So if your friend lost 5 stone in 6 months .. would you wonder how ?

[AboutVattime]

Just inquisitive.. my best friend has always been obese. About 22 stone. I have worried about her health silently for a very long time.. she started Mountjaro in April and is now 14 st. I am completely thrilled for her . Her blood pressure is now 'upper' but not ' see your healthcare provider' .. her heart 'murmurs' have ceased.. I am worried that when she come to the end of her treatment she's will just gain it all again. It is without a miraculous drug.. she has struggled to afford...she is incredibly good with money and financially planned every inch of her journey so that her treatment equalled less than her cost of food consumption.. but only in the short term ( she planned 8 months but goal in 6)

My AIBU is ..I see the amazing difference , she is so happy for the first time in a long time after years of weight watchers, slimming world, Cambridge diet.. low carb, NHS gastric band..(15 years ago which helped but only ever got her to 16 stone before piling it back on) .. she has found one of the Mountjaro providers who will prescribe a maintenance dose...

But she can't afford it long term. It will be £189 per month without a discount.. AIBU to say I can pay this for her. She is my very best friend . I love her new found sense of self confidence.. and don't want it to go.. the money is not an issue for me . I am extremely comfortable and struggle to spend. However would love to help someone I love very much.

Just for complete transparency I had crept over into 'unhealthy' zone as also had osteoporosis in knees. Also took Mountjaro for 2 months and know how incredible it is. I have kept it off for 5 months without a maintenance dose .. it just reinforced healthy eating recipes for me . . But I haven't been morbidly obese

I was responding to 'Even people talking about on social media talk a lot about the possible side effects. Both long and short term'. And my point in return was, I'm one of those people who has talked about the long term consequences, but relying on a random poster to raise the issue of risk is not sufficient in advertising standard terms - All marketing communications should be prepared with a sense of responsibility to consumers and society and should reflect the spirit, not merely the letter, of the Code.

Plus, anyone on this particular thread who has raised the issue of risk has been well and truly shot down, so I don't imagine they will be rushing to engage on any of the other threads to help them achieve the advertising small print.

@ItTook9Years oh she was eating far more than that. It was ridiculous what she put away. And no, no weight gained. It wasn't just 3 years she ate shite for, she ate badly her whole life. You do realise that fatty, bad choices have existed for longer than 'takeaways' have? And yes, it was full family sized trifles and whole cakes, not slices. So yes, you're assuming wrongly, just as you have assumed wrongly throughout this whole thread where you've proven you talk shit and think you're special.

No word on why my DP can eat thousands of calories a day and stay healthier than the amazing superwoman that is you? No, didn't think so. And why he is also 'immune to Covid' when he eats none of the things you think gave you this supposed superpower? Maybe it's time you pipe down and stop telling everyone else that they're wrong when you have nothing intelligent or of any scientific use to say. You've posted repeatedly on here talking shit and trying to rile people up, have you nothing better to do?

They are shot down, because

1. nobody asked for their opinion on risks
2. Their opinion comes with a judgemental and ignorant tone about ‘quick fixes’ or it’s simple, eat less move more
3. They never back up their claims even when asked multiple times anyway.

If you really want to come along with unsolicited adivce on long term consequences or risks in a genuine effort to help people, then at least show where you got your information from. Then maybe people will listen.

But why do you and others feel the need to ‘help achieve the advertising small print’ anyway?

if you can afford to help her, and want to do so because of the change you see in her, then that's up to you. maybe offer to pay half or something. I'm sure it would mean a lot to her, or even if you just say you will help her pay for it for a certain length of time, during which she can make other lifestyle changes to maintain the loss.

I'm really interested in the tone of these posts. I lost weight on LCHF. It reduces food noise exactly like the injections do. But for some reason I deserve praise and people on the injections deserve ire. We both found a way to reduce food noise and eat less, we're both losing weight, we both struggle without it.

If it weren't for BIWI and the other wonderful people on here helping, I wouldn't have lost the weight. I have ADHD, poor impulse control, addictions in the family and an under active thyroid (yes, diagnosed by a doctor). Genetically, I have much more chance of being fat (or alcoholic, so thank goodness I missed that trauma). I'm not lazy or stupid. I wasn't then and I'm not now.

