Skinny shaming is so accepted

[chickenbhunalambbhunaprawnbhunamuchroomrice]

I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, but skinny shaming is so wildly accepted and tolerated due to slim people being at an advantage due to their body size. As if it's acceptable, because they're slim. I've been body shamed my whole life for being slim. Right from when I was at junior school, to now at 30 years old.

I was relentlessly bullied at school and college. I am not an anomaly, I am a 5'5 size 6-8 female with a normal BMI. I don't need to be shamed about my body. The only people who have ever shamed or bullied me about my weight have been fat or obese people. And I'll be honest I'm trying my hardest not to judge them for their eating habits and size, but when it's a running theme I am starting to think that only fat people have a problem with slim people.

'Skinny privilege' shouldn't be an excuse to exempt bullying and shameful behaviour.
Stop trying to normalise skinny shaming just because it's the 'more desirable' image. It's not our fault that agenda has been pushed so much.

AIBU to think that skinny shaming is just as bad as fat shaming, and that slim people aren't to an advantage on this? I don't believe in the whole 'well at least you're skinny and being shamed.' Interested to know others thoughts.

But at the time you hate yourself. And when it comes from a pack of women it's even worse. Like you're less of a woman or something.

I think it's the feeling on this thread from many that, because of skinny privilege, it's not as bad as other bullying (it is) and therefore the recipient should suck it up.

And I would say overwhelmingly in my experience this came from other women. I can't put my finger on why but back then this always made it hurt more

I think the problem is the initial framing of the thread. It's that it starts with the premise - slim women are bullied by fat women and it's terrible. Sure, bullying is terrible. But the framing of fat women as this aggressive, embittered and more powerful majority ganging up on slim women creates defensiveness because body shaming is obviously a phenomenon that goes both ways.

So it's the movement between individual and personal experiences and societal structures that creates the conflict on this thread. Individual and personal experiences of bullying are really bad and have a deep impact on the victim. When you move out to look at society as a whole, you see that it's fat women who are discriminated against and made to feel shame collectively about their bodies on a larger scale. But that doesn't change what's happening to individual thin women. All of us, fat or thin, take the pain and frustration of beauty standards, judgement and critique and it can make us attack each other personally rather than turning on the real problem which us the way society views weight and women's bodies.

I feel a lot of sympathy for the thin women who relate their experiences of cruel comments about their bodies. I do feel frustrated at the lack of acknowledgement that every comment described on here does get turned onto fat women too. It grinds my gears when someone writes '...and no one would ever say that to a fat person!' because they DO. They do say it. Pregnant fat women get accused of jeopardising their unborn babies because of their weight, fat women do get probed about their eating habits, they are scrutinised and judged and called out and insulted and abused in all those same ways.

And when there is an underlying narrative of - oh well, fat women's bodies are their own fault and actually they could just lose weight and if they don't then they only have themselves to blame. It's an extraordinary lack of compassion. Humanity is granted to thin women and denied to fat women when posters say that, and it has been said a lot of times. It's equally abhorrent as the narrative which has also been pushed that thin women can't complain about body shaming because their bodies are more valued. I don't think that's fair either.

There are just a lot of comments that don't recognise that a lot of the time what's true for one 'side' is also true for the other. And ultimately, fat bodies are deemed inferior, and fat people are judged as lacking in morality, self control, humanity and decency by society as a whole and thin women are not. So on an individual level, the shaming goes both ways and is equally bad. On a collective level, the shaming goes one way. Any discussion about it takes place in that context.

So you agree you were wrong. Thanks 👍

As an obese person (BMI 40.7) I can categorically say I don’t think thin people should suck it up at all. I genuinely believe that we shouldn’t comment on others’ bodies regardless and it’s absolutely vile for thin people to be bullied because of their size. I call it out when I see it on FB/Insta posts. I believe that sort of behaviour just continues to divide us women.

That said, I am of the belief that on a societal level it’s not as bad as fat shaming for reasons I’ve explained because that’s the way the thread went. That doesn’t take away any thin person’s experience. I experienced the thin bullying as a teen. I earned the nickname Olive (as in Oyl - Popeye) because I was that skinny but had to wear clumpy shoes for work. I was teased about it in other ways too.

