The way some people let toddlers behave......

[Purpleturtle46]

I have own 3 kids in primary and secondly so still completely remember what the toddler stage was like but recently I have noticed on several occasions that people just let their toddlers run wild. Yesterday for example I was at a farm park with my youngest who has just turned 8 and the following are examples from just one day.

-DD in big sandpit quite focussed on building something and toddlers allowed on several occasions to come over and knock it down, no intervention from parents.

-huge slide from top of 3 story fort thing with big queue of kids at top, none can go down as toddler standing at bottom. Mum comes and removes toddler after a while and process repeats itself several more times.

-lots of sunken trampolines in ground, one child per trampoline. DD waits patiently to have a go, toddler then gets on with her. Parents seem to find this cute, DD gives up and just gets off.

-a throw a hoop over the witches hat game. Toddler running in-between the hats so DD has to wait until toddler is removed after some half hearted attempts to shout across from the picnic bench Dad is sitting at.

-older baby crawling around the middle of the floor in a cafe, waiter carrying 2 huge plates of food nearly trips over them.

And that's just one day. Obviously it's not the fault of the toddlers but when my kids (3 under 4 so not easy) were that age I constantly had to talk to them about turn taking etc. Yeah of course it's hard work but that's how they they learn. Just getting fed up of older children being expected to tolerate this behaviour and parents finding it funny and cute! I suspect my DD is probably mildly autistic and although she coped ok with all this I could tell it was frustrating her as she always waits her turn, I'm sure that would be annoying for any child. I am always torn between showing my kids a balance of being tolerant but also standing up for yourself and not being a people pleaser which I probably am guilty of.

The worst one I saw recently was at 2 of my kids' trampolining club award afternoon where the coach was making a speech and a toddler was being allowed to run around between the kids and not sitting with parents in spectator area. The kids found it funny so were giggling while the poor coach was trying to make a nice speech about the kids, she was clearly pissed off, fair enough! Again all attention on this toddler with the parents doing nothing to stop it and looking on at the toddler all gooey eyed!

Has anyone else noticed this trend?

If I was right there when my DD was on the trampoline I would have grabbed the toddler and handed them to their parents.
Same with the one at the bottom of the slide. You might get dirty looks from the parents, so I usually say "sorry, I was worried they'd get hurt". Big smile, turn back to own child.
When I was a kid, anyone messing about blocking a slide would have lasted thirty seconds before one of the bigger kids lost patience and launched themselves down as hard as they could.

I have no expectations of the toddler nor am I annoyed at the child, it's the parents refusal to do anything about it that's frustrating.

Oh I don't know. Here the grandparents tend to be very cautious and not let the children do all sorts that's actually well within their capabilities. Extreme helicopter grandparenting. It's very sweet really.

@Hateam

That may be because the mother spends significantly more time with the children.

It's maybe easier to be good for 3 hours a day rather than 15.

That may be the case, but it's never stopped me from keeping an eye on my child. I'm able to chat with people and still mind them. I see so many mothers with backs fully turned to their children merrily chatting and drinking takeaway coffee. We all need a bit of downtime and a chat but they are not watching their children at all. I don't know how they do it.

Lazy parenting really gets my hackles up. Im a childminder for over 24 years so I've seen it a lot. it never used to be like this with parents but it's definitely getting worse. I find people just don't seem to care about manners anymore.

I was out for a dinner with my dd & ex mil last Friday. In a reasonably posh hotel restaurant.

One table beside us of about 8 people were so loud we couldn't hear ourselves think. However they moved before we got our food so that wasn't so bad. But then a family of 4 sat down. 2 adults & 2 kids aged about 7 & 10 at a guess.
They brought a card game with them to play while waiting for food. They spent the whole time slamming cards on the table & literally shrieking. Not just the kids. The adults too. Now I'm all for engaging your kids in games & spending quality time with them but why does every other person in the place have to hear it. They were properly screaming at the tops of their voices (mam was particularly loud & screechy!) & banging the table.
What hope is there for those kids.

