Am I being mean about the "supersweet" friend?

[endlessnonsense]

I have a friend (well, she's equally a friend of me and DH, she and her XH used to be our neighbours). We now only see her a couple of times a year as we live far away now, and I wouldn't call her a really close friend. When we go on holiday, which is to a hot seaside place in Europe, we often get friends joining us as we have a place to stay and a boat, which is fun. This year she came.

I spent a lot of the time she was here in a state of suppressed anger at her, which caused me to resent her being here. This is because she turned out, on a several-days long time together, rather than the odd dinner we usually have, to be constantly pretending (or was she pretending?) to be very thoughtful and considerate, when I felt she was being just the opposite, in a passive aggressive way.

Everywhere we suggested going and everything we suggested doing, she deferred to us, "oh I'll do whatever you want, don't worry about me", never offering any suggestions of her own or seeming especially enthusiatic. OK, fair enough, we know the place and she doesn't. But it went much further. She was always faux putting herself down/being the martyr/putting on performative sweetness.

My son has special needs and she is always supersweet to him, but I told her multiple times during the holiday, no, he doesn't want an ice cream, he doesn't like it. It must have run into more than a dozen times she said, "oh darling, do you want an ice cream, oh please let me get him an ice cream, I'll pay"(as though I wasn't getting him the ice cream myself because of meanness). (Strangely, although she knows he does like chocolate, she never once offered to buy him a chocolate)

We planned a trip to a particular place she hadn't been, specifically to show it to her. Other friends were coming too, they are local and had been to the place many times, but we're coming along to be sociable with us and her. When she asked me how many people were coming and I mentioned it would be quite a few (in positive way, saying it would be a fun social event) she said, all sweetly, "well if you don't have room for me I'll just stay behind at the apartment, I don't mind at all". That really annoyed me, she knew the trip was arranged specifically for her!

Another (even more annoying) example, we were at a beach bar/restaurant with a bunch of people. Too many to get one table so we were split between 2 tables. Our food came marginally before the other table's (not more than 2 or 3 minutes). In that time she expressed concern that the toddler at the other table had not yet got her food, and actually got up to take her own plate of food to the toddler (it was a salad of some sort and the toddler was getting chips, so not even remotely the same thing). Me and DH had to physically get her to stop it and sit down before the toddler's mum saw.

She has always been very much a "oh don't worry about me, I'll just have a tap water" type of person, but on this holiday she really got my goat. She's left now and I am not sure if she noticed I was a bit snippy with her by the end. AIBU and a mean friend?

You don’t seem mean to me at all, to be honest.

Your friend is absolutely one of those performative martyrdom people. None of the super-sweet behaviour you describe is really about being kind to others for their sake and is all about her own self-validation.

It's because the friend is doing it for affect/attention, and it's emotionally exhausting for the OP to have to provide that All. The. Time.

@FlyingButtresses

it’s a really useful thread for the vast numbers of people-pleasers on Mn, who post about how lonely they are and how it’s unfair because they put themselves out all the time for others, going the extra mile, offering help, being all smiley and flexible and fitting in with other people’s preferences. This is how it feels being on the receiving end of this kind of inauthentic behaviour, which, yes, often comes from poor self-esteem and a desire to ‘be no bother’, but is done in an (often unconscious) effort to manipulate other people into liking you

👏 👏

Spot on. It’s really important for women in particular (and it is mainly women) to start to unpick a lot of this “learned niceness”. Because so many of them have this dreadful ethos drummed into them by their mothers and other family. A lot of people are brought up to dull and inoffensive as possible and don’t realise it makes them seem desperate.

If you grow up thinking that being a professional service human is enough to guarantee friendships and love when in fact the opposite is true, you are bound to be bitter.

Performative niceness, as this poster says, is horrible to be on the receiving end of because it’s really obviously not authentic.

She sounds way too anxious, people pleasing. Like a martyr.

People like that can be draining to be around because you have to constantly refuse the 'sickly sweetness' and sacrifices.

