To not understand the uproar over winter fuel allowance being cut?

[virgocatlover]

It's not being cut. The poorest pensioners on pension credit will still get it. It's only being changed so it's no longer a universal payment anymore.

The energy price cap was £1834 October 2023. This October it's £1717. So it's £117 cheaper than it was last winter for average use.

In April 2024 the state pension rose by 8.5% - a rise of around £900 for those on full state pension. It's expected to rise another £400 next April.

Many energy companies still have schemes for those in genuine need. Plus the warm home discount exists for those on a low income.

I understand pensions who receive just state pension and no other income may be annoyed but there has to be a cut somewhere. But pensioners are unlikely to have the expense of rent/ mortgages in retirement which is the biggest expense to those of working age.

However most of the moans I've heard and seen seem to be from the well off pensioners who are cross about losing something. I know a woman who rents out three houses and spends the winter in the Caribbean who is spitting feathers about losing the payment. Another who spent the money on their Christmas booze.

There is so much uproar about this which didn't happen when there were so many other cuts affecting young people/workers/families. All other benefits are means tested, so should WFA.

People still see pensioners as those who fought in the war and counting pennies at the till to pay for their bread and milk. But that's just not the case these days.

I think you need to read up on why some pensioners get pension credits and those who don't.

It's not to do with a tiny private pension it's to do with how many years you've worked.

Ie those who have paid enough NI will miss out on WFA, those that haven't won't

Perhaps someone from one of the younger generations who are supportive of cutting pensioners income why they don't seem to realise that all too soon they will be recipients of the pensions, that they are currently so against. I often read and hear younger people state that there will be no state pension when they get old, well, with the attitude some have, by supporting the cuts, you are giving the giv carte blanche to continue cutting. If you want a pension when your time comes you need to support it, or you will lose it. I have also read that they are planning to increase social housing rents by over and above the RPI over the next 10 years, cut the 25% council tax discount as well as this cut to the heating allowance. If I was a single pensioner, renting a council flat, relying on my state pension, I would be very worried about how I will be able to support myself in future. And they call the Torys the nasty party.

Yes something did need to be done about it, my parents and all their friends going on their multiple cruises a year do not need it! I guess the question is does it start fuel poverty for some, is the cut off high enough?

Some pensioners are literally £1 - £2 over the cap for pension credit, the fuel allowance made a difference. Should have just means tested and stopped millionaires receiving it.

Which makes it feel all the more unfair.

Odd how some posters laugh at pensioners suffering

Still have to pay rent in social housing. It's not free

You might like to reflect on the costs of home ownership. Most do no receive any benefit.

Pensioners who have spent their working life paying off the mortgage, also have to pay higher council tax as 'homeowners' as opposed to social tenant's. Also pay higher utility bills and clearly pay all maintenence, unlike tenants.

OK, they have the equity in the house, but you can't sell a window, or a couple of doors to pay winter power bills.

The good thing, if the house doesn't have to sold to pay for care costs, maybe there can be some trickle down inheritance.
Few of my generation had that help fm the Bank of Mum and Dad, we had to save for years to amass the deposit.

Frankly, I now think I should stayed with social housing, spending all on Entertainment, holidays, eating out. Leaving 'them' to pay my winter fuel and then the care home.

They don’t. Unexpectedly renting at 66.

Well, since Labour's own 2017 research concluded that not having the WFA would cause 3,850 deaths that year, it seems like a no brainer.

UK pensioners are 15th in list of highest pensions paid, with most of European pensioners receving much more.
Considering the UK experiences much colder temperatures through winter, surely they deserve a break.

www.almondfinancial.co.uk/pension-breakeven-index-how-does-the-uk-state-pension-compare-to-the-rest-of-europe/

Yes we did contribute to your education - just you will contribute for the next generation - as it should be

They are wracking their brains for a fair way to ensure that those in need get it and those not in need don't. Trouble is it's really hard to means test without spending a shed load of ££ which would cancel out any savings. But it's madness that people say like my mum and auntie are getting it. They don't need it. They are not the only ones. If they stopped paying it to people living in say high council tax bands they could help those that are really struggling. It's a waste of money to give it to the well-off pensioners who can afford winter sunshine holidays and a nice lifestyle. I remember my mum used to have her TV licence paid for which was bonkers. Now the government only pays for those over 75 on pension credits.

I guess that's not the problem of those who are losing the WFA though, since they'll be dead by then so maybe they don't give a shit? I guess those coming out with ridiculous comments like "having children is a choice, growing old isn't" are particularly unlikely to care about the future generations...

We didn’t need the bank of mum and dad, that’s why.

Pensioners who have spent their working life paying off the mortgage, also have to pay higher council tax as 'homeowners' as opposed to social tenant's. Also pay higher utility bills and clearly pay all maintenence, unlike tenants.

Absolutely none of this is true. Do you really think that people in social housing pay less council tax or less for utilities? It's true they don't have to pay maintenance but neither would you if you chose to rent.

I think many believe it's inevitable that the state pension will have to change - it's not sustainable as it is. It will either become means tested or raised to an age so high most people will be dead before they get there or have to use up their private pension (if they have one) to bridge the gap.

Your mother is in the bracket I feel for. The threshold should be higher so that she still qualifies

Pensioners who have spent their working life paying off the mortgage, also have to pay higher council tax as 'homeowners' as opposed to social tenant's. Also pay higher utility bills and clearly pay all maintenence, unlike tenants.

Council tax is not higher for home owners. People can get discounts on their council tax if they have a low income, home owner or not.

Mmmmm. Firstly a lot of 66+ people do still have to pay rent. In our case, it will affect us. I only have state pension, I was self employed for 32 years, and had to stop paying into a private pension when my 1st marriage broke down. I worked 6.5 days a week, up to 10 hours a day just to pay the mortgage, bills and put food on the table. I only became eligible for any benefit, the year my youngest turned 18, as there was no UC for the self employed until that year.
My 2nd hubby was only EO grade in the Civil Service, but managed to save quite a bit over the years and of course has a decent(ish) work pension.He also worked until he was 70.
So, we are not that well off but have too much pension and savings between us, to claim benefits of any sort.
I have always agreed that Fuel Allowance should be means tested but the current Government have set the bar far too low! Most of our friends are in the same situation and will miss the payment.

Strange that there is money to pay off well paid train drivers but have to cut the winter allowance for pensioners, a fairer way would have been to tax it so well off pensioners would have paid tax on it and poorer nothing. Next it will be the 25% single council discount for single people.

I don’t live in the South.

YANBU. I'm one of the parents who lost child tax credit when the thresholds changed in ~2013. I was by no means a high earner or wealthy at the time but accepted that I could get by without it. I then lost child benefit payments, which had always been universal before.

Suck it up, buttercup. If you don't need it then you shouldn't get it.

Agree

Couldn’t agree with everything you said any more, the pensioners haven’t had any of the other austerity/cuts impact them over the last few years-their pensions have gone up with the cost of living inflation (unlike most workers), they vast majority are mortgage free meaning they haven’t been impacted by BOE interest rate rises like the working generation-instead their savings have been boosted. I was saying a few years ago why is this not cut/means tested. You have lots of young families who are working but in low paid jobs struggling more and they don’t get anything each winter for this.