Kids not wanting to attend SILs wedding after argument

[comfortablynumber]

My sister in law is getting married in 3 weeks. My daughter is a bridesmaid and my son is an usher. However we’ve all just had a huge row and now my children don’t particularly want to go either. Looking for advice.

Both my kids are in private school. Daughter year 10, son year 11. SIL very much disapproves of our choice. She also has a child in year 11. Over a family Sunday lunch we were discussing plans for post GCSE education. We’re not pulling the kids out of school during GCSEs but the fee increase is too much long term. The plan therefore is for them to complete their GCSEs in their current school and hopefully then get a place at the excellent local state school for 6th form. The local school is C of E which is why we couldn’t get in for senior school (I have some thoughts about that, but that’s another thread!) However for 6th form current pupils just have to achieve high GCSEs and new pupils very high GCSEs. They make offers to new pupils based on school predicted grades and the number of applicants etc. Last year for example to get in for A level maths you needed to be predicted a min 7 as well as scoring highly in an exam the school set.

I thought SIL would be happy, but she lost her mind. It was triggered by a comment my son made- he said he was looking forward to going because it would be nice to go somewhere bigger, meet new people and because most of his friends from his current school were also applying. His current school is selective and high achieving. Son is predicted 7-9 in almost everything and most of his friends are the same. We’re talking a year group of 150 kids with at least 50+% now applying to the local school (previously I’d say 10-20% went after GCSEs). This will obviously massively increase the competition for the places they can offer to people who aren’t already pupils.

SIL went off. It’s not fair apparently that her son and his friends may not be offered a place because of competition from kids who had the benefit of private education. She genuinely said that there should be a sort of tier system - like university contextual offers. The thing is, that other than the great C of E school the other school options aren’t good at all (hence us going private.) Son asked SIL if she was saying that because he’d been privately educated she thought he should go somewhere not great for A levels, and she said yes! Apparently he’ll do fine anywhere. Son said he didn’t want to do “fine”- he was aiming for better, and some of the other local schools don’t even offer things like further maths or A levels other than the basics.

DH (her brother) pointed out that the levelling up of state schools she thinks will happen when private schools lose pupils would take some time and there were bound to be issues initially, especially when lots more kids look to go to state schools for A levels in a few years. He’s been pissed off with her for years and pointed out that this is what she wanted. My son and daughter are very upset that their aunt seemingly doesn’t care that much about them.

I’m more sympathetic. Nephew has struggled in the school he’s currently in (also not able to get into C of E school) with low level bullying. He’s had 3 maths teachers in 18 months and his science teachers have been dreadful. The drama teacher is currently filling in in GCSE English lit for unknown reasons and it’s not going well. It’s all been a bit shit and I know they are hugely keen for him to go somewhere different for A level. However his predicted grades aren’t brilliant and he was always borderline as to whether he’d get in based on last years offers- the additional competition may well mess things up for him. SIL has been really upset about his school for a long time which is one of the reasons she’s been so cross about us going private. Apparently the local schools would have been better if the private school and the Cof E didn’t cream off the better pupils. She’s not wrong (don’t want this to be a thread about educational policy though) However my son and daughter are I think rightfully annoyed that she’d be happy to send them there!

It all got very fraught until my MIL nearly burst into tears and people calmed down. However the children are now saying they don’t want to be in her wedding. This is my problem- do I tell them to suck it up (outfits bought, far to late in the day to drop out, not doing it would cause possibly unrecoverable family strife, they love their cousin and my SIL when she’s not upset and speaking without thinking) or do I let them chose not to? They’re young and cross and I’m know they haven’t thought through the long term ramifications.

DH says we should leave them tonight but he’s not exactly impartial. I actually like SIL (despite being often and vocally judged) and think that everyone will end up regretting not going. I also think she’s a worried mother who is seeing the possibility of her child not getting a place somewhere he really wants to go. I’d be upset -and I am upset for nephew.
What do I do?

They're mid to late teens! Almost adults. They can't be physically 'forced' to go, nor should their wishes be disrespected. Forcing them to go is ignorant, selfish and unreasonable. They should have the right to autonomy. OP should be respecting their wishes, and she should back them up! unless she wants her own children to resent her because she put her own needs of being a people-pleaser before her own children's needs and wishes.

