An insight into the mindset of someone who is persistently late.

[deviantfeline]

There's always loads of posts on AIBU about people who hate those who are persistently late and how there no excuse for it. Also lots of people claiming 'time blindness' or inability to plan that causes it.

I'm often late. I hate it but my brain doesn't seem to be able to calculate periods of time in a way that means I can plan appropriately. Today was one of those even though I thought I totally had this. Reflecting on what went wrong here's a timeline.

I needed to get a train at 12pm to a meeting. They are once an hour and so couldn't miss it. I set an alarm at 11am that told me to go and get ready to leave for the station. It's a 3 minutes drive and a 2 minute walk from the car park. I know that at this time it's hard to get a parking spot so I factor in time to find one. I'll leave at 11.40 ish then. I spent the morning working from home.

11- alarm goes off. I think oh I've got loads of time and carry on working thinking I'll stop at 11.15 and get myself ready.
11.15 - think I'll finish the email I'm writing
11.23 - finish email and pack bag
Realise my make up and hair need a touch up and I've got loads of time so do that
11.32 - result. I'm done and ready to go with time to spare. This is easy! Find coat and shoes, locate car and door keys, put cups in dishwasher, find umbrella as it's now raining and my phone charger, kiss dog goodbye and give her a treat, lock up house.
Get in car. Somehow it's now 11.47?! How the hell did that happen? It was 11.32 wasn't it? Fuck fuck fuck.
11.52 - arrive at car park having had to stop at a zebra for 2 mins for loads of people crossing. Hadn't factored in the high street would busy as it's midday.
No car parks as predicted! Drive back up the street and finally find one. It's 11.58. Grab my stuff and sprint and get on the train as the doors are closing.

Despite my planning i screwed it up again. I've noticed that I have a time blindness for the time it takes between 'I'm ready' and actually going. In my mind that would take 30 seconds yet it somehow took 15 minutes?!

Its almost worse when I leave plenty time as my brain starts telling me I've got time to do other stuff rather then just leaving! Also I can't visualise the time passing since I looked at the time at 11.32 and getting in the car. That time seems to be the black spot for me to time manage with any ability.

Crisis only slightly averted but I'm soo cross with myself. So you 'on timers'. What would you have done differently and what was my biggest error?

Quite. All the posts about 'but I don't understand why you don't just' and 'I do x y and z to be on time' and the 'why didn't you and why haven't you' etc etc etc are really just making a point that ironically they aren't able to see. You don't understand - that is the whole point! If you did, you wouldn't be asking the questions! You don't get it, we heard you. You don't like it, we also heard you.

Seemingly, some of you you have also had the misfortune to encounter some truly and legitimately selfish people - but your utter refusal to acknowledge that other people can struggle with time in a completely genuine way is bordering on obtuse now. And a bit foot-stamping tantrumy that you can't get other people to conform to how YOU want things to be.

If you don't like it then move on. Leave on time and let the other person figure out their way. Let them miss the train, plane etc. Let the friendship dwindle if that's what you feel is of most value in the relationship. Just stop whining about it.

I'm very sorry about your family member. Alcoholism's horrible, including for the people around the drinker.

Processing disorders are 'medical conditions' in that they are not choices but neurological differences. Everyone's CNS is individual; differences are called 'disorders' when they adversely impact a person's ability to integrate successfully with their society. This thread - and all the others like it - show that time blindness very much does! Someone would have to be mad to do this out of pride, cussedness or whatever else we're accused of.

Admittedly, some people are that mad (everyone's different, etc) but you won't find those people frantically wasting money on stuff that might help or hurtling in at the last minute, almost crying from anxiety.

Anyway. I've now ignored nine reminders to go to bed so, in the spirit of the discussion, I'll wish you goodnight.

I did not bother to read a lot of the rest of your post because I just could not take that paragraph seriously

She wasn't dismissing it as a bad idea, she was telling you why it doesn't work for her. For the way her brain works, which is different to yours.

This

You need to aim for 10-15 minutes earlier than the actual train departure. Bring a book. Then you have a safety margin if things go wrong.

* true but that's 10-15 min of your time wasted hanging about*

And herein, my friends, lies the problem with pathologoically late people.
They absolutely, hate the idea of having to "waste time waiting around", so they try to fill in this supposed extra time they have with stuff that, invariably takes longer than the time they thought they had (which they never had to start with).

