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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be livid with DS - or should I be chalking this up to youthful silliness?

446 replies

GerbilsForever24 · 25/08/2024 02:39

DS is 13. He has a friend over for a sleepover. I've long given up policing bed time during sleepovers so am used to them all being up until all hours.

I just woke up and clearly my spidey senses were tingling as I went to check on them. Only to discover they were nowhere in the house. Turns out they'd climbed out of the window in the lounge and were sitting on a small footbridge just down from our house.

I am furious on about 50 different levels. I am not really the paranoid type, but let's face it - 2 13 year old boys wondering around on a Saturday night is not a no-risk scenario and even if they didn't get into "trouble" or nothing bad happened to them, if anyone had seen them coming out the window that would have likely generated a call to the police. Not least because we have a known gang of young teenage boys around here who are an absolute menace and the entire neighbourhood are on watch for them - no one would have known these were just two stupid 13 year olds sneaking out rather than this existing group of twits. Plus, because they went out the window and it was therefore left open, I am pretty unhappy about being left alone, asleep upstairs while my house was completely exposed.

I have taken their phones and sent them both to bed. I was livid. And yes, there was some shouting - although I think the super scary type where I'm clearly furious but am not screaming like a banshee.

DS has come in to my room crying and apologising and saying he didn't think about the risk. I've told him I accept that but there will still be consequences.

Full disclosure, he has ADHD as well so that adds an element of thoughtless to things.

It's not unreasonable to be this angry is it? Part of me thinks "isn't this just normal silliness"? And am I over reacting because DS is in a phase of thinking every rule and boundary in place is just to irritate him, vs because there's an actua reason.

OP posts:
NowImNotDoingIt · 25/08/2024 10:23

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:19

Haven’t RTFT, but did read all your posts OP.

While it is ok to have been angry, I think it was unreasonable to be livid, which is to be extremely and furiously angry.

They must have been only a few metres away because they heard you push the window open and reappeared in your line of sight without you ever having to call them. That is closer than the bottom of my garden.

I don’t think they did anything particularly stupid or dangerous. Cycling without a helmet is much more dangerous as a comparison.

If your boundary is that they should not have done this, then you can be angry and tell them so without shouting and threatening “consequences”. Your fears and paranoia are your issues, and are not an excuse to lash out your teenager and especially not someone else’s teen.

If it had been my teen at your sleepover I would have thought your reaction to be extreme and expected an apology to myself and my teen.

So your kid SNEAKS out of someone's house after midnight , and you would want an apology from the host? What if something happened to your kid?

What is wrong with you?

It's not paranoid to be angry at 2 13 yos snuck out of the window, left the house unsecured and went "walkies" in the middle of the night.

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:23

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:20

You’re one of those parents are you?

Yes, and proud of it.

MzHz · 25/08/2024 10:24

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:22

Sorry, but I read all the OP’s posts and she makes no mention of “known gang of troublemakers hanging about” are you quite sure you haven’t imagined this gang?

Not least because we have a known gang of young teenage boys around here who are an absolute menace and the entire neighbourhood are on watch for them

from the op.

ttcat37 · 25/08/2024 10:24

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:13

It what I know. They just would not have been interested in sneaking out at that age. They were both shy, introverted children and the idea of that would have not been appealing at all. They’re grown now, one is a tattooed, vaping twenty something who partied hard at Uni but was very reserved as a child. I could have had the doors wide open and they wouldn’t have ‘sneaked’ out.

It’s what you think you know anyway. And that’s what matters.

Megifer · 25/08/2024 10:24

"No wonder there are kids wandering the streets very late making nuisances of themselves and their parents don’t care."

Agree I'm pretty shocked at some of these responses, and can definitely see why some kids think they can get away with all sorts because the consequences will just be a wet paper towel explanation why it's not a good idea.

NowImNotDoingIt · 25/08/2024 10:25

@ToBeDetermined it's right in the OP about the troublemaking gang of boys. Try reading it again.

OlPackingTape · 25/08/2024 10:25

usernamedifferent · 25/08/2024 10:19

Nowhere has the OP said she only ever shouts at her children.

When I was doing teacher training 25 years ago my mentor told me to “save your shouting for when you really need it, then it’s very effective”. That has stuck with me throughout my career and as a parent. I can count on one hand the number of times I have really had to shout at a student or my own children.