Your SIL has a point. Your kids sound entitled and would do well to consider whether they feel they are better than your nephew or deserve better chances because you as a family has more money than your SILs family. I would have been on SILs side in that discussion and your kids need to get perspective on their privilege.

yes great idea.

I'm slightly confused by the fact your husband and his sister were both at private school.

How comes sil child wasn't privately educated?

Couldn't the GPs help financially?

I thought you were going to say she was drunk and nasty or offensive to somebody. She simply said a, valid, view point that your son didn’t like.

I can’t imagine allowing children to think they have the choice to attend such a family event over something as minor as this.

@snoopsy the OP says the SIL already "disapproved" of her kids going to private school. the SIL went to private school herself, but can't afford to send her child. she's bitter. There is no reason to characterise her as "bitter" or say she can't afford it. You have already quoted her as disapproving of private schools, which does not suggest her reason for not sending her child to one is (primarily) money. And if she is bitter, that does not mean she's bitter about her child not going to private school (unlikely, given she seems to disapprove), but more because of what her son has experienced. Again though, bitter is still far more than OP says about the situation.

Speaking as an aunt who had a big row with her nieces shortly before her wedding where they were bridesmaids - I didn't want them there as they'd behaved so appallingly, but I gritted my teeth. I knew kicking them out of the bridal party would be a nuclear option.

And on the day - honestly they were so happy, and it was such a happy day it didn't matter at all.

There are times to stick to your guns and principles and times when it's more important to see the big picture. Zooming out 10 or 20 years (which your kids will fond hard) and this row won't be important.

They will lose their relationship with their aunt completely and sour her day if they don't go. This is definitely a time to be the bigger person and support their aunt.

I'd leave it a few days to talk to your children but wouldn't say anything to SIL as this may only enflame things further.

It is hugely unfair that ops children have to leave their school. The situation is unfair for everyone and created by noone involved. It feels personal because it affects those involved personally.

This is weird. There's all sorts of reasons someone may have been privately educated, but not do that for their children. It's not as though the default is that you "follow" your parents to fee paying schools.

Christ! So not only do the kids have their wishes and autonomy over-ridden and disrespected, SIL's behaviour is rewarded by someone else paying for her nephew to get a tutor.

This is how bad behaviour like the SIL's is rewarded and flourishes in society. I cannot believe your post! Lets all suck up to the nasty unreasonable one, and go one further! Lets pay for his son! No wonder society is full of nasty people and CFers when the good people are admonished and made to suffer and pay, and the bad people rewarded. What sort of lesson is your post teaching others. All the wrong lessons. Your post is an example of what not to do.

You sound nice and your SIL is nice and you like her. So what they all had a disagreement? People should be able to disagree on such matters without it becoming some massive rift and people refusing to go to each other's weddings. That is pretty childish. But then we are talking about children here aren't we? It sounds a little to me like your son is acting as some kind of amplifier for your husband and just channeling his longer term annoyance/views. It's good sometimes to find out as a young person that life is complex and there are many sides of issues and you can have your opinion but it doesn't mean you need to cut off someone you love at the drop of a hat just because they have a different one. It would be terrible if your family had some permanent rift over something like this.

I think you sound lovely and perhaps can help heal things. It sounds to me like your husband harbours some irritations that your children are picking up on and bringing out into the open. But it might not be so appropriate that they are doing that and they probably aren't old enough to know the ramifications of enacting some kind of big-deal family feud. They might be more extreme in their reactions due to his ongoing attitude or feel like they are being loyal and taking sides when that isn't the grown-up thing to do in this case.

I'm not sure it's a case of telling people to suck it up so much as talking to them and making them understand all the different aspects as you've explained here. You don't want them to be the kind of stereotypical arrogant people who just take their own advantages for granted with no understanding of other kinds of situations, surely?

I wouldn't call my question weird.

Just wandering why one sibling chose private and one didn't.

How is it hugely unfair the ops kids have to leave private school? it was ops decision to send them there

Different values?

You have altered the dynamics and order of the conversation OP reported. Her son was not blame free - and tbf she has accepted that, and that he was pretty insensitive.
And incidentally my first post on this thread was that 14 and 15 year olds should never decide whether they go to a family wedding, and they would all be nuts to allow an argument like this to turn into a forever feud, which a wedding boycott would probably do.