And the UPF evangelists, I don't do that either, never did. No ready meals or chicken nuggets here. Jar pasta sauce is my nemesis. I can gain weight quite happily eating fresh, healthy food because I ate too much of it.

I don't think I can explain any more clearly than I already have done in my earlier posts.

I am definitely not judgemental on the issue of weight or how anyone loses or gains it. I am a bit skeptical about big pharma and all those middle-men who stand to profit where there is lots of sm hype, some of which I wonder is entirely genuine. Perhaps I am entirely wrong to be so risk adverse.

I wish you well on you weight loss journey and I hope you achieve happiness and long term health. It is in everyone's best interests that these drugs work and are benign - fingers crossed they are, in which case, wonderful.

I managed to lose the quote, but @Island2513 my reaponse above.

You could be talking utter shit. “My grandma ate lard sandwiches and had 25 sugars in her tea and she lived to 187. She died breaking the world record for an ultra marathon.”

“My husband eats 10 million calories a day and is less than 8 stone 2 but is an Olympic champion weightlifter. On my side of the family if we even think about eating a vegetable, we gain 4 stone.”

Whatevs.

Whilst I agree with some of your points. You are being disingenuous. Or rather coming across as disingenuous.

You are concerned that ASA rules are broken by threads like these and that could be harmful for vulnerable people. But have no problem with a poster who has clearly mislead and outright lied, who claims starving yourself for almost 4 days is a proven way to improve health. Both are damaging to vulnerable people. It’s not only damaging if it breaks ASA rules. And at this point, whilst I suspect it, there’s no proof this was meant to be advertising. And many people who do take MJ called out the suspiciousness of the thread early on. But as of yet, we have no idea who the Op is or their motivation.

But you aren’t concerned about other equally damaging things are posted on this thread. Or elsewhere.

You keep going on about one poster who says they eat 600cals a day. But keep ignoring the fact that other posters keep claiming losing weight can be done by just XYZ which includes starving yourself for days and saying it’s scientifically backed up, when it’s not. Even when one poster blatantly misled people.

You get shot down when talking about the risks, not because no one believes it. But because several posters have made claims that aren’t actually true and can’t back them up. And the people claiming they know all about the risks clearly haven’t read the research. Unlike a lot of the people who are actually taking it who have read it and keep up to date on new findings.

People post of low carb, intermittent fasting, fasting, competitive under eating and all sorts of things. Even to the point of lying. But the concern is that this thread might break ASA rules? The concern is that something that’s helping obese people might be being misused. That it might be helping obese people, but we should prioritise other people instead.

There’s been nasty and rude comments like ‘come one tell me how you got fat eating apples’. That’s really damaging to people already struggling. But that’s not a concern?

If someone vulnerable with an eating disorder reads this thread, what are they more likely to do? Go on line and pay a load of money out to try and obtain a prescription drug illegally. Or decide they could starve themselves for almost 4 days a month for free. Cause a woman here claimed she did and claimed it was backed up by science.

You briefly mention people buying knock off stuff. That’s where vulnerable people are more likely to get it. That’s more likely to lead to complications and hospital admission. But that’s just a small concern.

Your concern is disingenuous because you only have problem with people who think using MJ was the right decision for themselves. When people have pointed out the horrific misinformation from people is disapprove of people using Mj you have ignored it. Your concern is not for vulnerable people. It’s not for people who might have an eating disorder and try and use it anyway.

If your concern was genuine you would equally appalled at what has been written here as ‘facts’ regarding diet. By posters who have been purposely misleading people to convince them fat loss is easy for everyone.

It’s nothing to do with the money. You physically cannot overeat! It’s absolutely stops you. If you’ve never had food problems it difficult to understand. I feel for the first time in my life that I have a normal relationship with food.

@Gladicalled perhaps you could not misquote me. I never said I starve myself for 4 days a month.

There are studies which show fasting to be beneficial. There are others showing the opposite. You tried it and found it didn’t help you, it does help me. You are no more right than I am.

In general terms, there isn’t huge diversity in the human genome that would cause some people to put on weight eating 600 cals and others to maintain on 6000.

People drop dead exercising. Some from lifestyle choices. We don’t yet know what injectables do for non-diabetics, and I think opting for a route that involves injecting them for life is sub-optimal.