Exactly. If mine screamed and tantrumed e.g. in a shop I used to scoop him up and march him back to the car!

I still think I would have said something, if they’d clearly been Brits, but they obviously weren’t. Why that should have made a difference I still don’t know.

Obviously it's a developmental stage, no one is saying it isn't. But they don't just "grow out of it", they need to be guided, taught and parented out of it. That's literally your job as a parent. If you're just sitting around on your arse while your toddler acts feral expecting it to just "grow out of it" on its own then you are absolutely part of the problem and are making a rod for your own back because when that toddler hits teenagerhood it's going to suck really hard for you.

I have a four year old and honestly I’m so shocked at how people let their children behave! I have people telling me while I’m trying to discipline my child ‘oh he’s fine, don’t worry, he’s not doing anything’ when he has been doing things from your list above, it’s like you’re seen as cruel if you dare to challenge their behaviour it’s wild

YANBU except the "mildly autistic" comment. There's no such thing. High-masking autists (especially intelligent girls/women) have higher rates of suicide, so their suffering is in no way milder than non-masking autists.

It's not just toddlers though, it's older ones as well

I run a pub and we have a rule where children are welcome but the sign actually says "well behaved children welcome".

In my last pub we had a couples group come in, two of the three couples had 2 children each. All of them were feral.

One of my staff was walking from the kitchen with a tray of food, nearly went over one of the kids as they ran at her. In my view he did so on purpose to try and knock the tray out of her hands. We had one trying to run out the front door who nearly got someone else smacked with the door as he was coming in. Then the youngest one was lying on the floor screaming because his mum forgot his iPad.

This was within 10 minutes of them sitting down and the lot of the adults did nothing at all.

So I asked them to leave. I was polite about it. Just said that unfortunately, we would have to refuse them service due to the conduct of the party.

One of the mums went apeshit at me, saying I clearly didn't understand children, I happily pointed out I had two of my own and would have been mortified if either had displayed the type of behaviour the children in their party had.

They left us a shocking review over it on a local gossip group, which backfired because lots of locals told her they backed us! Some of our customers said they had children and we were lovely to them, because they actually parented their children!

I'm deep in the toddler stage and I'm so surprised at how many people have this attitude - a phase, I don't want a tantrum so just let them be. I go to things with my dd (3) and see so many parents letting their kids do something to avoid a tantrum. There's toy ride in cars at one of my groups that come out for 15 mins. My daughter loves one with a walker talkie - lots of kids do. If she gets in it first, I say after 5 mins to come out to let others have a shot. If others get in first, they sit in it all 15 mins as their parents are scared of a tantrum. Often if dd is it in, another boy will be following her around tantruming until he gets his shot. The parent pretends not to notice. This week I sent dd up to ask his mum if she could please have a shot. She crouched down and tried to explain to her son why he should get out and looked up helplessly whenever he stamped his feet and moved away. Pick. Him. Up! Remove. Him. Yourself! Be default, she is teaching him it's ok to behave like this. Trust if you are aggressive, people will let you do anything!

Err no.

Oh be quiet , what rubbish.
These interventions are to keep the toddlers safe . You'll be the mum with toddlers everyone wants to avoid with that outlook

I only had this once with one dd. She was barely 2 and there was a little mini doll’s pram she instantly fell in love with. I literally had to prise her fingers off the handle and carry her screaming to the car.

(I did buy it for her for Christmas, which wasn’t long afterwards, and made a pillow and blanket for it.)

THIS.

Yesterday a large Vizla tried to jump up at me in a park- {I have nerve damage from shingles on my thigh and a clawing from a dog sets of the pain for days {Post shingles neuralgia}

The stupid owner said

''Don't worry. she's friendly!''

FUCK right off - I don't want your bloody untrained dog leaping all over me.

The woman was a completely indulgent incompetent talking to the dog in an inane sing song voice like the dog was a child.

