Kids not wanting to attend SILs wedding after argument

[comfortablynumber]

My sister in law is getting married in 3 weeks. My daughter is a bridesmaid and my son is an usher. However we’ve all just had a huge row and now my children don’t particularly want to go either. Looking for advice.

Both my kids are in private school. Daughter year 10, son year 11. SIL very much disapproves of our choice. She also has a child in year 11. Over a family Sunday lunch we were discussing plans for post GCSE education. We’re not pulling the kids out of school during GCSEs but the fee increase is too much long term. The plan therefore is for them to complete their GCSEs in their current school and hopefully then get a place at the excellent local state school for 6th form. The local school is C of E which is why we couldn’t get in for senior school (I have some thoughts about that, but that’s another thread!) However for 6th form current pupils just have to achieve high GCSEs and new pupils very high GCSEs. They make offers to new pupils based on school predicted grades and the number of applicants etc. Last year for example to get in for A level maths you needed to be predicted a min 7 as well as scoring highly in an exam the school set.

I thought SIL would be happy, but she lost her mind. It was triggered by a comment my son made- he said he was looking forward to going because it would be nice to go somewhere bigger, meet new people and because most of his friends from his current school were also applying. His current school is selective and high achieving. Son is predicted 7-9 in almost everything and most of his friends are the same. We’re talking a year group of 150 kids with at least 50+% now applying to the local school (previously I’d say 10-20% went after GCSEs). This will obviously massively increase the competition for the places they can offer to people who aren’t already pupils.

SIL went off. It’s not fair apparently that her son and his friends may not be offered a place because of competition from kids who had the benefit of private education. She genuinely said that there should be a sort of tier system - like university contextual offers. The thing is, that other than the great C of E school the other school options aren’t good at all (hence us going private.) Son asked SIL if she was saying that because he’d been privately educated she thought he should go somewhere not great for A levels, and she said yes! Apparently he’ll do fine anywhere. Son said he didn’t want to do “fine”- he was aiming for better, and some of the other local schools don’t even offer things like further maths or A levels other than the basics.

DH (her brother) pointed out that the levelling up of state schools she thinks will happen when private schools lose pupils would take some time and there were bound to be issues initially, especially when lots more kids look to go to state schools for A levels in a few years. He’s been pissed off with her for years and pointed out that this is what she wanted. My son and daughter are very upset that their aunt seemingly doesn’t care that much about them.

I’m more sympathetic. Nephew has struggled in the school he’s currently in (also not able to get into C of E school) with low level bullying. He’s had 3 maths teachers in 18 months and his science teachers have been dreadful. The drama teacher is currently filling in in GCSE English lit for unknown reasons and it’s not going well. It’s all been a bit shit and I know they are hugely keen for him to go somewhere different for A level. However his predicted grades aren’t brilliant and he was always borderline as to whether he’d get in based on last years offers- the additional competition may well mess things up for him. SIL has been really upset about his school for a long time which is one of the reasons she’s been so cross about us going private. Apparently the local schools would have been better if the private school and the Cof E didn’t cream off the better pupils. She’s not wrong (don’t want this to be a thread about educational policy though) However my son and daughter are I think rightfully annoyed that she’d be happy to send them there!

It all got very fraught until my MIL nearly burst into tears and people calmed down. However the children are now saying they don’t want to be in her wedding. This is my problem- do I tell them to suck it up (outfits bought, far to late in the day to drop out, not doing it would cause possibly unrecoverable family strife, they love their cousin and my SIL when she’s not upset and speaking without thinking) or do I let them chose not to? They’re young and cross and I’m know they haven’t thought through the long term ramifications.

DH says we should leave them tonight but he’s not exactly impartial. I actually like SIL (despite being often and vocally judged) and think that everyone will end up regretting not going. I also think she’s a worried mother who is seeing the possibility of her child not getting a place somewhere he really wants to go. I’d be upset -and I am upset for nephew.
What do I do?

We all know it's not just about clever though. If it was, no one would pay for private schools.

Do you think if their schools were reversed the gap between their grades would be the same?

Not really. I’m privately educated as are most of my family so I certainly don’t have ‘reverse snobbery’ and I still think the OPs SIL had a valid point and that OPs son just couldn’t handle a differing opinion and chose to get offended.

Thank you @PuddlesPityParty , that's exactly what I meant.

This is one of those moments when you parent your children.
They are going to that wedding and that is it.
Your SIL was wrong to be having this adult discussion with your children and that needs to be addressed.
Schooling is a very sensitive subject with many parents.
Many parents really do make huge sacrifices to pay for a private education for their children.

Personally think that if you are a reasonably clever child and put the effort in, the highest grades are very attainable.

The main difference I see between state and private sector in our area is the level of work expected - those at the nearest private school basically write year 11 off for any fun. The grades follow.

Their choice

That's not the main difference. The main difference is that private education buys a certain peer group for your child (as does any school which places obstacles in the way of admissions - church attendance, academic or musical aptitude, house prices etc). It's a completely understandable impulse but very few people are willing to be honest about it.

