My non swimming child went under during swimming lesson

[Mamabear256]

DS is 4.5 years old and has just started swimming lessons, stage 1 at his local leisure centre. It’s 8 children per class, one instructor and a lifeguard watching 2 classes in the pool.

He’s naturally quite a shy reserved boy and he doesn’t like going under water, he doesn't love going but he does need to learn to swim.

Last week he had a trial, whereby he used floats the whole time. However yesterday, the first thing the instructor got to do was all of the children to doggy paddle across the width of the pool (a small-ish pool) without any aids or support. The instructor was standing a few metres in front whilst all 8 children doggy paddled at the same time. DS can barely touch the floor and he doesn’t even know what a doggy paddle is. It was inevitable he was going to go under, and he did. The instructor wasn’t too near my DS so I started to run around to get him. After a few seconds one of the mums shouted towards me ‘it’s ok he’s back up!’ I looked and the instructor had him.

Now I genuinely do not believe he should have been asked to do that without any floats. If the children went one by one doing it with the teacher next to them then I get that. But not all 8 at the same time, with the instructor not close to him, and especially as he is a non swimmer and can barely touch the floor.

I want to complain but just wanted to check if this is normal or not.

AIBU in thinking this isn’t right and to complain?

No. Maybe next summer.
We did this at a campsite in France over 2 summers. It teaches water confidence.

I can swim and never put my head underwater. It's horrible.

How many kids in the UK from organised swim lessons? Zero.

If you mean "swim" in there, I did. My parents couldn't afford/didn't want to teach me themselves, they believed it was the school's job.

Still can't ride a bike, because they also believed that was the school's job and it was never taught.

That's a weird comment and snobby towards middle class people. I taught my kids. Lots of people do things themselves they don't pay other people.

@Mamabear256 I’d strongly recommend a 1:1session with a swimming coach trained in the immersive swimming technique for your DS. Going under and panicking isn’t acclimatising him to the water, it’s setting him up to fail and being afraid of the water.

Sorry I missed the word died. No kid has died during a swim lesson in UK this century. The likelihood is zero.

Yes different, that would be ducklings here

Almost 20 years ago I had a shy, retired, nervous, overthinking 4yo and although we went swimming for fun and he had been in lessons since he was 3 he was still struggling. A friend at nursery (who was even quieter) was getting 1-2-1 and we decided to take him there and get a block of lessons. It’s probably the best money we’ve ever spent and after a few months there he joined a swimming club (age 5) and the lessons there were a different world to the normal leisure centre lessons. He swam competitively until he was a teenager and still swims for fitness. Even if you could only afford 2-3 individual lessons I would go for it. It will make a world of difference.

Modern parenting is weird. Shout at a naughty child? OH NO THEY WILL BE TRAUMATISED FOR LIFE. Stick them in the water when they can't swim and make them experience the intense and instinctive fear of drowning? Just a normal healthy part of growing up ...

I never go swimming because the people who were supposed to "teach" me growing up never bothered to make me feel like it was a safe environment and I have so many horrible memories. We would never contemplate frightening small children like this in any other educational setting.

Or some of us live by the sea? I also don't think it's pointless. It builds water confidence DS is a year older than the OPs and swims confidently on the surface and underwater, he's just building distance and technique now. Given the risks of where we live that doesn't feel like a waste of time. His lessons cost about £27 a month an also allow him to use the pool at any other time for free with an adult who is also free. Under £7 a week seems pretty good value to me.
Some people don't value it and that's fine but don't then complain that your child can't swim/doesn't like the water/the teacher expects too much if they get to 4.5 and have only ever been in the water a handful of times and with armbands on!

What a strange thing to say. It is obviously to do with the respective parents own confidence around water far more than their gender. As I said up thread my DH is a non swimmer and had to stop taking them to lessons as he panicked so me as a confident swimmer took them instead as I didn't panic the moment they went underwater. Not everything in life is gender based.

my DS has been swimming since 4.5. They never had floatation aids. Only when they are working on isolated movements (like legs in butterfly or dolphin as they call it). Having said that, first 2 levels his instructor was in the water with them and the group was no bigger than 3!!! Children. I would complain. It’s only a matter of time before something serious happens.
now my DS is level 5 and it’s only 6 of them at the time.

Is ducklings a requirement for stage 1? Level 1 and ducklings have much the same syllabus here, just different ages. The ones who do ducklings tend to progress through level 1 very quickly, but a 4.5 year old wouldn't be allowed in the ducklings class, they'd go straight to level 1 with no expectations around swimming ability or comfort in the water.

The instructor probably assumed all the kids were comfortable putting their heads under, that’s usually stage 1 before any actual swimming is taught.

You probably need to be getting in with him regularly @Stophittingyourbrother and messing around so he feels more confident.

I was dunking my kids from babies - “3,2,1 under under!!” … we are Kiwis and I have noticed a tendency to wussiness in UK kids wrt water & swimming so was determined to knock that out of my kids if possible 🤣

If you're worried about your child's safety, you need to speak to the instructor or the course provider - we can be too British about these things sometimes.

I would not have been happy with 8 children swimming at once when the instructor doesn't know their ability and literally can't keep eyes on all 8 at once. FWIW I would also never put my child into swimming lessons where parents weren't allowed to stay poolside, for exactly this reason - you would have been there if the instructor hadn't noticed.