OP SAYS: To be honest the only people who haven't judged me or told me I'm skin and bones are medical professionals, thankfully! Going off on a tangent here a bit. But just wanted to say I completely agree.

That is almost never the case for fat people.

Off on a tangent slightly - Another thing I’ve noticed - I’ve read a few threads over the months about people drinking too much and asking for help. With a few exceptions, almost all of the comments are positive and supportive with no mention of what the OP could potentially cost the NHS through their drinking. Conversely, fat people are constantly blamed for the downfall of the NHS and how much we’re going to cost it and ‘we should be ashamed’.

Hi Tiny, thanks. I'd agree with much of what you have written there.

Beret** yea you make sense. I think I was getting pissy at some others who seem to hide behind the very true fact that on a societal level, absolutely I agree it's a different beast. The sneering is smaller scale but in many cases, boy you feel the venom!

'The thing is though you are quite blunt even about your own Mother. If you're the person in the photos on this thread I'm really surprised people comment on you so much as you are slim but I wouldn't see how someone would comment on you being 'skin and bones'. Like I posted previously I think this varies from region to region as where I live, one of the healthiest places in the country, I only know one woman that is overweight and I know quite a few Mums of young children and school gate Mums and friends.

Having eating habits that mean you recognise when you are full and being slim as a result is not what the study of the Skinny gene documentary looked into. They looked at the very thin people who had no off switch but still remained very slim. It is not some great secret for the majority of us how to be slim, basically eat less so the kind of person who 'skinny Shames' you maybe are showing genuine concern if you drop BMI as for 99% of the population that means you are simply eating less or exercising way more than your calorie intake. There are major problems with anybody offering their unsolicited advice of course but some, particularly if they are close maybe genuinely concerned. Your argument that they shouldn't be seems to be based upon your observations of the average Brit being "fat" but even if that is the case it doesn't negate the concern for you as an individual.

I think Genes are relevant, anecdotally my Dad is tall and was very slim until about late 50s. He is adopted and his parents were medium sized and his brother who is their biological son rather than being adopted is much heavier and had to really watch what he ate throughout his life unlike my Dad. When my Dad found his biological Mum and separately his biological Dad, they were both tall and slim. My Dad said that his biological Mum was very tall for her generation as she was 5ft9 and born in 1914.'

@Goldenbear

I tho k it's hard to perceive tone and pace in digitally written text. I'm not blunt, I was just being factual about my situation. I also don't have the best relationship with my mum (alcoholic) so perhaps that blunted the tone.

And cameras make you look bigger than you are. I have always been slim. I do not regards myself as 'skin and bones' and whatever other names I've been called, this is that other people call me, which is why I prompted this thread. And most of those people who have bullied and shamed me have been fat. That's not me being blunt, it's factual. And PP made a very good point that larger people can lose sight of what normal looks like, and to a morbidly obese person a size 12-14 would be slim. I am a size 6-8, a U.K. XS, I have said multiple times I don't think I'm too skinny or underweight despite one poster on here saying that I look that from my pictures. I know I'm not skin and bones, I was very skinny when I had my chemo, but I still wasn't skin and bones.

'OP SAYS: To be honest the only people who haven't judged me or told me I'm skin and bones are medical professionals, thankfully! Going off on a tangent here a bit. But just wanted to say I completely agree.

That is almost never the case for fat people.'

@BeretRaspberry

Just coming back to your point about the medical professionals. I think one of the reasons doctors haven't said to me 'you're skin and bones / underweight' is because clinically, I'm not underweight. It's just want other (mostly larger) women think of me. A doctor will advise someone there overweight / obese, because they are. It's very evident when someone is fat, it's not so evident with someone is too skinny as they can hide with clothes etc. that would be my guess anyway.

Sorry, I should have added more context. Medical professionals often mention it and then use it as a reason not to treat fat people as quickly as they would thin people.

It's an example of the systemic discrimination against fat people. There can be a catch-22 where the doctor refuses to treat the problem until the patient loses weight, but in fact the problem is making it harder for her to lose weight so she never gets treatment and her condition gets worse. Or, a refusal to investigate symptoms because the doctor wants to blame everything on her weight so whatever is wrong gets missed. Women are so disbelieved when it comes to health anyway, and being fat can really mean being dismissed by hcps and not listened to at all.

