To think Christmas at PILs is unsustainable?

[Jimot]

There is a backstory here in that PILs moved to a two up two down cottage/terrace in a semi rural area in the COVID no stamp duty era. They previously lived in a bigger house much closer to us and liked to have people over. They are now an hour away. We tried to gently broach how their lifestyle was going to work with the house when they were planning the move but they didn't want to hear it. Since then we had DS and PILs have been resentful that we don't have them do regular childcare, and don't accept really that the logistics wouldn't work, I think they just believe I'm favouring my parents and being awkward. We see them roughly once a fortnight on average although they would say we don't bother seeing them enough.

The house is small. So is our house, so it's not about being snobby over it, but they seem to still want to host like they used to.
Recently MIL complained that she would offer to host an extended family get together but no one ever wants to drive out to see them, and DH said in the car in the way back how he wondered where they were planning on putting everyone if they did host. PIL like to have DH and I and DS plus SIL and her DH over at the same time. There aren't enough seats in the living room for the adults so someone needs to sit on the floor. DS already tends to end up banging his head on furniture when playing as there is very limited floor space. If we eat at the table in the kitchen folding chairs are needed and we all need to shuffle around with our backs against the wall. We tend to spend a weekend with them including an overnight to do Christmas together. This is already changing as when a baby DS would sleep in a double with us to stay over but now he just won't sleep in bed with us and there is no room to put a camp bed down.
Now SIL is expecting next year and I've found out I am too!
We were talking about Christmas and I said next year maybe we had better book a pub with a soft play to be able to accommodate us all, or maybe even go away somewhere after Xmas. MIL was absolutely spitting feathers, absolutely indignant that we would be having family Christmas at their house and began speaking about the extra furniture they're going to purchase. I didn't really say much else although I was thinking that this was really no solution. Maybe we will be able to bring folding highchairs next year and keep babies on laps but even so, soon enough there just literally won't be room to fit in 6 adults and 3 children. They already don't have a Christmas tree as there is no room for one.

So was I unreasonable in my assertion about pub or going away? I do feel a little guilty as I do realise they want all their family together but to me it doesn't matter what the location is. I already find it a bit uncomfortable at their house but I'm dreading next year as feel like we are going to be literally squished in thigh to thigh and I won't be able to relax trying to manage the kids not being trodden on.

I'm happy to be hit with it though if I'm just totally selfish! AIBU?

I hate it when people say things like “well all squeeze in” - usually they’re the people who will be retaining their own bed and not squeezing at all.

In a busy Christmas household, people also need a retreat to just get a quick break and re-centre. A bit like a dog would need a retreat.

This is one of the reasons that older people are reluctant to downsize.

My greatest pleasure in life is hosting my family and extended family. If I downsize, that's yet another thing I lose, alongside all the memories that are bound up in my home of 35 years.

I don't blame you OP, and would feel the same. But I hope that MNers remember this when they can't understand why their parents aren't keen to downsize.

I'd hoped the experience of COVID-19 lockdowns would have demonstrated that, for some people, it is less stressful and much more pleasant to stay at home for days like this.

This. And they are your husband's parents and it is only for one or 2 days/nights.
No big deal

It depends, there is squeezing and the is an uncomfortable nightmare.

Honestly, you are not wrong. That's the problem with doing the same thing year on year.
My oldest dds are now adults, one with a child. I am standing firm in my view that people should do what they want for Xmas, this year 1 dd is staying at home, 1 dd will likely turn up at some point.
Decide how you would like to do Christmas this year. Offer suitable suggestions for get togethers over the Xmas period ( an hour is hardly a long distance).
Stick to it.

I'd say make excuses this year because of pregnancy. Next year go. Make sure dc is hyped up and sugared. I'm sure after actually experiencing the reality of 9 people in their house they'll never suggest it again. Also if you do this make sure dh drives as you couldn't this year given pregnancy so even if it is a shit show you'll be too blotto to care.

Or, more sensibly, just accept that Christmas itself is a non-goer and if they want to host do something in the daytime with a buffet or whatever so you dont need to all sit down and, if dry can open up a door to the back garden for the kids, on 23rd 27th that you can go to and drive home afterwards or stay in a hotel overnight you'll consider that.

It's not demanding to want to spend Christmas not sitting on the floor, and, particularly for young kids, that is actually decorated for Christmas!

It's perfectly possible to downsize and still have hosting space. My older relatives have gone into a 2 bed bungalow but converted it to a 1 bed with a much larger reception room to entertain in. Its perfect as they've a lot of local family visiting a lot.