I think your SIL had a point about contextual offers that the oversubscribed school would do well to think about: universities know that students from poorer performing state schools who enter with lower grades often do better at university than private/grammar pupils with higher grades. But her response to your DS should have been, "no, I don't think you deserve to go to a bad school; I think X school should adjust its admissions to reflect the different circumstances of applicants." Which is what she was arguing. And you could have pulled your DS up on misinterpreting her statement and escalating the debate.

Should they go to the wedding? I don't think making teenagers go who then will sulk through it is a good call. But I'd ask them to think carefully about the consequence of that choice. This is a decision they won't be able to take back. And to understand that reasonable people can take differing perspectives. And that yes, some people will believe they had an unfair advantage by going to a private school, and that they'll need to work hard to show their actual potential. Regardless of wanting and working for the best for themselves, do they think it's right that people who can pay more get a better education? What will they do in future to correct that?

"They're mid to late teens! Almost adults. They can't be physically 'forced' to go, nor should their wishes be disrespected. Forcing them to go is ignorant, selfish and unreasonable. They should have the right to autonomy. OP should be respecting their wishes, and she should back them up! unless she wants her own children to resent her because she put her own needs of being a people-pleaser before her own children's needs and wishes."

Oh give over 🤣. Autonomy my arse. The DS sounds like he was as bad as the SIL and he's completely unaware of how privileged he is.

His cousin will be directly disadvantaged, again, and he's sitting there giving it jolly hockey sticks about how he's going to make new friends and experience a bigger school etc. Completely oblivious to how that makes his aunt and cousin feel.

These kids need telling how privileged they are and to wind their necks in for the sake of the previous and ongoing good family relationships. DH could have a chat with his sister about her part in it but otherwise it's just a disagreement. "Respect their wishes" fuck me 🙄

Umm first of all you are obvs a lovely Mum and family member to want to sort this and to be so understanding of your S in L pov. Loads of good points here too. I agree, talk to S in L and see what she wants to do and is she going to calm down. Kids, even 15 YOs are kids so their side is understandable too. If sil wants them there and they are not wanting to do it, would the high moral ground argument work? Ie the best way to piss someone off is to be nicer than they are. Forcing them to go is dubious if the issue is not resolved IMO....can you be sure it won't re ignite at some point during the day? Lastly, it may be appropriate to privately and kindly warn sil after this is over, that if she rips into your kids again, you will personally tear her a new one.

Ummm. Yeah, the real unfairness in all this is OPs children having to leave their privileged life for a slightly less privileged one. And SILs son doesn't matter at all.

you need to read other things the OP has said. what about your comments on the things you're fabricating? you've avoided responding to me on that.

I did suspect you were state & DH was private (same in my house. Dodgy AF state for me & fancy boarding school for DH) but we differ in that, regardless of money, there's no chance I'd have sent mine to private - the council estate in me would never have allowed it 😂. Tbh, I don't think DH would have either, or even pushed for it in our relationship, though probably would have had he not married into my lower class family ;)

Ime there are plenty of truly lovely adults that come out of private education but it doesn't seem to be as a result of the school - it's the parents instilling reality into them & keeping their feet on the ground. Without that they turn into exactly the thing that makes us working class types loathe them - aloof, arrogant & entitled.

So get on it, you so obviously have it in you!! And just like society, you want your kids to be the former not the latter. In your working class heart you know your son was wrong & that he is more than old enough to know but your mum-heart has protected him cos of your own guilt. It's all very human 😊

Agree with the points she made, don't agree with how it was handled and that the conversation happened in front of the kids.

But she clearly doesn't back them up, and thinks they would in the wrong to take the (as someone said above) nuclear option of not attending over a disagreement on one issue. That kind of move could literally take decades to get past, and is better saved for cases of abuse and the like, not different politics.

i hope you can resolve it and you all go.

unfortunately you come across as a bit smug about your kids and your school choices/options and maybe it would behove you and your son to be a bit more graceful in the face of the luck you have had in that respect and be a bit mindful that not everyone is on an equally fortunate position

it sounds like you and your son lacked a bit of sensitivity

When things are calm I'd gently explain to your kids that IQ is one thing, but they also have to learn EQ. They need to look at the bigger picture of what would happen were they to pull out, and not base their decision on a knee jerk reaction to poor comments from SIL. Help them understand why their aunt is emotional about this, and her fears for their cousin.

I think your kids are not mature enough to understand everything happening here. They need you to guide them to make the right decision to support their aunt on her special day. I’m quite sure she loves them and her frustration is not about them personally which being teenagers might not be easy for them to see.