Aibu to not understand why France is considered more upmarket than Spain or Portugal?

[Janesygal]

Just that.. It's right across the channel, our nearest neighbours so why is it considered more upmarket than Spain, the Spanish islands or Portugal?

Well I’m currently watching Emily in Paris and it’s looking pretty upmarket to me 🤣

@Devonchills yes have been to France loads as a child & as an adult (Spain & Portugal also) but I have never seen a stag or a hens party in France! Pre covid I went went my sister, her bridesmaids, mum & mother in law to France for a pre wedding weekend, we stayed in a beautiful villa booked on air B&B, did wine tasting had beautiful (& cheap) dinners out it was gorgeous. Sis didn't want any bride paraphernalia so were just a group of 6 women & it was very relaxing

Which is near Port Leucate, I believe.
There's nothing wrong with these places, they're just not upmarket.

France is not so much "upmarket" as it hasn't bought into mass commercial AI and high rise tourism. Nor does it cater to Brit palates much with no Union Jacks on pubs and all day breakfasts to be found.

Otherwise its population is the same as the rest of us. Some rich, some poor and some in the middle. There is plenty of choice and a price point for everyone, but not mass commercialism, hence no protests against the effects of mass tourism (that I know of!) in France.

Just my 2c.

Spain also has beautiful wine, cava & fabulous food! And Sangria!

Probably not anywhere you’d go on holiday.
All countries , their towns and cities, have good and bad areas.

Spain and Portugal have always been poorer as countries.

Marseille, Montpellier, Toulouse even Nice…..rounh, lots of drug issues and crime ….wouldn’t visit any of them

It's historical, France was the cultural leader that everyone in Europe copied for centuries. Spain and Portugal were very poor until relatively recently. The Luis Bunuel film A Land Without Bread was banned because it revealed rural poverty. An older french relative of mine would tell awful jokes about the Spanish too.

If you want some shit places in France, check out the northern suburbs of Paris and the industrial towns near Belgium.

The campsites in Spain are considerably cleaner than France.

The French ski resorts are very concrete and pretty grim in places with drunk British tourists, but skiing is by default middle class and up! The coastal summer resorts aren't anywhere near so bad

I've been to all 3 countries. I certainly don't think france is more upmarket than Spain or Portugal. Quite the opposite

Package holidays. That’s the reason.

Have you been to any of them? I think as a pp said, there are areas of crime/deprivation in all cities worldwide. Just look at San Fransisco for example.

Most people visiting are not going to live there or visit the outer suburbs where most of the edginess is. All the cities you mention have a great inner core which is about all any tourist really sees. The usual precautions about personal safety apply anywhere in any city not just there.

Came on to say exactly this.

France and Italy don't have package holidays where you can pay a deposit and pay off the balance throughout the year.

It changes the type of holidaymaker.

I agree with OP but personally just see France as on -the-way to Spain or Portugal. For me it’s not somewhere I’d choose as a destination.

Jet2 do packages to Italy.

Because France is seen across Europe traditionally as a sophisticated country, saying “a weekend in Paris” brings so many images and emotions in many- food, art, stylish people, culture etc. Spain and Portugal don’t have that history of being a desirable place to visit.

Both Spain and Portugal created their tourist industries in the mid 20th century, they didn’t have the “grand tour” history, and their tourism industry was built on cheap trip to the sun, food and drink to attract the British and German tourists, not selling their own culture and cuisine as what you should travel for.

tourism in Europe has changed and both Spain and Portugal have gone much more upmarket in their tourist offering in the last 30/40 years, but that hang over still persists.

(not for nothing style and beauty threads often focus on dressing like you are French, never anyone wanting to create the air of being Portuguese, we have a lot of hang ups about being a bit inferior to the French in the UK)

I think it's much more than that. We've all heard about Spain's protest against mass tourism - and yet, Spain's is breaking a new record this year - 96 million.

As a Spaniard, foreign tourism used to be constrained to the Costas. but not anymore. You go to Segovia, Salamanca, Burgos or Vigo, cities that not long ago were out of the tourist track, and today are full of them. Why? I really think people like Spain and Spaniards.😁

My feeling is that France is more expensive and more effort due to language and other things. I don’t know but it’s just my feeling.

Yep.

Do they?

Spain and Portugal probably work out slightly cheaper for holidays. Minimum wage is lower in Spain than in France and even lower in Portugal.

Yanbu. It's definitely a thing.

On top of that... apparently hotels are seen as naff and villas are seen as the more middle class choice.

So villa in France...MC
Hotel in Spain...not so mc

It makes no sense

We visited Montpellier last week. Granted it was just the centre (which I guess is where most tourists go if they're just there for a day or so), but it didn't seem rough, we didn't see any crime and we managed not to get hooked on drugs.

London has rough areas, a lot of crime and drugs, maybe we should all steer clear of our capital as well!