my DD against a huge gang of his family.

That's why my reaction today also worries me because if I fail in that and freeze again anything could happen so its something I really need to work on as a matter of urgency.

Also, I hate to sound terribly dark, it’s equally dangerous if they decide she is ‘not pack’. It’s reminding me of an awful animal video where the young male chimps were throwing a baby between them.
It’s a tightrope. Do gather your strategies and practice them. If you go out with a friend, warn her that’s how they behave and that you’ll need to seem quite rude to shake them off. She may be appeased by politeness and tradition, otherwise.

People tend to assume other people are like them. Well intentioned people don’t recognise ill intent in others. Malicious people see malice in the most innocent behaviour.
You know this family don’t have the best interests of your baby at heart. They have their own desires and wants and sense of ownership in play.

To answer a couple of questions thats been raised...

I don't have any personal ties to my house no, it's rented so it would be easy to move. It would be financially difficult to a degree to up and leave immediately though but I'm going to speak to SS tomorrow to see if they can help with moving,whether it's to provide a supporting letter to the council or a LL or something. I could look at moving closer to work though but further away from family.

I'm not on SM personally apart from IG but its under a different surname and difficult to know its mine as its purposely set to be unidentifiable, neither are my GP who are the only people i have regular contact with, so there is no risk of my location or photos being shared. The family members profile they said they looked at today has 1 photo of me on from 4 years ago so they obviously had to do some digging.

My home is currently semi secure by alarms, additional locks, dummy cameras etc but I do agree that I may need physical evidence and protection to not answer my door by mistake so I've ordered a camera and a ring doorbell so both sides are covered. I'll collect that and install tomorrow.

Also i forgot to add...

I currently cant strap DD in or cover any straps in her pram as she is still in the carrycot attachment so is quite easy to pick up and put down. Which was obviously why it took a split second for the sister to pick her up today. So whilst I will look into a sling, is there anything I could do to make her more safe in the pushchair for now? I don't think she's old enough to move to the regular stroller harness type yet.

and for obvious reasons I cant use a strategy that would be perceived as me appearing mentally unstable in public, especially not infront of people who are clearly looking for something to go in their favour for DD , so I don't think I could scream and shout like a mad woman like some people have recommended. For 'regular' people that would seem like an obvious reaction without question, but with someone with a history like mine paired with someone who's already tried the "deranged mad women" route, it could be seen as very red flaggy to certain people.

@LoneWolfOfThePack part of why you need to file reports to ss and police. They will likely advise you to yell if surrounded/approached again, but do ask for advice. Also, women's aid is a good resource for strategies to be safer and what to do when threatened - which you were. Picking up your baby was a threat. A test to see what you'd allow and if you'd defend.

You know your ex and who/what he is like. The family may be like him or maybe not. If it were me, I’d initially give the benefit of doubt & allow contact (with yourself present) with the grandmother. Then take it slowly, take a view, keep your options open and your spider senses alert. They may be a blessing or a chore, only time will tell.

I've already given my opinion regarding the situation but If you want an extra layer between the baby and outside world. You could use a snooze shade but then baby won't get the benefit of the sunlight. I think a baby carrier is your best bet. I had this one from Amazon. It work well and was cheap. It would be a quick option. Also, I'd wear it under your coat so no one can tamper with the buckles.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Infantino-Flip-4-Convertible-Carrier/dp/B07XMN3SK6/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=3741D5R502FAX&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.i3-jkqN9NM8yq9rLCjS-jvUlD3PWx_LYE9JQ9oflvYXsOesX47lpNXMiqpHnSo8vG1UxsrV5BVkHwBDMzlB3w6IXM30sQ-Ci5L4u0p8S7hgHhVa6deUl8Q32YNPvB4kOWzQG9WkmQqKS0uoOhID_y5jYEborW0N_jrdpzjZPzY4f3GCXFECepnqkjBH7lQIGI9Ub1kq1LybUoSGvOHRa3g.SSmQ53IKcW8wvGl8p0PY5u12AlEYZpOF4nFjKOmbvj8&dib_tag=se&keywords=baby+carrier+newborn&qid=1730057245&sprefix=baby+carrier+new%2Caps%2C105&sr=8-3

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SnoozeShade-Plus-Deluxe-Sunshade-Months/dp/B00C9D1A4Q/ref=asc_df_B00C9D1A4Q/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=696352643964&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=6358483099593801254&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9046010&hvtargid=pla-593592074364&psc=1&mcid=399ff5c53ed23165b69d0141455359a0&gad_source=1

The grandmother I.e his mother is who I'm concerned about the most as she and ex live together. Along with the sister who keeps calling the social worker on his behalf. They seemed very coy, stared through me, talked about me and DD as if I wasn't even there and said they (the sister) could of informed ex where I was but chose not to. They seemed more judgey suspicious in that sense.

The sister who approached me seemed reasonable and was chatty, she was the one who dropped ex in it about his lies and how he (badly) played the SS about his drug addiction in his last appointment but she was also the one who grabbed DD out the pram and pushed for contact or waiting for ss to disappear. She was very intimidating.

Then the 8 kids. One of those kids is pregnant and apparently has the same social worker though I'm not sure how true that is as I believe they may of said that to try and prevent me saying anything to ss.

Thank you for those links@2Little I've just ordered the baby carrier, so that should be here tomorrow too.

OP I think one thing to consider is that if you express your feelings to SS about the family, which you should, they will be looking for clear signs that your priority is to protect your daughter. It’s clear you’re frightened and intimidated of them, so they will probably want to hear that you don’t want them seeing your daughter.
Also just a simple thing, but do you have a spy hole in your door and a chain? These are really simple ways of stopping anyone from intimidating their way in.

Oh @ttcat37 there is no question in me not telling ss. I'm going to call them first thing in the morning and I'm seeing them in the afternoon anyways. Not just to be transparent and for my daughters sake but I recognise that I need this highlighted because ss aren't going to be around for much longer and I need all the resources and support I can get in place with this because I am on my own in managing our safety and I can't risk another encounter where I freeze again because the outcome could get worse. Plus it gives another form documentation for concerns.

I have a chain on my front door yes but no spy hole so no way of knowing who is ar that door, which is annoying as it's the door my post comes. The back door has a pane of frosted glass so I can usually tell by sight if it's someone I'm expecting or not.

Move far away and immediately change your (and DD’s) last name and phone number. Obviously never contact any of them again, and don’t tell social services.

OP get a video doorbell. Even a non recording one is better than none at all. You need to be able to see who is at the door before you open it.