I don't know your financial status but would you be able to do something like the following -
Send out a message to Bil & SiL, PiL (plus anyone else that would normally be gathering under the one roof for Christmas Day dinner) and say "Hi folks - I won a little money on the national lottery (think Match 4 and the bonus, not the jackpot) so as a new family tradition, they have to start somewhere to become a tradition don't you know, I was thinking of spending £100 per family towards booking X location for Christmas Eve, Christmas Day and Boxing Day. This will be a once off where I'll be able to contribute but if it works out, it could become our new way to do Christmas. Families will have to make up the difference in the costs of this mini Christmas break and we'd work out food/drink if this plan was to go ahead. Look forward to hearing from you all on this suggestion"

The location that you'd include in the message would either be a hotel or some self catering location that has individual houses side by side so you could each rent a house/lodge and pop in to each other's houses over the three days. It would also mean that at the end of each day you could close and lock your front door to other relatives popping in and have a quiet night.

I've done a very quick search and while I know the price is a LOT for this place, it's more the photo that I'm going on where you can see several of these lodges located beside each other and you would each book your own lodge:
https://www.holidaycottages.co.uk/cottage/91728-wildflower-lodge-6?n=3&sd=24122024

Just a suggestion - I have no way of knowing how good/bad/indifferent that location is as I've never been. I'm purely looking at the layout and photo of the place as a suggestion to guide you.

In theory, maybe ......

Stick to your guns OP!

Out of interest, do you ever see your own parent’s Christmas day or do PIL also expect you to go to them?

If she wants to host then she has to accept that the house they chose for day to day living is just not big enough. Your Dh needs to talk to them and suggest hiring somewhere where everyone has their own space/room as well as being able to come together. Whether that is one property or a couple of cottages usually rented out by the same company close together.

When my parents downsized they knew it would now fall to my sister to host Christmas which worked out really well.

This is almost my exact situation, only mine moved even further away. We gave Christmas at theirs a go, it was exhausting. No one slept well (crammed into bedrooms, blow up beds in the living room), the kids woke up at the crack of dawn and we had to keep them quiet - Christmas is at ours this year.

It’s not your fault that your PILs didn’t foresee this consequence of their move. It’s also fine to have different priorities for Christmas to your PILs. Plus you’ve offered two very reasonable alternatives.

we always used to alternate Christmas with each set of parents and then when our children were born stopped. We do still get together on a different day but I much prefer doing Christmas Day to our schedule, having the children in their own beds and some control without everyone getting totally over-hyped. Both parents have large houses so space has just about worked but is getting harder as children grow. I wouldn’t find it fun in a small house at all. One one set we’ve got 4 kids of very similar age in one bedroom and my daughter is starting to get pissed off with it and probably won’t be sustainable in a couple of years time. On the other side, there is quite big age gaps and it has worked for many years but has reached a point that’s tricky where everyone can’t have a proper bed anymore so probably wouldn’t choose to have everyone stay on the same evening.

Just say no?
Your in laws chose to move and wouldn't consider your valid concerns so let them deal with the consequences of it.
Why on earth people tiptoe around relatives at Christmas is beyond me. It's your day as much as theirs and your dc comfort should come before their demands.
By all means offer an alternative - ie they come to you or a pub lunch like you said. But there's no way I'd be squeezing myself into someone else's cramped and impractical home just to keep them happy at Christmas. Fuck that.

YANBU - when my parents “downsized” (they bought a house that was bigger but in a cheaper area so still released about £200k), one of the biggest priorities was having a “Christmas house”. Consequently they have ended up with a 4 bedroom detached house the two of them with 3 reception rooms plus a large kitchen. Consequently we are all happy for them to carry on hosting as they want to as lots of room for everyone and real bedrooms to stay in with enough toilets.

You ILs made their decision when they decided to buy a small house.

this! And don’t get involved yourself, leave it to her kids…

For years, most of the kids younger years we spent Xmas alternating between parents. Only in the last five years do we now alternate between us and both of them and honestly I much prefer being at home and not doing it sooner. It's far more enjoyable in our own surroundings, the kids prefer being home. It's not about what your mother in law wants all the time, you're your own family now and need to do what's best for you. The logistics there just don't work anymore.

Completely agree. I reached the stage when I just said to my parents and in laws that we would be having Christmas at home once the children arrived. Too bad if they didn't like it.

A typical MN attitude, 'that far away' when it's only an hour! Some people live 'that far away' from their nearest Sainsbury's, it's nothing, even with children!

Your PiL are the selfish ones here, thinking they get to dictate how other people spend their Christmas every single year.

Why not explain that you (expecting) and your child need a bed (and so does SIL and her family), and so your PILs will need to sleep on the floor? Not seriously of course.....but might help hammer it home there's really no space.

You’ve got your own kids now. Perfect opportunity to stick to your own Xmas plans, just like MIL is wanting to stick to hers.

This year we’re deliberately not going anywhere, not going back to my parents’ for the whole Xmas period. Parents coming to us between Xmas and new year. Cannot wait to just chill and not have to drag the kids across the country with all the Xmas presents etc!

Could you invite PIL to come and stay in a B & B near you for Christmas, and you host the festivities? Maybe your DH and his sister need to have a serious talk with them about how their future is going to work out. They can’t expect you to keep travelling an hour each way to see them very often.

Sounds like this isn’t a question of them wanting to all be together though? OP is happy to spend Christmas with them but nobody has a big enough house to host. An entirely different issue to yours.