OP it doesn’t sound like a pleasant experience for you or your child and certainly not the best set up for someone with no swimming experience. I’d suggest looking for smaller group lessons if that’s possible - small groups (3/4) are good because the more nervous children can be encouraged to copy the more confident ones, but the children still get a lot of attention from the teacher during the lesson.

My eldest started swimming age 4. The lessons started by encouraging children to blow bubbles with their mouth and noses under, progressing to putting their faces under whilst paddling around in a noodle. This then progresses to getting kids to push off and swim a very short distance to the teacher one at a time while they are under the water (and at this point not scared of being under because they are building up to it!). They then start learning the basics of front crawl. I’ve never seen a teacher ask kids to doggy paddle!

Hi, I don’t know if anyone qualified through Swim England/Ireland/Wales/Scottish Swimming or the STA has posted yet. I am a qualified Level 2 teacher with Swim England, previously an STA tutor and I also have qualifications with Scottish Swimming.
I have been teaching for 30 years and have seen a fair bit. Having said this, I didn’t see what happened to this child I only have the mother’s side off it. It isn’t fair to judge as I don’t know the qualifications and experience of the teacher in charge of the lesson.
All I can add is this, I have frequently walked in front of a child swimming or doing some practice because the action ‘pulls’ the swimmer along and allows you to be close enough to catch them if they should have any issues with their practice/stroke. It is frequently done (especially in 1 to 1 lessons where you can make a great thing about the achievement, in a group setting you have other swimmers to attend to) as a confidence booster.
A target is given, you walk in front of a nervous child and they swim easily past the target because of ‘unseen assistance’ then you praise the extra effort and ability effusively ‘Wow! You did FANTASTIC! (Show them) look how much further you swam’. The teacher in charge may have been planning a similar tactic.
Also, if briefly submerging is treated as a huge awful thing, this is when the terror of going under sets in. If I go into this the post will be even more TLDR than it already is. To learn to swim you have to put your face in the water and submerge, they both teach aquatic breathing which is a swimming skill. Children that struggle here have a lot of issues later on. Adults with this issue are normally nervous swimmers who swim by the poolside and vehemently dislike being splashed.
If a child goes under the water briefly whilst attempting to swim doggy paddle, personally I would praise them hugely, before they had a chance to think whether the experience was great or awful. It’s a bit sneaky but that was what we were told to get parents to do at adult and child classes for submersion.

Many of you have quoted statistics and for drowning times but I would point out that many of these differ from the time that the op stated her child was under.

I don't think it's a requirement as one of DS's school friends went straight into stage one having had no previous lessons, but the expectation was to be confident, they had to jump in off the side fully submerged into a circle made by a noodle, swim widths with a noodle and by the end of stage one without , there was lots of time without floats/noodles chasing floating balls etc, it wasn't blowing bubbles and crab walking around the side and lots of teachers steering them with noodles. DS's friend was fine because his family take him swimming and we live near the beach so the children are used to water. I know because he started last year in a class at the same time as DS' stage 3 so we used to sit together in the stands and watch them.

If OPs son isn't confident enough for that class yet she needs to either see if he can do ducklings in the children's pool or take him on her own until he is confident enough for stage one. It's not going to do him any favours keeping him in there if he's not ready and it's scaring him and with 8:1 he needs to have some level of water confidence because the teacher won't be able to give him that level of attention.

You actually missed the word "yet".

@Mamabear256 I'm not a swimming teacher but I am a teacher.

What I'd want any parent to do about anything where they aren't happy, is to come and talk to me, not go onto a forum to gauge opinion.

Choose a time at the end of or before the lesson, or see if you can contact the teacher outside of the lesson time, and talk to her. Get her to understand your concerns.

Your son will need to get used to getting his face wet. In baby swimming (from 6 months) lessons they do 'dunk' the babies. Adults who swim with their heads totally above water are not 'good 'swimmers, which is why getting your face wet and learning to breathe at the right time, is part of the process of being a decent swimmer.

The teacher may be able to give you advice on how you can get him used to water at home (in the bath etc) which may help.

You could also ask the teacher what the lessons include from now on.

Honestly OP, people can debate here all day about whether that style of lesson is good practice or not (it's not IMO and light years away from my own child's excellent lessons) but the outcome regardless is that your son had an upsetting experience during his first lesson and for many kids that can make them reluctant to go back. So I wouldn't send him back because it doesn't sound like an environment suited to him. Maybe some kids thrive in that environment, I don't know, but I certainly wouldn't have as a child and nor would my DD. He needs a smaller ratio, much more exposure to swimming and water in home life, and for his confidence to be built up first.

My son had a similar experience when he was 3, which gave him a fear of water. We worked through that and enrolled him with a swimming club when he was 6 that taught from non swimmers. They all started with noodles. He is now a fantastic swimmer and represents his county. If you can find a swimming club that teaches from non swimmers, I highly recommend giving that a try.

Isn't this like falling off a horse?

If the child doesn't go back, isn't it going to simply reinforce his fear and a sense of failure?

And the next time he does have a lesson, with whoever, he's going to be more frightened than ever.

I think the OP is more upset than he is and is projecting this.

You don't get rid of a child's fears by putting them in uncontrolled situations where they are set up to fail. Kids don't learn to be not scared of going underwater by flailing and going underwater and coming up coughing and spluttering again and again. Particularly kids nervous around water in the first place.