To not understand the uproar over winter fuel allowance being cut?

[virgocatlover]

It's not being cut. The poorest pensioners on pension credit will still get it. It's only being changed so it's no longer a universal payment anymore.

The energy price cap was £1834 October 2023. This October it's £1717. So it's £117 cheaper than it was last winter for average use.

In April 2024 the state pension rose by 8.5% - a rise of around £900 for those on full state pension. It's expected to rise another £400 next April.

Many energy companies still have schemes for those in genuine need. Plus the warm home discount exists for those on a low income.

I understand pensions who receive just state pension and no other income may be annoyed but there has to be a cut somewhere. But pensioners are unlikely to have the expense of rent/ mortgages in retirement which is the biggest expense to those of working age.

However most of the moans I've heard and seen seem to be from the well off pensioners who are cross about losing something. I know a woman who rents out three houses and spends the winter in the Caribbean who is spitting feathers about losing the payment. Another who spent the money on their Christmas booze.

There is so much uproar about this which didn't happen when there were so many other cuts affecting young people/workers/families. All other benefits are means tested, so should WFA.

People still see pensioners as those who fought in the war and counting pennies at the till to pay for their bread and milk. But that's just not the case these days.

Like i told you earlier, the Tory proposal was to get rid of WFP completely, they wouldn't deny this, just as a leading Tory thinktank wanted to raise SPA to 71.

And I told you earlier that that’s completely untrue. Not even Labour alleged that. Have a look at Darren Jones’s ‘tweet of outrage’ - you know, the one he sent a few months before he got into office and then took away most WFA payments. He did not suggest that the Tories would withdraw all WFA payments.

The rest of your post is…whatever.

So what are the other 19% doing then?

Pensioners may have received a 10% increase but fuel, food and essential services have all increased by 10% or more! Pensioners are therefore either less well off than before or at the same level. The "full" UK State Pension is £11,500 per YEAR. Pensioners in Luxembourg receive over £5,200 PER MONTH! Judge a nation on how it treats its most vulnerable citizens!

I agree it shouldn't be a universal payment and received by those who have millions in the bank or those who spend their winters abroad but my mums pension is £2.41 over the limit to receive pension credit and the winter fuel payment makes a huge difference to her being able to put the heating on or not

Well, food inflation has been running at around 20%, even now its at 3% (it took 18 months to reduce to this figure) and pensioners tend to spend proportionately a lot on food and energy.

I just find it incredible that Labour are taking all this political pain for a saving of less than £1bn, even lower if a lot more people claim PC now.

Why didn't they freeze OfGem's cap announcement and then cut WPA? no one would have minded then.

My DP gets Pension Credit. He lives in a one bed Council maisonette. He pays no rent and no Council Tax.

Pensioners may have received a 10% increase but fuel, food and essential services have all increased by 10% or more! Pensioners are therefore either less well off than before or at the same level. The "full" UK State Pension is £11,500 per YEAR. Pensioners in Luxembourg receive over £5,200 PER MONTH! Judge a nation on how it treats its most vulnerable citizens!

How many workers received a 10% pay rise?

If it doesn’t affect you then maybe mind your own business and let people people annoyed about something they want to be annoyed about. Unless it directly affects you then YABU

That's a disgraceful thing to say. You should be ashamed of yourself. You'll be old yourself one day. Will you be happy for people to refer to you as a "massive burden"?

Yes, it's those who are just over the threshold for Pension Credit who will suffer.

People in FT work earn around 2x the SP.

The average salary is 36k, take home would be over 2k per month.

You cannot compare that to someone on 11.5k.

Plenty of employees got 8 to 10% pay rises, some much more, BT and Babcock to name just 2.

Everyone on NMW got a 10%

If it doesn’t affect you then maybe mind your own business and let people people annoyed about something they want to be annoyed about. Unless it directly affects you then YABU

Everyone should be concerned about the country's politics and spending, it is taxpayers money after all.

Maybe you think people shouldn't protest or have opinions about anything unless it directly affects them?

Depending on their savings, most will be eligible for Sheltered Housing from the Council. Obviously a wait though, and still rent to pay if you aren't on a low income.

So true.

I really think Thatcherism might be making a comeback, albeit among Labour supporters.

That's a very odd thing to say. Depending on which statistic you use (ONS or statista) between 65% and 74% of over 65s own their home, over 60% outright. So that is most pensioners (especially considering likely a lot of people will continue working to their late 60s not 65)

As you are single - as am I - Is that why you are opposed to them ending the single person discount on council tax ?

I keep seeing on this post and hearing the Labour Party quote “this black hole” they have been left.
Do they think we are forgetful or stupid, every government has left a “black hole” for the next to pick up including them.
Have the spine to own your decisions instead of blaming others for them, Labour are choosing their own targets, it’s their plan no one else’s.

Social housing or own with a mortgage

I disagree. It's very easy to claim as you only have to provide proof of income and savings. Plenty of agencies to help you claim if you get stuck, such as Citizens Advice etc. If you meet the criteria, you can't possibly get turned down.

What???

I wouldn't blame Thatcher in 1979 when she took over the country, for the mess we were in then and no one should be blaming Labour for the crisis we are in now.

Even if you dismiss a black hole, we still have to fund nhs dentistry, sort out roads, thats £11bn, then water and sewage in rivers, 100s of billions, 7.6m on waiting lists... thats another few 100 billion, a collapsing Prison system, another 100 billion,then there is PO & Blood compensation, RAAC buildings, its depressing.

This country is in the worst state its been in since WW2 and back then, we had the USA's Marshall aid money, commonwealth and not much international competition.

A three-bed semi in parts of London will set you back 1M. It will not be a huge house at all. And you are expecting people to downsize to an area that they have no support in, do not know, have no friends or relatives around them. Why? So energy companies can continue to profiteer?

@iwishihadknownmore I’m not saying they are to blame, I am saying every new government that has came in has had a “black hole” to contend with.
Whenever labour are asked about the decision’s they are making now it’s the black hole to blame, but they are choosing their own policy’s and need to own them.

Pension credit may be easy to get but a lot of older people think it's only available to the really badly off and wouldn't think to ask. When my DM was assessed for Attendance Allowance they actually said she should be claiming pension credit - only because that would allow them to take part of the AA and part of the PC towards the cost of her carers - until then there hadn't been a whisper about pension credit. They were so keen to get part of the PC that they sent us the form, already filled out my them, just needed signing. Both the forms ran to pages and pages, made as vague and at the same time, as complicated as possible.

This. Totally, 1000%.

Debt to GDP isn't a Black Hole, i cannot believe you think it is but the Tories have increased debt to almost 100% from what they inherited in 2010.

The £21bn Black Hole is un funded public spending, the only way to fix that is tax or borrow more and/or public service cuts.

Thats what the Tories have left Labour, even the Pay Review body pay rises weren't accounted for, so one can only presume the Tories planned on a 1 or 2% pay rise for Nurses Teachers and Army.