Feral children

[Overbearingndn]

Several children, have been arrested in connection with the death of an 80 year old dog walker.

What is wrong with children today? I remember the Bulger case and it sent shockwaves around the world, now people just accept that children kill.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/sep/03/five-children-arrested-over-murder-80-year-old-man-in-leicestershire

opening post edited by MNHQ

YellowAsteroid · Yesterday 07:05

Well, when one young rioter's mother jetted off for a holiday in Spain after her son's arrest., you can kind of see the kind of parenting these children don't get.

I wonder if she's just had enough of him and said, "That's it, I'm sick of it and you're on your own."

I was 14 in 1984 and a lad from the neighbourhood, also 14, stole a Police car, was in a chase and crashed it. His mother refused to go to court and told the Police, "Send him to Borstal, I've tried and he takes not a blind bit of notice."

Children go through phases of liking only certain foods, constantly playing with a certain toy or game for a few months. It’s part of growing up and nothing to do with ND.

Would you class a kid that ate nothing but spaghetti hoops on toast for 4 months as ND? This was a friend of mine who is a vet. Plus she eats a variety of foods now

You should inform the specialists diagnosing the children. They obviously don't know about phases. Start a campaign.

I dont know whether you're being genuinely obtuse or you really dont know that crime is higher from the cohort Im talking about. Im not here writing a dissertation but a quick google (which you could also have done) shows some crime stats for London alone, Im not looking any further than that but the pattern is represented around the country

On top of that, we know that comorbid factors which are associated with each other are drug use/misuse, MH, chronic unemployment and underemployment, overcrowding, poor educational levels etc

https://trustforlondon.org.uk/data/crime-and-income-deprivation/

I'm obviously obtuse, as I looked at your data and it doesn't mention domestic abuse. Nada. What I'm looking for is data that backs up your claim that Domestic abuse is more likely to come from a certain demographic. That's what I asked for evidence of.

Well my father, beat the crap out our mum and he was a highly paid professional.
DV is across all of the population, didn't our former PM have a complaint made against him? he also fathered a great deal of children by many different mothers, something that would have had many of us calling for sterilisation had he been from a council estate.

Anyway, poorer people often commit crime to provide illegal things for the better off, like drugs, which apparently most MPs have used or still do!! but thats all ok.

and the better off commit crimes like failing to enforce or even put into law, safe & secure buildings that poor people end up living in but no one seems to care about any of that.

I think its included in the stats for violence generally but as I said, Im not writing a dissertation for you.

I'm sorry to hear about your dad.

I'm aware of abuse statistics and yes it's unfortunately from every demographic. It knows no bounds.

I have made the point several times in the thread that middle class drug users contribute to the violence people are complaining about, but apparently it's not relevant as it doesn't suit an agenda.

You're right, Johnson was a toe rag but he was posh, so his philandering doesn't count.

There's a lot of middle class crime which is conveniently ignored because they don't come from deprived areas. It's easier to dehumanise people and make generalisations than form a cogent argument.

The ‘better off’ might buy cocaine but they are absolutely not the brunt of the drug consuming market. Some of this thread is utter nonsense so posters can avoid uncomfortable truths. The vast majority of street crime, drug related crime, gang related crime and theft offences are carried out by people from poorer backgrounds. You know it, I know it, bringing up a middle class criminal doesn’t change it.

the better off commit crimes like failing to enforce or even put into law, safe & secure buildings that poor people end up living in but no one seems to care about any of that.

There’s been a 6 year, multi million pound enquiry, questions in Parliament, almost inevitable prosecutions, hours of prime time coverage and £10 million in donated funds.

Which part of that screams ‘no one cares’?

Middle-class people consume more alcohol and illegal drugs than those living below the poverty line, according to a report by a cross-party group of academics and campaigners.
The report, compiled by the Social Metrics Commission, compared the circumstances of those living above and below the poverty line. It found two-thirds (66%) of those who are comparatively better off have drunk to excess in the last year, compared with just 58% of the most deprived. It also found 22% had taken illegal drugs, 9% higher than less well-off people.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/sep/16/middle-class-consume-more-drugs-and-alcohol-than-poorer-people

Buying drugs means contributing towards gang culture and exploitation of children. There's also a link between alcohol/coke and domestic abuse. Last time I checked, domestic abuse was a crime and affected a quarter of women in the UK. Drug taking isn't just confined to coke, a lot of middle class people smoke weed.

I wonder why the other 4 children were released without charge. And whether they were part of the sane gang the elderly man had previously reported to the police for harassing him. Surely ' joint enterprise ' covers exactly this scenario?

Prosecutions? don't make me laugh!! the enquiry actually makes prosecutions less likely, as the people concerned can now not have a "fair trial"
The whole thing has been designed to ensure no one ends up in court, hence the "failings go back decades" Lord Pickles (former housing sec) even complained to the enquiry that he had to be somewhere, so could they get on with it!! they also didn't even have the authority to demand witnesses attend, so many didn't, feigning illness.

There are 1000s of buildings all over the UK with this type of cladding, buildings that have known fire risks with people still living in them.

But the people in them, are in the main, poor and so it doesn't really matter, with Govt and the building industry arguing about who should pay.