A 13 year old and his friend - who the OP was responsible for last night - snuck out in the early hours. The sickening moment when she saw their beds were empty and the window open. Absolutely this was a moment when shouting was needed.

I know OP hasn’t said this. I’m responding to PP who said “The OP shouting isn't putting anyone in danger. It's called parenting”. Parenting and shouting are not synonymous. You can deal effectively with misbehaviour without just yelling.

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:27

NowImNotDoingIt · 25/08/2024 10:23

So your kid SNEAKS out of someone's house after midnight , and you would want an apology from the host? What if something happened to your kid?

What is wrong with you?

It's not paranoid to be angry at 2 13 yos snuck out of the window, left the house unsecured and went "walkies" in the middle of the night.

It’s not sneaking to just go outside so close to the house you hear the window open….

I said I would like an apology for this other parent OTT shouting at my teenager, as it isn’t their right to set boundaries for or punish my kid.

What is going to happen to my kid? If they are so close they can hear a window open, how far away can they be? Close enough for me.

An open window isn’t leaving a house unsecured 😂 it’s summer, I have half a dozen windows open all day and all night.

MzHz · 25/08/2024 10:27

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:19

Haven’t RTFT, but did read all your posts OP.

While it is ok to have been angry, I think it was unreasonable to be livid, which is to be extremely and furiously angry.

They must have been only a few metres away because they heard you push the window open and reappeared in your line of sight without you ever having to call them. That is closer than the bottom of my garden.

I don’t think they did anything particularly stupid or dangerous. Cycling without a helmet is much more dangerous as a comparison.

If your boundary is that they should not have done this, then you can be angry and tell them so without shouting and threatening “consequences”. Your fears and paranoia are your issues, and are not an excuse to lash out your teenager and especially not someone else’s teen.

If it had been my teen at your sleepover I would have thought your reaction to be extreme and expected an apology to myself and my teen.

So you haven’t RTFT, the idiotic use of myself when it should be the word ME, AND you’re a lax and lazy parent

wonder why you think anyone would be at all interested in your wisdom?

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:27

usernamedifferent · 25/08/2024 09:58

You did not overreact at all and I’m depressed and surprised at the amount of parents on here saying you did.

I would’ve 100% shouted in the moment and then had the calm chat this morning.

Sometimes, if we are generally calm parents, the odd shouting episode can be very effective at making children realise they’ve really messed up this time.

How many of you would be happy if your child was at a sleepover and you found out the next morning that they’d gone wandering the streets in the middle of the night?! And the other parent had just laughed it off?

This has been a massive insight into why so many kids at school now have such a disrespect for rules and discipline - they’re not getting any at home.

A huge insight. Absolutely shocking the amount of bad parenting and lack of care of your own child (and someone else’s child) there has been on this thread. It does at least highlight why there are so many poorly parented children around.

I suspect though that a lot of the cavalier replies are from people who aren’t actually parents and are looking at it from their own (once) teenage eyes. Perhaps if they do become parents they will view it differently (one hopes).

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:28

MzHz · 25/08/2024 10:24

Not least because we have a known gang of young teenage boys around here who are an absolute menace and the entire neighbourhood are on watch for them

from the op.

Ty

Megifer · 25/08/2024 10:28

"If it had been my teen at your sleepover I would have thought your reaction to be extreme and expected an apology to myself and my teen."

You'd be waiting a very long time for an apology off me 🤣

BertieBotts · 25/08/2024 10:29

MortimerBeQuiet · 25/08/2024 08:27

But if their child went to a sleepover, crept out of a window in the night and was hit by a drunk driver, they would be fine with that because youthful hi-jinks and no one was cross with them?

I really don't think sneaking out is a rite of passage. None of mine did it.

Well yes exactly - so if OP thinks child is likely to go to their parent and say "My friend's mum shouted at us and took my phone!!" then OP may wish to pre-empt and let the parent know that she did indeed shout because they had given her a fright by wandering around in the middle of the night unattended!

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:29

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:27

It’s not sneaking to just go outside so close to the house you hear the window open….

I said I would like an apology for this other parent OTT shouting at my teenager, as it isn’t their right to set boundaries for or punish my kid.

What is going to happen to my kid? If they are so close they can hear a window open, how far away can they be? Close enough for me.

An open window isn’t leaving a house unsecured 😂 it’s summer, I have half a dozen windows open all day and all night.

How old are your children?