And this is why people who manage to make things in time are so outraged. The other day I had to hear a dear friend of mine explaining that she was laste because "well then I thought, I will just do the dishes, because then I won't have to waste 10 minutes just waiting for Aurynne". That was after making me wait for 30 minutes, AGAIN, because she was late, AGAIN. I have spent, in total, whole DAYS of my life wasted waiting for this particular friend just because she does not want to risk wasting 5 minutes of her time in the very unlikely case she was 5 minutes early. Whihc she NEVER is.

For chronically late people the mere idea of having to wait and do nothing for 5 min sounds inconceivable... but in the process they completely dismiss the hours and hours of time they force other people they supposedly care about to do exactly that: WAIT AROUND, for their sorry arses, with nothing to do, because you're waiting for the people who are late, and you don't even have the luxury of deciding to do something else, because you actually were the good friend who were there in time so now you're stuck in a place just standing and waiting.

This. I have a pet peeve at the moment about certain things being 'disregulating' etc for ND people and there seems to be a perception that NT people 'don't find them as hard'.
Lets be clear. We do. We all hate waiting around (its why we hate the late people!!!), nobody actually like having to wait their turn, queue for shit, we just work really bloody hard to be patient about it, put up with it. Just like we all work really hard every day on the exec funtioning stuff, it doesn't just come easy to NT people?

This is the very thing I was wondering! But probably the late people wouldn’t tolerate other late people….

Was just thinking that when I drive to meet friends who live a couple of hours away, and do there can be delays etc, I just send them my Google maps journey so they can see exactly where I am, and can plan their own time. Most people don’t seem aware of this facility tho’. If I had a friend now who was chronically late, and I could be bothered to maintain that friendship’ I would just suggest that we share location temporarily for that reason. If they refuse then they clearly really are just selfish twats. And if I ever reconnect with my pathologically late ex, I would insist.

just like we all work really hard every day on the exec funtioning stuff, it doesn't just come easy to NT people?

Yes, so true. I think there is a (wrong) assumption that if you are NT you never struggle with anything. Not true. NT people can suffer mental health issues just as much as anyone else. Personally, waiting for someone gives me massive anxiety and yet apparently thats fine and I just have to suffer that because someone cannot be arsed to give me a heads up they'll be late 🙄

I'm not often late any more, but I don't mind it when other people are. Unless you have theatre tickets or a plane to catch, it's not a big deal. I just chill out while waiting and look forward to seeing them.

@aurynne
Did you explain this to your friend?

I have a very dear friend too who is always late (and has ADHD) and cannot tolerate waiting even for 5 minutes. I tell her the wrong/earlier times to meet now and we can both arrive at the time planned.

I cannot explain to her how anxious I feel if she arrives 'just in time' or late for a train (for example) - she thinks I am just too caught up in being early and ridiculously punctual. (She wandered off to buy coffee 5 minutes before a train arrived for example on an occasion when I did manage to get us to the station early.)

However, because she does have ADHD I work with her to develop strategies that enable us to keep our friendship. She is fun, loyal and a great friend.

My MIL on the other hand uses time and keeping people waiting as a form of control and my attitude towards this is totally different.

They absolutely, hate the idea of having to "waste time waiting around", so they try to fill in this supposed extra time they have with stuff that, invariably takes longer than the time they thought they had (which they never had to start with).

I don't feel like it works this way with genuine executive dysfunction/time blindness. It's just not that conscious a process. You think you have enough time to do the things you need to do, and then you don't, and you find it hard to understand why and how that's happened. Or you get blindsided by your executive dysfunction at the last minute.

I can be 95% ready to leave and have my keys/phone in my hand one minute then put them down and forget where I put them because I have a shit short term memory (ADHD).

I have had full blown meltdowns over doing this. My partner has had to break off work to help me find whatever it is and calm me down. Part of the reason I find it so distressing is because I have tried so hard and then I'm late anyway and I know people are going to judge me as selfish, disorganised and inconsiderate. They don't see me getting in the car still crying because I'm so frustrated with my own brain, and having to fix my makeup in the car park.

Thank Christ I don't regularly have to go into an office any more, I mostly WFH.

If "not wanting to waste time hanging about" is the reason people are saying they're late, then they are being inconsiderate and wasting others' time rather than their own.

The funny bit is you didn't actually finish reading what I said, where I said we do set alarms.

You couldn't be bothered to do something to help your own understanding.