Had this cladding only been used in private schools, it would have all been removed years ago.

Then there is the fact that even now, there are hardly any min standards for rented accomodation and the few that do exist, aren't enforced, with tenants too scared to complain.

Anyway, we digress.

Just as people don't want to admit that their coke and cannabis habit contributes to street level crime.

Exactly. The wider social group were likely involved in targeting this man.

It reminds me of the murder of Bijan Ebrahimi in Bristol. He was disabled and, horror of horrors, a refugee. He liked growing flowers outside his flat. Kids took to trashing it. So he took pictures to find the culprit. So word spread that he was a non*e. 2 people were convicted but a whole mob turned up to attack him. All still live in that estate in Bristol

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Bijan_Ebrahimi

It's so heartbreaking. Live in the next village along. Over the past couple of weeks loads of people have been posting on NextDoor about the appearance of youths roaming around the orchard centre intimidating people. All fell on deaf ears, and police didn't seem bothered. Some were young as 7-8 years old. Hate to say this but it all happened the exact same time travellers moved into the area. My wife came back from shopping there after they moved in and said it had suddenly become really sketchy. Such a tragedy that could have been avoided if the police had more of a presence there before it came to this. It was only a matter of time.

We get teens moping about at work. Running about swearing at both customers and staff, opening bags of sweets, taking a few - leaving the rest on shelf. Then as we have a ramp to the roof top car park they ride their bikes the wrong way and chuck stuff from the bins onto the prescient below.

I didn’t dare do things like that. We went to each other’s houses and played computer games, hung out there

It was in my local news a few years back that teenagers somehow got onto the roof of the multi storey carpark and pushed a supermarket trolley from there onto a car below that was parked at a business.
Luckily the poor man wasn't in it.
A group of teens also filmed a woman and put it on social media when she was committing suicide jumping off another multi storey car park. It was sent across multiple social media platforms and shared widely before the police got involved. Disgusting.

I thought joint enterprise was for cases where they don’t know who struck the killer blow and can’t prove it, so all involved are prosecuted under joint enterprise. If they know who struck the killer blow they can prosecute that person, and if they know who struck the killer blow the others then have a defence it wasn’t them that committed murder so joint enterprise wouldn’t apply as in joint enterprise they can’t prove it wasn’t them. Someone up thread wondered if the attack had been filmed and that’s why the four were released quite quickly as there was evidence available

@Morph22010 or possibly the poor man was able to give a statement to the police? I know he was reported as being able to tell his daughter about his injuries when she found him so maybe he was able to say there was just one attacker. It has all moved VERY quickly, I hope for swift justice for his family, friends and the community.

Not it is not back to sterilisation. The simple way to stop women making single motherhood a career choice is to put an end to the benefits of being a career single mother. In cases like that of my husbands ex, she is more than happy to tell the world how she planned to have a child. She had it all worked out before she left school. Her plan was to stay at home, work in a cafe until she was 18 then find a bloke that would do a runner when they found out she was pregnant, get her Dad to write a letter telling the council he had thrown her out. Get the flat and all the extras that came with it and being pregnant. Her plan worked, she got the flat, she got the money for the pram, cot and highchair, she got the white goods and a grant to decorate. And 30 odd years later she is still sitting in a 3 bed house that she has never paid a penny in rent for. How many more made the same career choice?
No need for sterilisation just wipe the career off the list. Of course there are many that end up as single mothers not through choice and yes they need help and it must be given.

So you're judging all single mothers on one example?

It's unusual for women to choose to have children alone, I don't know anyone who has made that choice. Social housing is rare as hen's teeth, so they would be very foolish to think that would be a good idea.

I remember in the 80s and 90s when the right wing press branded all single mothers as scroungers. I found it interesting that men who had abandoned their children weren't criticised and even now, aren't forced to pay for their own children. Interesting isn't it?

A lot of interesting points. I think we shouldn't underplay the probable racist element to this attack. I think it was highly likely to have been racially motivated- racism probably learnt from their parents.
Whilst we should definitely look at the issue of violent/feral youths, poor parenting, poverty etc. we need to also address this growing tide of racism. What can be done about it? I read of another case recently where a black woman was chased by a gang of youths. She collapsed and died of an asthma attack. This was on the bbc website. I've also heard of other cases of teenagers attacking non-white people.
Racism has become a poison in our society, fuelled by the right wing media and online influences. Every time I go on X about a third of the posts I see are racist. It's very concerning and gas become normalised. People from ethnic minorities have been dehumanised.

Why not get the feckless fathers to pay up for their kids? DNA tests and then all benefits go to the child. If the father works then a level equal to benefits goes to the child as a minimum. Have more than one kid and not working? Pay for each kid by doing community work (street cleaning etc) with the work payment going to the child. Can’t be bothered then the father’s family get benefits taken away to pay for the kids. That would make men strap on a condom. Why should single mums get the blame when these loser dads are drinking , smoking, doing drugs instead of paying for their kids.

Completely agree. I think you should get a criminal record and forced to do community service for not paying for your children. They then not only abandon their children, they go on to have other families! Yet women are blamed. Anyone would think we lived in a mysogynist society.

This!!!