@Pinkrinse I do understand. But many people talk about still having food noise at various levels and it getting less effective over time. The placebo effect isn't 'fake' or 'just' anything.

Up to 80% of morphine's painkilling is placebo effect. What colour a pill is affects how effective it is. Environment, delivery, all aspects around the drug, they are all really impactful. That is not to say that morphine or these drugs aren't effective, just that there may be other effects going on at the same time. It might be a small, population-level effect, but I can almost guarantee it's there.

Food is all about psychology. Paying for a drug, however effective that drug is, will make a difference.

I do an 84 hour fast every 6-8 weeks. It would have been totally normal for humans to not eat for extended periods. Modern human bodies aren’t radically different to earlier human bodies.

This is what you said. You claim it would be totally normal for humans to not eat for days. That’s not a fact. Yet you stated it as a fact.

I didn’t say IF wasnt beneficial at all. Or beneficial for some people. I challenged your many false claims about it. I raised that more recent studies show it’s not great for women. And there you using your ALMOST 4 day starvation diet as a counter point to people who say they couldn’t do it. ‘Well I can do it for 84 hours and do it regular’. We know it was another attempt at ‘well I can why can’t you’.

Given the fact that you purposely tried to mislead people on this thread, have made up facts and claimed things to be true that are not, no one is worried about what you think is sub optimal. You even mislead about your home life in your ‘study of one’ to try and appear better than other people. So no one is worried about what you think is suboptimal for health.

and you are right. It’s not almost 4 days a month. It’s almost 4 days every 6-8 weeks which is makes it fine. 🙄🙄

Give over. I'm not going to dispute everyone on the thread. I have one point to make and I stuck with it.

You have misquoted me and misinterpreted me. I have never, ever even mentioned the poster on 600 cals. I have never, ever commented on what individuals eat or don't eat. You are all mixed up and angry, but it really shouldn't be with me!

On 1000 cals with 12 hours exercise a week I lost 1 lb a month - you need to understand that calories are not the same for everyone- not all us fatties are fat because of gluttony, stupidity and laziness - there are some of us who put on weight living on what you eat to lose weight.

You sound lovely.

Maybe say you know someone who can have you a very big reduction (90% off) and if she wants, you can take it for her and offer the remaining 10% for her Xmas?

I know it is a lie but in that instance, that will preserve your friendship.

Good luck 🌺

I am sorry you have to read so much non sense from people whom clearly have no sense or can’t read a room.

There are plenty of reason why people have weight on and noone knows why neither need to. It is called privacy, respect, non of your business 🌺

3.5 days (up to) every 6 weeks averages out to 2.5 days a month. Max. Rather different to the picture you tried to paint in misquoting me.

That is so so kind of you! Wish there were more people like you! You might find with her new confidence she will want to keep that confidence. When we start looking after our appearance (beauty&fashion etc), we start looking after the rest. I've just had a gastric sleeve after taking Wegovy for 3 months (personally did not work for me). However, there is a process in the NHS where she could possibly get it for free, but she needs to go through her GP. There is a process of joining a 22 week NHS, online weightloss group with a Dietician and Psychologist. You do it as a group and then you get one-to-one help afterwards. Once you have jumped through those hoops, they will put you on a weightloss drug. She really needs to speak with her GP.

So no one is worried about what you think is suboptimal for health.

And yet, you’ve spent hours coming back at me.

You think meds are wonderful and not to be questioned. I disagree. I’m done now.

Not really

You don’t need to do it.

But it make you look disingenuous to be very concerned about vulnerable people being harmed when it comes from one side.

I apologise if I misquoted you. Many posters have clung on to the one person who eats 600cals I may have got that wrong.

To be clear, I am not angry. I am explaining why it comes across as disingenuous. Had you have been concerned about the huge amounts of posts on MN that are quite harmful, I would have agreed. Any anger you are reading into my posts is the tone you created in your head.

No it’s not.

starving yourself for 2.5 days a month and making out it’s a fact that’s it’s healthy for all humans is wrong. Your basis of how we lived tens of thousands of years ago isn’t a fact.

And it’s really damaging for vulnerable people to read. and it comes with massive risks to health for a lot of people.

But it’s ok if you call it fasting?

2.5 is worst case (in your terms). 8 weekly and it’s not even 2 days a month. Half the picture you tried to paint.

accuracy not a strong point?