I dont understand why anybody even feels the need to comment on somebodies appearance in a negative way. Maybe if you know the person very well and are concerned about their health but just random rude comments?
Why?

I really dont think Ive experienced much of this at all. Plenty of 'fat cow!' comments from total strangers when I was a size 22/24 but now Im a 8/10 I dont get anything. Friends and colleagues just dont mention it at all!

I was wrong about what? Are you muddling me up with another poster

I suppose I'm just surprised that you are getting this comments on a regular basis as I would say you have a pretty unremarkable figure as in I'm surprised people feel the need to remark upon it. Do you love in an area of high level of obesity?

I didn't know the camera makes you look bigger than you are.

Interesting that everyone has had these comments from women. When I was very thin only one comment was from a good friend so I didn't mind but all the comments about 'too thin' were from men, my DH, my brother in law who put his hand around my wrist to suggest I was too thin and a friend of DH's.

Oh and my Dad and weirdly my Dad's business partner.

Yes to all of this. And people always assume that obesity is the cause of poorer health outcomes, but I don’t think there are any studies that control for the fact that treatment is often delayed. Or what the results would be like if people were treated inmediately.

@BeretRaspberry through my weight loss there is one topic that comes up more than any other topic of discussion and that is alcohol. Only yesterday a group of colleagues asked me about my weight loss. It was not mean but I am fed up of it as I’ve lost a lot and I know people do mean well but it might be private, I might be unwell but if it’s well intentioned I answer curious questions. I was never asked this level of questions when fat. I am now reduced to just how I look and no longer have a personality is how it feels. I can appreciate how objectified women can feel it’s really reductive to your personality to just be a walking ‘body’ and makes you feel like no one takes you seriously,

Anyway the theme is that every single person asks me if I still drink and I answer no not really. There are lots of reasons, I don’t like myself drunk, I don’t like hangovers and also it’s insane calories I would rather eat them. Everyone always responds that they don’t know what they would do without alcohol and it’s their only comfort and they suspect the cause of their weight gain (as it was mine pretty much) but they don’t want to stop. I’m not telling anyone to stop

Its really made me realise how much as a nation we are drinking and the disconnect between health and weight - we know it, but it’s like we don’t believe it really can be having an impact. And those threads are sympathetic but they are part of the problem as we all empathise with how hard it is to not drink, even when it is ruining your health. It’s so prevalent across every spectrum it’s not just reserved for fat people it’s an every person problem so there isn’t as much shame attached to it

Did anyone see the New York Times article about the BRI which they are trying to replace the BMI? It’s interesting if anyone wants to read as sounds like the BMI will be phased out over waist to height ratio and be more accurate. Studies found the obvious that BMI was not an accurate tool and also it wasn’t a good indicator of metabolic health. The BRI might be a better tool

That's so interesting @thelever I will definitely look that up!

@Goldenbear

Yes on a standard iPhone or Samsung, the camera will make you look roughly 10lb heavier. It's to do with the standard wide angle lens on the default camera. It's the same when you see pop stars on stage on telly, they are so much smaller in real life.

And no I don't think I live in a high obesity area, I live in Surrey. Very middle class area, I rarely see childhood obesity or accessible weight in children, but there are a lot of overweight adults. But I guess that will be anywhere in the U.K. as the majority of people are overweight or obese.

Only from the point of view of someone who wishes they were slimmer. Slimmer people have the same sorts of insecurities about their bodies as everyone else does. Being told your body is wrong, or being made to feel self-conscious about it, is harmful, whatever size you are. It is just as bad whichever way round it is. You cannot justify skinny-shaming on the basis that being skinny is seen as a positive trait by others.

It’s worth a look, I took the test because BMI doesn’t really reflect my shape at all, and any muscle. I was mainly trying to reduce my waist circumference to lower my risks (and diabetes factors) you can’t choose where you lose weight from but it would be easier for those who are pear shaped or muscular to not be necessarily classed as obese when it’s just their shape and distribution and provide a better and more realistic idea of your risk factors. Mine was around 2 - out of I believe 16 points. But I am near top end of normal BMI! It said I was lean and gave me a warning of the risks of being too lean. I think this is useful either way.

https://bri-calculator.com/

What a load of bollox

I, on the other hand, am well in the healthy BMI range, but my waist measurement is borderline overweight. All my weight goes on my middle.

Same here.