You can't teach the unteachable 🤷‍♀️

Why on earth have you made that assumption? Despite the many posters on here who have explained that they're reasonable people who are not trying to be late on purpose just to piss you off? Just to continue the catty narrative?

I'm often late and I have several friends who are absolutely the same. It doesn't often bother me because I understand the struggle. If it's blatantly because they were disregarding our planned time for selfish reasons then I'd think of them as selfish people rather than late people. And of course I'd be wary to make further arrangements.

But if I know someone is perpetually late for genuine reasons then I'd decide an falsely earlier meeting time and tell them that one, or I'd try and add on time at the end of the meet so we still had time together because, you know, I actually like the person. Or I'd arrange something that was pretty casual so timelines didn't matter as much. And I wouldn't be so stressed if I was going to be a few minutes late - I'd probably revel in the feeling of being guilt-free if I'm honest!

I wouldn't rigidly arrive bang on time and huff about it. It's like you've deliberately tried to get self righteous points, I'm not into that. Working round the problem can be done from both sides.

Again, if you don't like it then stop doing it and move on. It sounds like you don't really like those people anyway so why torture yourself?

Yes I read the bit where you said that you forget the alarm has gone off. That’s where you use the snooze button so it goes off again… and again…. And again.

I suffer similar, keep your clock in car a few minutes faster but don't let yourself know how many minutes it is ahead ( get someone else to set it) have a clock a few minutes faster in your home and work by that not the one on your phone.

You can't teach the unteachable

You have an uncanny knack for proving other people's point for them so beautifully, @Mumofnarnia while remaining completely oblivious.

All of this.

And when it comes to waiting for people and not ordering at restaurants - why is the person who's late more important than those who aren't? Why do people upset the ones who are on time, but not the one who can't be bothered to get there on time (eg the one where the poster's husband went to get her).

I once had this with a work thing - most people were on time but a few weren't. The speaker said he'd wait for them and I asked why he was giving the latecomers more respect than those of us who arrived on time and he couldn't answer. In fact he seemed quite annoyed that I was annoyed.

On the other hand I remember doing a postgraduate course - on the first day we had a 3 hour session with a break in the middle. People came back late from the break and the lecturer really laid into the whole class. Why on earth I didn't go up to her at the end and ask her why she felt the need to lecture the ones who'd been back on time I don't know! I've got a feeling youngsters would take less crap these days.

Really?? Are you trying to prove my point for me then??

As I have said in my reply to that poster and as I have said many times in this thread, it’s not the people with conditions that people are frustrated with, it’s the people without these conditions who know they are going to be late but don’t give a monkeys anyway and are happy to keep people waiting. But that poster never responded to that part of my post.

Also, it does make a lot of sense that if you have a tendency to forget that an alarm has gone off, then use the snooze button so that it keeps going off.

Then why keep asking why they don't use alarms / keep things in the right place / 'just leave on time'?? What you say you're talking about are selfish people, not late people and alarms are immaterial because they've made no effort to be on time anyway. The posters you're responding to and giving ever so helpful tips to and then ignoring their replies are not those people. They have explained that to you but will not hear it. So, yeah, it is people with conditions that people are frustrated with.

Also, it does make a lot of sense that if you have a tendency to forget that an alarm has gone off, then use the snooze button so that it keeps going off.

To you. It makes sense to you.
What part of can't teach the unteachable doesn't apply to you??

Just stop whining about it.

Frankly we could all say the same back. The OP was asking how to fix it, we gave ideas, things that have worked for us, you all seem to be
No, nope, cant do that, time blindness.

Just stop whining about it then. Be late, lose jobs, miss planes, just stop whining about it.

Oh stop twisting it around!!! I have never once told that poster they are a selfish person! As I said, many, many of my posts on here have been about lazy NT people who just cannot be arsed, I’ve explained that to you - but as you say, you can’t teach the unteachable!

I do lose jobs and miss planes! And I'm under no illusion that I won't again in the future, despite your exasperation - because, yeah, time blindness, which a real thing you don't understand! 😂. So thanks for your permission but I don't really need it.

I'm not whining about it, just telling you how it happens and why your strategies don't work for me. I'm not huffing and puffing about someone else's behaviour, I'm fully aware it's my issue.

I always add in at least an extra 30 mins to an hour for any journey, to account for any ‘problems’ . If you’re “too” early -so what? Better to early than too late. Always.