While OP can't frog march her children to the wedding she can make clear how their not attending would impact the whole family. Their grandmother would be very upset, it could cause a rift with their cousin who they get on with well.
I would try to help them see it from other peoples point of view.
They are too young to be thinking it through properly.
I wouldn't threaten consequences as a first step, I would reason with them.
They will probably come round-but, if they do dig their heels in I would tell them that you are extremely upset and that they are going to blow up one argument into a huge family rift-and then I would threaten consequences.
Your SIL was in the wrong but your son's immaturity made him respond in an unhelpful way.
I really disagree with the people saying that they have autonomy and it's their choice. I would only apply that if someone in the wedding party had been severely abusive to them.
You are still bringing them up and influencing them and I wouldn't want to bring them up to be someone who was very unforgiving, inconsiderate and always on their high horse.

It also buys a certain number of children in a class, so students get much more attention / support etc to help them achieve higher grades than they would in a state school.

Alongside that, there are many many less DCs with SEN or behavioural issues that disrupt lessons, allowing staff to focus on teaching rather than having to deal with such issues.

The overall environment is filled with DCs who have families who support & value education as compared to state schools where that is not necessarily the case.

All in all, kids in private schools should be achieving 7-9s in GCSEs. A grade 5 in a state school (even a 'good' one) is definitely more akin to a 7 in a private school & it is a pity there wasn't some way to level the playing field for those looking to go to 6th form (& beyond).

Sorry, my reply was in agreement with @OhTediosity & expanding on that.

Of course it is - they’re privileged so they’re obliged to accept ill treatment because of it? Their privilege is something they must compensate others for, in the form of meekly shouldering their aunt’s resentment?

Fuck that. That’s ignorance.

Plenty of state schools offer that too though, as long as you live in the right catchment. It is not something that is limited to private schools.

Seriously? I think you need to work on your reading comprehension and critical thinking skills.

Perhaps the aunt could shoulder the responsibility for causing any rift, given that it was her actions that prompted it.

The onus was on her to not lash out, it’s not on them to accept her shit.

Yes, seriously.

I will take your recommendations into consideration, and perhaps in turn you could consider working on your ability to accept differing opinions.

Yes, which is why I specifically listed admissions based on faith, academic selection, and postcode in my post.

@OhTediosity i agree with you, I just put it badly. Probably because it irritates me so much when people bang on about privilege of private school kids when in many cases there is no real privilege above what state school kids get.

Well, yes, the Aunt could apologise for escalating the argument but two wrongs don't make a right and not attending the wedding would be a disproportionate response which, as other people have said ,would whip up a minor storm into a hurricane.
There will always be annoyances, I don't think it's appropriate to get on your high horse over every minor offence. (I demand an apology!!! etc.)

I accept that you have your own opinion and that’s fine to have but it seems to be based off things you have assumed which is why I don’t agree with you. I don’t see any resentment from the Aunt - she’s simply pointing out the inequalities and from OPs own words her son is ignorant to his privileges. 🤷‍♀️

Then it’s on her to apologize and attempt to resolve the issue. The ‘hurricane’ is the consequence of her own actions, and if she wants to avert that then she needs to be the one to swallow her pride and reach out to them, not expect them to do what she wants because she considers herself entitled to lash out without reaction.

‘Two wrong don’t make a right’ is a tedious cliche often trotted out to encourage people to shut up and accept shitty behavior when they have no responsibility to do so. It’s not at all unreasonable to distance yourself from someone that considers themself justified to treat you badly.

The aunt’s resentment can be inferred just from reading the OP.

Why did she need to point out the inequalities? He was telling his aunt he was looking forward to going to his new school - hardly controversial. She took it as an opportunity to ‘go off’, get on her soapbox and make it about her opinions.

Is he ignorant to his privilege? Or does he just not feel the need to grovel for it? Even if it is a case of the former, you don’t educate people by ranting at them. If anything by doing so you make it far more likely that you’ll alienate them.

In a situation where someone was abusive or extremely personally insulting you would have a point but it's a question of proportion. This was just an argument that got out of hand and turned a bit personal. The aunt shouldn't have pursued it with the kids but OP's son's retort turned it personal. There's no need for this to be whipped up into something that will upset everyone.

You’d think that as an adult she’d be aware that while she may choose to start shit, she can’t control the response of the person on the receiving end.

‘Proportion’ is a matter of opinion. I don’t believe it’s out of proportion at all to want to have little to do someone that lashed out at you, didn’t attempt to apologize, and still expected you to do what they wanted. If it is whipped up into something that upsets everyone, then the blame for that lies at the aunt’s feet.

The root of the problem here is that there are no good state schools other than one you need to be religious to get into. It's an appalling situation.

I have a 16-year-old lad who feels strongly, very strongly sometimes, about not attending college on a Tuesday as it's a half day. Should I just let him stay at home?

It's simple, really; you tell them what to do. As I said, they may not always agree with you, but at 15, you can reason with him and explain the consequences of his actions by not going, not just what that has or could potentially have on him but also on his mom, dad, and wider family.

What sounds like a typical family chat got a tiny bit heated; neither is entirely wrong or right; you can argue all day long about the SIL biting her tongue and her son not baiting the SIL - Bloody hell, who hasn't been wound up by a teenager.

if you can't move past this, then I fear for the family dynamic as a whole - you have to be able to speak openly and honestly, sometimes knowing your opinion may upset someone else and a 15-year-old lad is going to have zero tact in how they put stuff across - they are harsh, straight to the point and will have had no malice around what he was saying, kids would assume that there are unlimited places - why wouldn't they, they are children and still learning.