I know someone like that in real life, it's annoying.

She sounds incredibly annoying. I’m not sure she’s trying to be subtly unkind re: your son or anything, she just sounds totally pathetic.

I was invited on holiday with friends to cheer me up at a difficult time in my life, but the unspoken expectation was that I would not bring any of my sadness or overwhelm with me, so I just ended up withdrawing as that was the best I could do, and it caused weirdness between us. around the same time I saw other friends and we had a laugh and there was space for me to take time out or be a bit sad when I needed to. That’s what I call friendship personally.

So maybe I’m projecting but I feel sorry for her, she sounds overwhelmed and like she is trying to contain it/ cover it up so as not to be a downer. Being overwhelmed would account for repeatedly offering the ice cream, it’s kind of like running a default program because your brain is a bit jammed up

This sums is up far better than I can. It's all about making herself look good/sweet/thoughtful/considerate and isn't actually about the other people at all. She probably goes away thinking people will be saying "oh isn't she just the most lovely person". No. No. No.

Do I have a secret sister?!

its almost like people like this are so concerned with being perceived as nice and kind that they actually end up forgetting to actually be nice and kind!

I’m fairly laid back but after years of going on holidays with friends I have realised that it is a nightmare, doomed to spoil the friendship. I love my friends but think that holidays bring out the worst in some people and then you have no breathing space. Any small incompatibilities get magnified. Are YBU? Possibly a little but you still deserve a happy holiday without the niggles when you are going out of your way to be decent.

I used to work with someone like this, performative self-sacrifice but she was honestly one of the most unkind people I've ever met, she just wouldn't do it to your face. Not sure if your friend is the same but I wouldn't countenance a friendship going forward, just let it drop.

I genuinely think she was doing the ‘I don’t want to be too much trouble thing’. She’s there on her own without a partner and just thought ‘I’ll fit in with everyone else’. Buying a kid an ice cream is just a sweet thing to offer. We were on holiday this year and another Mum kept offering to buy my children ice cream because my kids had played a lot with her daughter who was on her own, first of all we kept saying ‘oh you don’t have to do that!’ But SHE wanted to to show her appreciation. It was a nice thing. And not many people would think to buy a kid chocolate in hot country. It’s literally the one time our family doesn’t eat chocolate.

Sometimes people clash, I know someone who I would describe as a wet blanket and she talks ever so quietly and is very self-deprecating way and she’s not my cup of tea at all, but this lady doesn’t seem to have done much wrong IMO.

You invited her, but it didn’t work out, so just leave it next year. You live and learn.

Gosh this post has really triggered something in me because I hate it so much when people do this. It is so ultra fake. And yet some people are completely unable to see through it.

I hate people who get angry at you over shit that DOES NOT MATTER but they insist on doing anyway.

I have friends who INSIST you have a cup of tea or coffee (I don't really drink either) and then get mad when they ask for details of how you want it and you say 'I don't mind' or 'whatever is easiest for you'.

I don't want it any specific way because I don't 'want' it at all but after 2 decade of friendship I know they are going to give me one regardless despite knowing I don't like it and never drink it. I'm not the one being passive aggressive and awkward, its a stupid little ritual we have to go through because they where raised that thats how you host.

Sometime when people say 'I don't mind' they are literally just politely saying 'I don't actually give a fuck either way, stop asking' at the control/constant questions/faffing being forced on them by others. If they do it all the time or on the same question again and again yet you still ask its more a cue to look at your own behavior.

For the record a huge outing somewhere with a bunch of people I don't know but who all know each other sounds like my idea of hell. Who on earth would enjoy that, thats not 'for her' that your friends and you totally 3rd wheeled (the the extreme) your guest.

Really interesting because I hate this type of behaviour as well - its obsequious, I find people do it at work to curry favour and my Ex-H used to thrive on it - trying to show what an 'umble man he was. I agree it's performative. But many on this thread don't and I am interested to see why people think its ok or due to anxiety etc.