{I have a dog, but well behaved}

I don’t know if it’s something that’s changed or just something you notice more at some stages of your child’s life than others. I will say that the biggest issue with supervising my two when smaller was the number of parents who insisted on practically being on the play equipment with their kids so it was less easy to keep an eye on what they were doing. I have two close in age so they had a couple of years where I had to watch both of them and it was a challenge. I’m sure it sometimes took a minute to get over from where I was pushing biggest on a swing to where smallest was being a monkey. I therefore can understand why the child at bottom of slide wasn’t cleared out of the way. Honestly what I struggle with is why one of the many hovering parents didn’t just ask her to move. I would have just said something.
I do have a couple of friends that have kids who behave in ways I wouldn’t tolerate but their children are neurodiverse so sometimes need different strategies. That said I still think it would likely be sensible to just take them home if they are hitting you. Really they are either doing it out of temper/bad behaviour, in which case they need some consequences or they are doing it because the situation is so overwhelming they can’t help it, in which case moving them to a familiar environment like home to have a chance to regulate themselves seems like it would be sensible. I struggle to understand how staying is helpful.

Of course not, that's my I said in my OP that it was really hard work but I was just consistent that you had to wait your turn, not climb up slide etc. There were plenty years and tantrums and of course it would have been easier for me (in the short term) to just let them do what they wanted but that's not fair on others, keeping them safe or preparing them for life.

I think I would have been more sympathetic if I could see that the parents involved had their hands full with other children but in reality they were chatting to other adults, on their phones or just watching on like they thought it was cute.

And the way they behave in restaurants! iPads on full volume and kids pouring the salt and pepper all over the table and then mixing the sugar into coffee ON the table and mums being like oh are you making a potion darling

@FlingThatCarrot and @Wishingplenty - I have a 3 and 5 year old. Toddlers are hard work - no one is blaming the child. What is frustrating the majority of posters is the parents who make little/no effort to correct, control or contain their toddlers. It is the parents, not the children. Most people are sympathetic when they see a parent at least trying to ensure their DC doesn’t ruin or interfere with other peoples experience at the restaurant/playground/whatever. FWIW I think letting kids do whatever they want (especially in their formative years) is lazy parenting and ultimately setting them up for a hard time because once they’re older they will struggle socially if they don’t know how to interact properly with others or respect boundaries or authority.

I think one of the worst is letting crawling babies and toddlers loose in busy areas. Last week walking thro a shopping centre, loads of people walking into shops etc a very small walking baby allowed to walk away from it's mother walking into other people. People tried to move but one person walking round a corner didn't see the baby untill it was to late and knocked it over. Completely the mothers fault for allowing this. Same shopping centre a crawling baby was nearly trampled by a group of college students all entering at the same time at the end of the day. They didn't expect someone to allow a baby to just crawl around. I really do not know what some parents are thinking. Don't put your child in these dangerous situations, yes toddlers behave like toddlers but parents should also parent.

Not saying it's right to do this in this day and age but in the 1970s my mum would've hit me back and I'd've stopped.

Repeatedly wouldn't've happened.

I say this to my kids in the park (not using the restaurant example with the waitress they would have been removed swiftly). If I have told them to be careful or move but they aren’t listening I then say it’s your own fault if you now get hurt as this child is going to cone down the slide or carry on swinging etc. Natural consequences and all that!

Mine was like the energiser bunny, so it was mainly things like not letting him charge off down the aisles in places like Pets at Home or do laps round the Farm Shop car park 😁

Oh come on! I have 2 toddlers and completely agree with the OP. Compassion goes both ways and toddlers being allowed to push in is not fair on the other toddlers/children their own age who are waiting and trying to learn those prosocial behaviours. At this young age you can kindly intervene and say sorry darling this child was ahead of you, or gently lift them off something. If they have a tantrum, you comfort them, distract them and calm them down. That’s how they learn! 🤷‍♀️