Neighbour lied they owned the house

[Fluffywalrus]

I need to share this somewhere because my partner keeps saying there could be some other explanation.. but I'm just flabbergasted!

I bought and moved into my home more than THREE YEARS ago. Because of the structure of the properties there's one neighbour whose home is very entwined with mine and whose property shares a lot of structural things with mine.

I made a point to knock on their door a few days after moving in to introduce myself and I remember we had a long chat and I came away with the understanding that she had bought that property several years before. I can't remember the exact words used but I remember being pleasantly surprised because I'd assumed it would be rented rather than the owner living there, which made things much simpler.

Since then we've had countless long friendly chats about work, partners, pets, holidays etc. and probably see her and exchange pleasantries a few times a week in the street. We also got to know her partner who moved in later.

A few days ago we bumped into her partner out and about and he told us they had moved out and bought somewhere. I was surprised that she wouldn't have said goodbye or mention they were leaving. We'd had various chats about plans for the summer and this was never mentioned. But most shockingly, when I asked about their plans for the property he said they just rent it and the lease was coming to an end. She didn't actually own it at all !!

Over the years I've consulted with her on various things I've done to the property renovation-wise, which might impact her and asked various questions regarding the property (due to her living there longer) and most recently got permission for some work that is due to happen in a few weeks. I'm at a complete loss of what to do now. At no point did she say anything to suggest she wasn't the owner e.g. 'I don't know as I'm just renting. I'll have to check with my landlord / the owner.' etc.

My partner thinks I must have just assumed wrongly. But surely even if she hadn't lied and it was a misunderstanding at some point in all these discussions she would have pointed out she didn't own this place?!

AIBU to think they're been misleading?

YABU to let it bother you. Just seek out the landlords permission, ask whoever is living there now for their details.

Why does it matter? They moved on now.
Was permission in writing? It should have been regardless of who owns the property. If it was a verbal permission and the landlord objects, you are screwed (assuming the work you are undertaking impacts both properties beyond just a bit of a noise for the neighbours). But you would have been anyway even if she was the owner and changed her mind.

I think she deliberately misLED you. As to why I am not sure but I highly doubt you misREAD her on all the occasions of discussing houses.

I think I just find it odd behaviour

Nope, permission for the upcoming work not in writing. It was for access to part of their property that's needed for the work to be done. So now it will need to be delayed (if I even can at this stage!) so I can track down the actual owner.

I didn't get it in writing because her response was all 'That's absolutely fine, don't worry at all.' No mention of not being able to give the permission or moving before it would happen. Maybe it's a lesson to learn but I think when you're on very friendly terms with neighbours it would be quite normal to not get written permission for this kind of thing.

Yeah that’s proper odd but maybe she did it that one time and felt she had gone too far down the rabbit hole to back out from the lie 🤣

That's honestly what I'm thinking!

And then she couldn't even say they were looking at buying and going to leave because then she would have to explain she didn't own this place and therefore wasn't selling it!

You say you were pleasantly surprised to learn she owned it.

Maybe she thought you would treat her differently if you knew she rented it?

If you just wanted access (without any risk to the property next door), I can see why she felt it was for her to say yes, not the landlord/landlady. The tenant has a right to peaceful enjoyment of the property, so the non-resident owner should be asking their permission anyway.

Since you bought this house, why were you expecting next door to be rented so that you were surprised to 'hear' that it wasn't?

I don’t really see the issue and thing you may have wrongly assumed. Surely you’d consult a neighbour if renovation works was to impact them regardless of their housing status?
You seem really invested in this.

What permission wee you asking?
"Can we come into your garden" (tenant question) is very different to a party wall agreement

I was pleasantly surprised solely because it would make it simpler liaising (about the structural works / renovations) with an owner who lived there rather than one renting it out and living someplace else.

Maybe she's in the process of buying it

But why is that surprising? Why did you think they rented?

Lots of people have reported neighbours being weird with them as tenants.

Maybe they’ve had this in the past from others.

Scaffolding in her property to address an issue that comes under my responsibility but if not done would affect both properties

Most people in my street rent their properties. Mine was rented before I bought it. I thought me and her were the only ones in the street to be owners who lived here.

Well that would potentially impact her right to quiet enjoyment of her property so even the landlord would have to consult her. Tenants aren’t some second rate leeches.

The work that's already complete would potentially impact their property long-term. But its not things that I technically needed their permission for I was just trying to be considerate by checking it was ok with the owner in advance.. but it wasn't the owner!

Surely if you’d done any serious work and were concerned about permissions, you would have asked if they owned, to check you’re okay to go ahead with work. If you’ve not checked, that’s on you. You don’t presume if it’s a serious matter.

How do you know this? How do you find this stuff out before you buy a place?

But that wouldn’t affect the owner. The tenant was well within her rights to give permission

TBH we don’t really advertise we don’t own the house we live in (only have to see the trampoline thread earlier to see how renters are viewed by some people!).
We don’t lie, just avoid the question. When did you buy, oh we moved in around 3 years ago etc.
I suspect neighbour did the same and you have assumed they own it.
To be honest, not sure any verbal permission is worth anything anyway. So not sure exactly what permission you’ve been asking for.

For context this is why I'm frustrated / confused. Only a few weeks ago I spoke to the neighbour and explained that a structural issue was starting to badly affect my property and if I didn't get it resolved urgently it would start to damage hers too. This is a problem I inherited and wasn't aware of initially!

I said I was also mindful that if I got the work done badly that could also affect the structural integrity of her property so we had a big discussion about the company I was going to use. I asked if she wanted to check anything or had any other questions for me to go to the company with.

She also confirmed she was happy for them to use her outside area as they needed.

I just find it odd and frustrating that she didn't point out she didn't own it and we should run this by the actual owner to check if they had questions or concerns. And she didn't even point out that she wouldn't actually be living there anymore at the time of the work so it would be impacting someone else!

I didn't know it tbh I just happened to meet and speak to quite a few of the neighbours on the other side of me before I knocked on her.

Land Registry searches are cheap and easy. I always obtain extracts for the properties closest to mine (particularly if it's a semi) if only to check for covenants.

I did this after the conversation with her partner and it confirmed she is NOT the owner!