What a scumbag. Nothing worse than ‘helpful’ people.

Ouch - this kind of response from you here sounds quite painful to receive! It sounds like she was treading on eggshells generally…. And potentially nothing to do with you initially, eg maybe playing out from the end of her relationship mixed in with general lack of confidence.
but she was probably hyper alert to your feelings of irritation and getting more and more submissive as another pp has says.

I’ve fallen into the trap of being a bit like her when I’d had a bit of a breakdown (genuinely). However I’ve also had situations in that time where I did assert myself and got completely cut down - I realised that not all my relationships were built on equal respect for needs etc. For a while this fed into it having to feel very safe to come out and assert my needs, however I’ve got no problem with identifying my preferences and thoughts, I just became very private.
in her situation, I’d feel trapped and would be wishing for the end of the holiday!
it’s not for you to decipher but possibly she won’t want to come next year, whatever she said in the moment. I don’t imagine she’ll be storming down your door by the way you’ve described her, so perhaps you could just leave it open for a bit and see how your relationship goes.
I would also say that if you stick to your boundaries but also try and dig for a bit of compassion for her, things might turn out better, regardless of whether you invite her on holiday again.

@Its2024happynewyear said it much more succincntly!

I have a mum like this too. It was the way she was brought up I guess. But then, she tried to bring me up the same way and got the opposite as a result (much to her chagrin).

I also work with someone very like OP's friend. Drives me bonkers with the 'oh don't worry about me' but in the next breath 'life is so shit for me atm; XYZ has happened' (typical event like a bulb going in the car) 'why does it always happen to me...' gaaahhhhh!!!!!

My neighbour is going through a bad patch of anxiety ATM, I've had anxiety; it doesn't turn you into someone who is passive aggressive. It just doesn't.
Passive aggressive behaviour isn't caused by anxiety. If it was, you could cure it by fixing the anxiety.

She was just trying to show her gratitude and be thoughtful but somewhat missing the .ark.
I rather thi k you are trying very hard to make her seem unreasonable.

Mine too. It drives me a bit bananas but I try to understand that it’s down to a massive lack of self esteem and not wanting to be seen to ‘take up too much space’. Don’t really know how to deal with it though, I’d love to see her being more assertive and enjoying life more.

My mother in law is this type of person! Very frustrating! OP it’s a difficult person to be around and sometimes feel you are ‘babysitting’ because you have to make these decisions on behalf of someone else or with them in mind constantly because apparently they don’t mind. Luckily as she is a friend maybe just fade the friendship out nicely and you have done no wrong she just isn’t your type of person. You never do know someone fully until you have been on holiday with them!

You clearly really dislike her and couldn’t bring yourself to actually tolerate her. I feel sorry for her, she’s obvs been through a rough time, and understood you resented her being there, so kept trying to please/appease/help/not be a hinderence and getting it drastically wrong.

to be honest I suspect whatever she did you’d have been the same, as you simply dislike her.

you do seem a little focused on her being single now, and hoping she finds a bloke. I do hope this isn’t about not wanting a single woman in your group. Or that you sense she’s struggling so your instinct is to bully.

id examine your own behaviour and why. Honestly. Just in your own head. The reason you started the thread is you know you didn’t behave well.

I think two things are true here. You are being mean and she is being annoying.

So maybe I’m projecting but I feel sorry for her, she sounds overwhelmed and like she is trying to contain it/ cover it up so as not to be a downer. Being overwhelmed would account for repeatedly offering the ice cream, it’s kind of like running a default program because your brain is a bit jammed up

I get this and if you are sad or low it can be an effort to be “sparkly”. I can relate to being distanced or low key because you are feeling like this. But this is different.

This is trying to use yourself as an agreeable one-size-fits-all service human without and personality because you think (consciously or otherwise) it will make people like you more.

Its absolutely endemic in women because of a certain kind of upbringing (usually by a mother who is herself like this.) It’s dishonest and profoundly unhelpful because the women who do it end up bitter and frustrated when other don’t respond well to it.