AddictedtoStarmix · 25/08/2024 10:29

I would have reacted similarly OP as the potential for harm to have come to them both would have been my 1st thought and definitely escalated my reaction.
The fact that your son has a diagnosis of ADHD (as does mine) adds the concern due to the ability to risk assess a situation, as does being a teenager, it's important he comprehends how dangerous his actions were.
I think the current punishments/consequences you have put in place will be enough as with ADHD the consequences need to be immediate, delayed and long term consequences aren't as effective as he will be unable to correlate them in the same way so they are ineffective.
You've taken his phone which for most teenagers is their lifeline and will probably be enough. If the punishment is too harsh he has nothing to lose, which could escalate any negative behaviours.
Got to love the teenage years! They go quickly though, so as annoying and worrying as they can be, focus and enjoy this stage of his development too.

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:32

Megifer · 25/08/2024 10:28

"If it had been my teen at your sleepover I would have thought your reaction to be extreme and expected an apology to myself and my teen."

You'd be waiting a very long time for an apology off me 🤣

I don’t think a parent like this would be in my or my kids friendship circle to be honest. If that’s how a child is parented I can’t see them having anything in common with my own children at school.

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:33

MzHz · 25/08/2024 10:27

So you haven’t RTFT, the idiotic use of myself when it should be the word ME, AND you’re a lax and lazy parent

wonder why you think anyone would be at all interested in your wisdom?

Shouting is lax and lazy parenting.

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:34

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:29

How old are your children?

They are adults now. Didn’t need to shout at them to be successful.

GoldOnyx · 25/08/2024 10:34

BananaSpanner · 25/08/2024 02:46

No you didn’t. I’d be fuming too. They’re 13, no way they should be leaving the house without permission at night time. As you’ve said, it’s a risk to them and they’ve left your house secure. You’re going to have to tell the other parent aswell.

I completely agree with this. I was just coming on to say I don’t think you overreacted at all. I think you reacted proportionately.

It’s not okay for them to sneak out in the middle of the night to a place where they’re vulnerable and neither is it okay for them to leave you and your house in a vulnerable position by leaving the living room window open. I’d be angry and upset too.

Later on today, when things are still fresh but the heat of the moment have passed, I’d suggest having a chat with your DS to explain exactly why you were angry. Sorry if you’ve already done that - if you have, please ignore me! I just thinking it would be really helpful to have a proper chat with him to explain calmly and clearly why it’s dangerous to do what he did. I do appreciate that it’s challenging to do this, given he has ADHD and may have less risk awareness than other teens his age.

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:35

Odd how there are a few wierdly aggressive posters that feel a need to mock and denigrate any reply to the OP that isn’t all for shouting at DC.

Almost like the parents that are justifying such displays of anger have anger issues just with reading a different opinion on a forum and lack the self control to be tolerant of other parenting options.

NowImNotDoingIt · 25/08/2024 10:36

Shouting is lax and lazy parenting.

Used sparsely and appropriately, it isn't. I rarely shout ( well more stern ,firm voice) at home or at work (I work with kids) so when I do , all the kids know they really crossed a line and they stop and actively listen.

GerbilsForever24 · 25/08/2024 10:37

Wow, lots of responses. It's been interesting. I can't respond to all but a few things:

The window thing is a specific issue - I don't know what they're called but we have those windows where they're either open a little from the top, or fully from the side. And when they're open fully from the side, they usually swing open all the way so that the window is completely uncovered. The particular window they used is the one that basically is next to the front door so about as visible as is possible to be. And as DH said when I spoke with him this morning (he's furious) he has repeatedly reminded DS that this window is a risk for all of us and he needs to be careful about keeping it properly closed (or open on the minor side). I did laugh at the people asking about not being allowed to open windows - we have many many windows in our house, all of which are regularly opened on the "top" way, but this specific window is never open at all at night, and definitely not open ALL the way.

@ToBeDetermined yes - I did specifically talk about a known gang of young teenagers causing problems in the neighbourhood. That was actually what got through to DS and why, I think, he was crying (in my bedroom, away from his friend) - he suddenly realised that these boys (who he has had run ins with in the past - one actually attacked him once) would 100% have come through our window and/or attacked him and his friend if they'd caught them or seen them. Ditto, a few weeks ago we had police in the neighbourbood as a group of boys (I assume the known gang, but I don't know) was going around destroying street signs in the middle of the night.

