My non swimming child went under during swimming lesson

[Mamabear256]

DS is 4.5 years old and has just started swimming lessons, stage 1 at his local leisure centre. It’s 8 children per class, one instructor and a lifeguard watching 2 classes in the pool.

He’s naturally quite a shy reserved boy and he doesn’t like going under water, he doesn't love going but he does need to learn to swim.

Last week he had a trial, whereby he used floats the whole time. However yesterday, the first thing the instructor got to do was all of the children to doggy paddle across the width of the pool (a small-ish pool) without any aids or support. The instructor was standing a few metres in front whilst all 8 children doggy paddled at the same time. DS can barely touch the floor and he doesn’t even know what a doggy paddle is. It was inevitable he was going to go under, and he did. The instructor wasn’t too near my DS so I started to run around to get him. After a few seconds one of the mums shouted towards me ‘it’s ok he’s back up!’ I looked and the instructor had him.

Now I genuinely do not believe he should have been asked to do that without any floats. If the children went one by one doing it with the teacher next to them then I get that. But not all 8 at the same time, with the instructor not close to him, and especially as he is a non swimmer and can barely touch the floor.

I want to complain but just wanted to check if this is normal or not.

AIBU in thinking this isn’t right and to complain?

I don't think it is normal to have a non swimmer swimming unaided in the second lesson. Some people are saying that going under is part of learning to swim...yes, it is, but a kid with that experience on the second class is probably going to be terrified of the swimming lessons. The learning trajectory should be smoother and slower. I know my daughter would have been terriefied by this!

When my DD started swimming lessons and had some floating aids for the whole term (which where filled with less air each week)

What are you going to do when he goes swimming with his class and there’s the whole class in the water?
🤣
it’s government guidelines that every child should be able to swim 25 metres by the age of 11, schools include swimming as part of the curriculum!

Never use arm bands. They are useless when learning to swim

I disagree with this actually. Both mine had arm bands from 18 months to about 3, it didn't stop them learning to swim without them at just past 3.5. The arm bands made them confident and used to being independent in the water.

Children have drowned or nearly drowned in swimming lessons and public pools with lifeguards before. It's rare but it happens occasionally. Really there is no room for complacency whatsoever around water and you have to have faith in the people teaching your kids to swim. "It'll probably be ok" and "they probably know what they're doing" wouldn't cut it for me in this scenario. And making this mum out to be an anxious, over-involved parent is quite frankly a bit nasty and ill-judged.

One thing I would say is this, OP - what colour is your DC's swimsuit? Make sure he's in red or orange or something that can be seen easily at the bottom of a pool, not blue or green, whenever you take him swimming.

It's a false sense of confidence and independence, that's the issue.

My experience is like this (stage 2). They have a noodle or float (one you hold not armbands) if all going together and only go without if doing it individually with the instructor. This doesn't seem to be for safety though as they can all stand, but so the instructor can correct technique and help them stay afloat independently better. Class is also 1:6.

I think you should find a new class, if you're nervous about this one, he'll pick up on that and be nervous himself

Swim England recommends a ratio of no more than 12 non-swimmers and beginners to 1 teacher, or a ratio of 20 improving or competent swimmers to 1 teacher.

She can't complain about ratios as the above is Swim England ratios.

This may be part of the problem- arm bands give false confidence and when removed suddenly the kid sinks.

Are you able to take him swimming once a week in addition to his lessons to build his confidence in the water? Most leisure centres have fun sessions on a weekend with toys, floats and things

He needs songs and fun games (splashing, blowing bubbles to get his face in the water, etc) to become comfortable
.... thats baby swimming! He is 4.5

Well my experience is obviously different to some on here but I think this sounds like a really bad lesson. Firstly a child could have drowned. What if 2 of them went under at once and the instructor obviously couldn't save both at once?

Secondly, it is an epic failure to teach a lesson where a child cries and loses confidence. This throw them in the deep end approach was outdated in the 80s when I learned. I know a lot of people put off for life by bad experiences early on. I would make a complaint and request a full refund. Also report to the ASA.

My kids have lessons at the local council pool. There's one instructor on the side and one in the water for 8 children. That's the case up to stage 4 by which time they are pretty confident swimmers. In stage 1 they all use a noodle plus, if needed, arm bands until they are confident to go without, unless they are tall enough to stand with their head fully out (it's a fairly shallow pool so probably 5-6 years on average).

The first several lessons are about technique and water confidence, no child learns to swim on the second lesson with or without aids. Obviously if a child can swim they would go up to a different stage. It's rare for a 4 year old especially with no prior swimming lessons to be able to swim though. Usually kids need to be about 5 to have the core strength to swim properly.

If they are trying something without aids in the early stages, they go to the deep end and go one child at a time with an instructor right by them, physically supporting them if necessary. But mostly they are all swimming at the same time, safely and having a great time. I have never seen a child go under accidentally and never seen a child being upset during a lesson.

I’ve not read other comments.

in my opinion this is not great at all and I would hate if for my child.
At the beginner stage where she went they had 8x children and 2 instructors in the water and any swimming across the pool was done with 2 children max per instructor at a time. For challenging excersises 1:1.
It’s suppose to be enjoyable.

Haven't read the whole thread but when DD was 5 and we enrolled her in beginner lessons, she was terrified of putting her head under and the lessons really upset her. Eventually (not soon enough in retrospect), we took her out of lessons and took her ourselves until she was comfortable to put her head under and could glide in the water using her natural buoyancy. At that point we re enrolled her in lessons to learn strokes, breathing and how to swim properly. She loved lessons from that point. I don't think there is much point in swimming lessons until a child is happy to have their face under and feels confident in the water.

Gosh, I dunno, but I'd hazard a guess that part of OP's plan is paying for lessons in a smaller group from age 4.5 so that he can learn in a safe and controlled manner?

I genuinely think the best way to learn is going every week with a parent from very small. Once they can swim- and most kids will start to do so naturally, especially if you have floaties or sinkies to play with- smaller ratio class for stroke technique. DC1 knocked front crawl out in a few weeks 121, would have taken months in group classes.

Teach them to star float, breathe out under water. Get in and out of the pool without steps.

Mine never had armbands. Noodle yes bur armbands are the devil's work. Floats won't teach them to float.

So in general, I don't think the 1:8 classes are very good. I don't think anyone can really say if what happened was ok or not as we weren't there. But if you think the lessons are not pitched right you'll need to go in a much smaller group as the group ones are pitched at an average.

Both of mine did water babies from a few months so learnt to blow bubbles under water and could float. When they started swimming lessons they would wear a shark fin which straps round middle with Velcro and keeps afloat but leaves arms and legs totally free to learn technique- from early on in the lessons they did some time without the fin and would go under. Most schools up here (NE) seem to use these shark fins.

Only in the same way giving a 16 year old lifts for years makes them think driving is easy when they first start. They need support and teaching to make the transition.
Most kids use armbands - it's hardly an unusual situation.

I think this isn't ideal because the experience was clearly frightening for your son and resulted in him crying. That won't help his confidence or enthusiasm in the water. However, I think it's hyperbolic to state he nearly or could have drowned.

I think it's also fair to say he's a little behind most children in swimming at his age. He may not really be ready for stage 1? I'm sure I remember indicating that my child could swim a short distance and/or put their face underwater before starting stage 1.

The nature of the lessons is that the children swim as a group with minimal floats, as they are able to touch the floor and tolerate some submersion. I think your expectation that your son can learn to swim independently from using floats and unable to tolerate any submersion in a group class of 8+ kids is unrealistic and not fair on the teacher.

I think you either need to take more time with him in the pool yourself to build him up to readiness for stage 1 in a large class, or fork out for intensive / much lower ratio lessons. If going with the former, I suggest ditch the floats, take him to the most shallow pool(s) you can find, or those with "beach" style graduated entrance and encourage him to get comfortable with going under the water at a very safe depth to get sinkies. Once he really understands he can go underwater safely and comfortably where he can easily touch the bottom, from there he can develop some swimming that will make him ready for stage 1. Worked very well for ours who now loves swimming, but you do need to put the time in.

I can see why you were frightened. I think going under is part of learning to swim but it would obviously be better for you to be alongside. I do however think you have been a bit lazy in not taking him yourself so that he is more confident and more ready for this group lesson. The best way us for kids to go to the pool with family regularly to build confidence and learn some of the soft skills. They are then much more able to learn the technique from the instructor. Take him out abd get him in the pool with you.

Wow.... I don't have the answer for you OP. But after reading all these answers I'm ashamed of the fact that my 4.5 son can't swim at all!

At most we have splashed about in the pool! Going to arrange some lessons now!

This sounds like helicopter parenting.

Being in water is part of learning how to swim, like falling down is part of learning how to run.

Better learn how to deal with going under during a safe class, rather on vacation under no safety in the open sea.

I think some people are being a bit mean to the op. At that age at my council run pool they put in a platform type thing and doggy paddle one at a time to the instructor. It does feel like slow progress at times but my dc are very water confident. They whizzed through the later levels as had really good technique from their early years. Possibly some one to one lessons or even just practice in the pool with you.

Even getting goggles on in the bath and practising blowing bubbles will help.

I’m a swimming teacher and that doesn’t sound particularly good practice. There’s a huge difference in teaching a child to be happy in going under the water and them just going under because they no skills to keep them up. New swimmers also don’t always automatically understand buoyancy and might need to be taught how to put their feet down and stand. Hopefully the teacher learnt from that how much support your child needs going forward and it ends up being positive.

All four of my DC had swimming lessons and we never once had an incident like this! Yes, they “go under” but that is as part of the lesson, when they are ready, and it’s planned and it comes after putting their faces into the water and blowing bubbles etc..

OP, if you can afford a few small group or even 1-1 lessons then that could really help him to build confidence. The lessons you describe don’t sound suitable for children who can’t swim doggy paddle, and I’m not surprised that you are upset, I would have been too.

Not in England. Our almost six year old just had her second swimming lesson. (Almost six due to the waiting list at the pools around us, so unfortunately a normal starting age here). The first three lessons a parent is next to the child in the pool. Pool is very shallow, she can easily stand up. They practiced floating on belly and back, jumping from the side into the water, going under water with the parent holding a floating pool noodle and the kid 'diving' underneath. Also 'swimming' under water and picking up an object from the bottom. The last was harder, most couldn't.

It allows them to make progress in a safe way and the teacher can get to know them.

As she found going under difficult during the first lesson, we also practiced in the bath tub.

I would not be happy with this approach. It is an approach, but there are other options that seem less risky and less traumatic.

That's the preschool level here in Ireland, as well as swimming with a noodle etc. There's no going fully under and certainly no doggy paddle without float on either preschool (up to age 4 or school age which can be over 5) or level 1. As PP said, those levels are all about building confidence which doesn't happen when new and/or nervous swimmers are pushed so far they go under in an unplanned way.