Ex trying to reclaim money from child

[Preeel]

18 months ago my ex went back to university to train to be a teacher. During that time period, he was technically ‘unemployed’ (he did receive a grant, but that’s irrelevant in CMS’ view). As such, the child maintenance calculator reduced his payment to £0. His father, my child’s grandfather, then got involved and said he would continue to pay £50 a week in maintenance on behalf of his son as it wasn’t right that our child wasn’t supported. This money was paid via the grandfather to my ex, then he would transfer it to me.

My ex is finally employed and the maintenance calculator has said he needs to pay £100 a week. However, my ex is now claiming that the CMS should subtract all of the money that his father paid over the 18 months, therefore reducing his sum of £100 a week. It’s almost £4,000. I disagree as this was never the agreement, and I was never told that essentially I would need to pay this money back. It was a gentleman’s agreement if you like between the three of us to make sure our child continued to be supported.

AIBU or has my ex got a case to claim this money back?

That makes much more sense than them wanting to 'refund' him money. OP, as others have said, ring CMS and explain the situation honestly to a human and tell them what he is saying will happen re the money.

This x

What a shitbag deadbeat.

His Father paid money for his Grandchild to cover a period where he was getting no CM. And so now because of that your ex thinks that his child should go through a period of receiving no CM now that he is working 🤦🏼‍♀️ It beggars belief.

I absolutely would call his Dad and dob him in! I bet he has absolutely no idea his son is trying to screw over his own child.

And phone CM and tell them the truth of what happened - that no he did no voluntarily overpay, the money came from the Grandfather as a gift. And that you do not think that your child should be penalised going forwards.

Can't deny it's the first thing I thought too.

Some men really are that shitty

It makes me wild when people say 'Oh my DC's parent (need to remember not just the father) is 'good' because they will buy shoes. school uniform, help with school trips etc etc when needed, but no regular maintenance. What DCs need is a roof over their heads, the utility bills paid, food on the table etc. Shoes, school trips etc are the icing on the cake &, yes, IMO, they should pay towards that as well as regular maintenance that the parent with care has to pay.

...and this

Just disagree. Surely, if CMS asks for proof, he will show them his account which has money coming from the grandfather and to you. If this was a ‘loan’ in any way, then it was clearly a loan between a father and his adult son who has been unwilling to financially support his young child. Now that your ex is earning again, HE can repay that, not you.

I thought the amount was closer to £4000

Disagree. Tell them the money was specifically from your exFIL who was ashamed of the fact his son wasn't supporting his child.

Let CMS sort it out.

Tell your ex that you won't be doing that. That you'll tell cms that your child's grandfather decided to help feed his grandchild while their father wouldn't. And that if he wants to claim.otherwise then he'll need to prove the money didn't come from his dad.

Hopefully he'll back off from that if he's got to somehow prove he deserves money offset because someone else contributed to putting food in his child's mouth while he decided it was an optional extra because the law is an ass on this issue.

Yeah my maths are off again, sorry. It still won't be taxable though, at least not by the recipient. The grandfather can pay £3k in gifts annually. Per annum he has paid the son £2.6k so assuming he hasn't paid gifts to anyone else he is below the threshold. If he is above the threshold because of gifts to others, then the two of them could easily claim it was a "soft loan" too. If he were above the threshold, it would be the grandfather rather than the son who was subject to tax.

TBH I don’t think it’s going to be possible to prove that the money came from the grandfather.

All the ex has to say is that the grandfather gave him money while he was at uni and he decided to use it to support his child.

Unless there is evidence to suggest that the money was given for the child and the child only it’s going to be impossible to prove.

you’re going to be better off appealing to your ex fIL’s better judgement here.

I know we desperately need teachers but we don’t need teachers who behave like your ex!

As a pp has said, I'm surprised cms are even interested. They don't normally look backwards or where money came from.

They're usually only interested in the date from which someone lodges an appeal or application.

The application has been in place for 4 years. He was ordered to pay £50 a week, for 2 and a half years, then went to university for 18 months. His father said he would pay the £50 whilst my ex was at university as the CMS then calculated his maintenance as £0 and my ex FIL (DC’s grandfather) didn’t feel that was right so continued with the £50. Now he’s a qualified teacher and owes £100 a week, he’s told the CMS he has already voluntarily paid almost £4000 when he didn’t have to.

What an absolute shit of a man he is.

Just tell cms no, he's not paid.

If he entered into a loan agreement, it's nothing to do with you.

he’s told the CMS he has already voluntarily paid almost £4000 when he didn’t have to.

And their reply to that should be "so fucking what".

I would agree with saying that he hasn't paid.

You'd hope a teacher would have morals, especially towards supporting a child (and his own!).

What. A. Knob. His dad must be disgusted by him.

Let us know how you get on with grandad, I hope ex buckles, the waste of space.

That's a disagree.

It doesn’t matter though. The paying parent is welcome to pay more if they choose to do so. They can’t reclaim it later on. He can only reclaim it if CMS miscalculated and overcharged him.
Voluntary payments only make a difference if there is arrears, and he can say he already paid some and they’ll take the amount off the total he owes. They cannot reclaim the money from you.

He was given a zero calculation. He chose to pay anyway (well, his dad did but let’s just say he chose to pay anyway). That’s a private arrangement outside of the CMS calculation and he can’t claim it back after the fact.

CMS are wrong here.

If they can do that then anyone can claim back any ‘overpayments’ makes no sense.

So this man who is now a teacher to children thinks it's reasonable for his own child to go without.

That is what it boils down to.

I'd probably try to find a way to make his school's headteacher know what he was like, tbh.

Oh I see. So, say he has £700 arrears from September (he didn’t declare to CMS that his income had changed, I had to update them) they will use his claimed £4000 voluntary payments to wipe the arrears? But that’s still not correct as he owed £100 per week from September, but his dad only paid £50, so he’s still in arrears and the £4000 shouldn’t be used to wipe them anyway ?

that was what I thought based on what I’d read online until I read the post that someone linked upthread where a poster had been told by CMS that they would be able to reclaim voluntary overpayments.

And as this is an ongoing claim rather than a new one it does sound as if OP may not have a leg to stand on.

The ex is a prize cunt for doing it though.