@BertieBotts useful, balanced advice in the context of ADHD as always. Thank you. There were a few others too, and I'm grateful to be reminded of the additional effort required with children with ADHD.

@MrRydersParlourGame The fact that DS did feel he could come to me upset and apologise means I think your comments are happening but I really like your mum's approach and I think I am going to be more explicit on that in the future.

I love all the refernces to "in a very scary way". I think actually, that was more in line with the teacher who can silence a crowd with a look - They knew I was being serious but I was absolutely furious but in control and I was "shouting" in that my voice was definitely raised. But as I said, I wasn't screaming and yelling.

@medik7 hahaha - right, I should easily have calmed down in just 10 minutes. I was on MN because my adrenaline was off the charts, I had sent them to bed and certainly didn't want to be down there berating them further. MN was a useful outlet to get opinions, express my frustration and NOT to give them a further bollocking while I calmed down.

Finally, I just want to say that actually, I agree that shouty parents are not great and that actually, a lot of the children with no boundaries etc come from the shouty households - I think it starts to roll off their backs and they just don't even notice it. One of the boys from the "gang" I referenced lives fairly close to us and I am afraid I have seen his mother and grandmother shouting at him on multiple occassions when he was younger. Clearly, as has been pointed out, that has not helped him at all. But there is a huge difference between being absolutely livid on one specific occasion when the boys behaved really really badly, and routinely shouting and screaming at them at all times and in all places.

THe friend is awake and DS is still asleep. I'm about to wake him up. I'll be reminding them both why this wasn't okay but there won't be any shouting at all. And the consequences are, not surprisingly I think, no sleepovers for a while. I won't be doing any further punishments. DS will be getting another bollocking from DH though who is even more annoyed about the window than me as he has had conversations with DS about that window and it's unique risks before.

OP posts:
bergamotorange · 25/08/2024 10:39

FOJN · 25/08/2024 08:38

I agree, this thread feels likes it's full of "boys will be boys" excuses. Yes teenagers do stupid risky things but if you take the same tone over this as you would with them treading mud over your clean floors then how are they to learn some things are far more serious than others. They went out and left a house unsecured in the middle of the night. There was a risk to them and to you. That is unacceptable and thoughtless.

I wouldn't have given them their phones back and I wouldn't apologise for shouting. I'm not a shouty person but I can understand your panic at finding them both missing in the middle of the night. Would you rather tell another child's parents you shouted at their child or that their child went missing/came to harm in your care?

I had two teenage stepsons who regularly used to leave doors unlocked and windows wide open when they left the house and no one else was at home. I tried very calm conversations with them about the risks and about how insurance would not cover any theft if the house had been left unsecured but it made no difference. I returned home one day to find the house totally unsecured again but this time I called the culprit, who was out having fun with friends, and made him come home to shut all the windows he had opened and left open. He was very annoyed at the inconvenience but guess what, he never did it again and clearly the lesson was also effective for his brother because he didn't either.

I'm quoted in here and so will respond.

There's nothing very useful about shouting, then apologising for shouting, confiscating phones, than apologising for confiscation and handing them back.

Shouting = mum's lost it in most cases. Few lessons learned, pretty useless with older teens, doubly so for those with additional risk evaluation issues.

I'd be happy to read a reputable parenting website or book that suggests shouting at a teen is the way forward - have you got a recommendation? Explanations and consequences are always said to be more effective. Boundaries can be enforced without shouting.

The getting them back to sort windows is an excellent natural consequence, and can be achieved without shouting.

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:42

ToBeDetermined · 25/08/2024 10:34

They are adults now. Didn’t need to shout at them to be successful.

Neither did I but I would have shouted at them had they done this. How did you deal with the situation yourself when yours sneaked out at 2am at 13?

GerbilsForever24 · 25/08/2024 10:47

BunnyLake · 25/08/2024 10:32

I don’t think a parent like this would be in my or my kids friendship circle to be honest. If that’s how a child is parented I can’t see them having anything in common with my own children at school.

haha - yes, 100%.

DS and this same friend got themselves into trouble at school a few months ago. I was a bit bemused that the head of year, at the end of our conversation, thanked me for being supportive of the school and the sanctions they put in place. It was a no brainer - they did something completely wrong and were punished for it. But what I have learnt is that many parents do not take this route and the teachers spend a lot of time struggling to get the parents to see the seriousness of certain behaviours.

OP posts: