Am I being mean about the "supersweet" friend?

[endlessnonsense]

I have a friend (well, she's equally a friend of me and DH, she and her XH used to be our neighbours). We now only see her a couple of times a year as we live far away now, and I wouldn't call her a really close friend. When we go on holiday, which is to a hot seaside place in Europe, we often get friends joining us as we have a place to stay and a boat, which is fun. This year she came.

I spent a lot of the time she was here in a state of suppressed anger at her, which caused me to resent her being here. This is because she turned out, on a several-days long time together, rather than the odd dinner we usually have, to be constantly pretending (or was she pretending?) to be very thoughtful and considerate, when I felt she was being just the opposite, in a passive aggressive way.

Everywhere we suggested going and everything we suggested doing, she deferred to us, "oh I'll do whatever you want, don't worry about me", never offering any suggestions of her own or seeming especially enthusiatic. OK, fair enough, we know the place and she doesn't. But it went much further. She was always faux putting herself down/being the martyr/putting on performative sweetness.

My son has special needs and she is always supersweet to him, but I told her multiple times during the holiday, no, he doesn't want an ice cream, he doesn't like it. It must have run into more than a dozen times she said, "oh darling, do you want an ice cream, oh please let me get him an ice cream, I'll pay"(as though I wasn't getting him the ice cream myself because of meanness). (Strangely, although she knows he does like chocolate, she never once offered to buy him a chocolate)

We planned a trip to a particular place she hadn't been, specifically to show it to her. Other friends were coming too, they are local and had been to the place many times, but we're coming along to be sociable with us and her. When she asked me how many people were coming and I mentioned it would be quite a few (in positive way, saying it would be a fun social event) she said, all sweetly, "well if you don't have room for me I'll just stay behind at the apartment, I don't mind at all". That really annoyed me, she knew the trip was arranged specifically for her!

Another (even more annoying) example, we were at a beach bar/restaurant with a bunch of people. Too many to get one table so we were split between 2 tables. Our food came marginally before the other table's (not more than 2 or 3 minutes). In that time she expressed concern that the toddler at the other table had not yet got her food, and actually got up to take her own plate of food to the toddler (it was a salad of some sort and the toddler was getting chips, so not even remotely the same thing). Me and DH had to physically get her to stop it and sit down before the toddler's mum saw.

She has always been very much a "oh don't worry about me, I'll just have a tap water" type of person, but on this holiday she really got my goat. She's left now and I am not sure if she noticed I was a bit snippy with her by the end. AIBU and a mean friend?

So glad someone said this! I am separated for years and it has only enhanced my social life and social confidence. It was my dull marriage that dimmed me. I would hate anyone to feel sorry for me, I certainly don't feel sorry for myself.

She was probably concussed and confused, at A&E and the next morning.

When you live alone you get used to trying to deal with stuff by yourself, it's not being a martyr.

Basically a lot of people have no empathy whatsoever and will always assume the worst about someone’s motives. It’s a harsh world.

No there's martyrdom at play too, I get what you mean but it's all the other things that go along with 1 particular event.

@Tagyoureit I don't see her often because we now live in another country. We were previously neighbours for years and her XH is probably my DH's best friend. (I have just never been as close to her. We have both always worked long hours and were often not home, and our husbands were both SAH fathers for years, so they bonded over that and spent a lot of time together). Her XH has often come on holiday with us, now of course they come at different times, just like some other couples we know who have now split but continue to see us separately.

I am absolutely not "threatened" by her or "scared of her situation" (what is there to be scared of or threatened by?). I am indeed a quite anxious introvert who goes on holiday to the same place and with roughly the same people to prevent having to socialise too much with people I don't know or encountering anything unexpected, including situations which make things difficult for my disabled son. I am perfectly happy with that, I have no need to change and my personality is a perfect fit for my job, which involves spendng a lot of time alone analysing stuff. I love my holidays as they are. For a few weeks every year I get to socialise with people I know and don't see often, in a beautiful and familiar setting, then back I go into my shell. DH, who is by contrast very sociable and also unrelentingly positive about everyone, is also perfectly happy with the holidays.

The thread was about whether I was being unreasonably mean to someone (well, more about her rather than to her). Despite the ratio of the poll, on reflection I actually think I am, by failing to take her personality and situation in the round, although I don't think I can totally control my inward reaction to some of these incidents (and many others that I haven't described).

Anyway, she has just texted me to discuss dates for next year. She will be bringing her son and won't be staying with us, so I think it will be easier all round. I guess if she did notice my irritation, she has got over it. I now have a year to get a grip on my reactions! I will be working on creating a positive response to the parts of her I do like,

I agree with the strangeness of people thinking I would be pitying her because she is divorced. So patronising! More of my female friends are single or divorced than not, including some who have been here in the past few weeks. I dont pity, envy or feel scared of any of the divorced ones. I myself have been divorced. We are independent women who have moved on from a man who wasn't enhancing their life any more, what's to pity? (It's as weird as wondering whether she is "pretty").

Extremely cod! lol 😂

@endlessnonsense to be fair, the thought of going away on holiday with anyone other than my dh and kids runs a chill through me anyway so it would not be for me.

Sounds like her staying elsewhere next time will lessen the iritation but the whole 'ill just have some bread' or 'omg, I must feed someone else's child' would piss me right off.

Good luck for next time.

Yes. And, this sounds an awful thing to say, but I believe older widows can find that they have a new lease of life.

It's not awful at all, it's the truth in a lot of cases. I refer to my mother's friends who are widows as 'the merry widows' because they have a great time of it mostly and in many cases, can rely more on each other for support than they could on their husbands if they were still alive.

I had a terrible childhood and bad parents who made me feel bad about everything I asked/said/did. I had to behave in a certain way otherwise I would be in trouble (aka, quiet, polite etc). I find myself still in that mindset at times, particularly when I meet new people and I am intimidated for whatever reason. I try not to be, of course, and have to remind myself that I am an adult who can do as they please.

I’ve likely irritated people in my life being like this sometimes but I would hope they are kind and understanding of this part of me, like I am of the things they do that might irritate me a bit - like being too forceful or loud or whatever it may be. I still love the people in my life and wouldn’t speak badly of them, because none of that stuff is a big deal. Everyone is different and no one is perfect.

That is the best answer.

Crikey can anyone hear S Club 7???

Yes, all people pleasing is calculated - it's done for a reason, you get something out of it. Now as a child it may have meant you didn't get hit or worse but it's when it carries on into adulthood where there is no threat that there's an issue.

@ThatPeachSnake

I had a terrible childhood and bad parents who made me feel bad about everything I asked/said/did. I had to behave in a certain way otherwise I would be in trouble (aka, quiet, polite etc). I find myself still in that mindset at times, particularly when I meet new people and I am intimidated for whatever reason. I try not to be, of course, and have to remind myself that I am an adult who can do as they please.

That makes a lot of sense and clearly a lot of people have this sort of “curl up and protect myself” response. I am a fairly confident and socially comfortable person and I do this sometimes. It’s totally normal and understandable. Everyone feels shy or intimidated in certain situations.

But at risk of sounding like a dog with a bone I think that’s different from classic people pleasing, which is when it’s being done with a view to projecting a certain image.

In this case this is a woman whom the OP has known a long time and is reasonably comfortable with.

The episode with rushing to give salad to the toddler in particular is very much not about “curl up and protect myself”. It’s “look at me!”. (But in a guardedly “nice” way). A genuinely shy or withdrawn person would not have done that.

Can’t stand super sweet people, I haven’t got enough patience.

That sounds like indecision to me. She cannot decide so she orders both. I have a friend who gets really anxious if asked to choose something on the spot, so she also says "I don't mind" or (even worse) starts listing reasons to choose both things. I think it's insecurity. She wanted to not be a burden or a bother and her actions actually backfired. Some people have been told that being polite means being out of the way. I get why she grinded you but if it's insecurity, she's not going to tell you that she rather stays on the beach or make decisions, fearing she might be swaying your preferences or those of the group. I think she was trying to please and didn't read the room properly. On the ice-cream, it's odd yes. But since it wasn't an allergy, she might have not put the extra level of attention to remember it or kept thinking that maybe a different ice cream or flavour or texture would be ok.

I think I might act like that friend a lot (and the more I read on forums the more I realise I am very annoying!) but if it offers a perspective, I've been diagnosed with social anxiety disorder for over 20 years. I can hear myself and annoy myself too, but also genuinely feel like I take up too much space and need to get out of people's way (whether that is not going on a trip, or stepping aside to let everyone go first in a queue situation etc).
I wasn't there, so idk, and I don't think I sound cheery when I do it... But anyway, I wouldn't feel bad about it, just don't invite her again, she might not feel comfortable going anyway.

Again, as someone with clinical social anxiety, this genuinely surprised me... Of course there is a threat in adulthood! Or at least a perceived one to some people.

She sounds a lot like my Mum, who most people think is “lovely” because you don’t really see her passive-aggressive side until you spend a lot of time with her. Have a look at this article about covert narcissists - I reckon a lot of it will sound familiar! https://geediting.com/sneaky-behaviors-of-a-high-functioning-covert-narcissist/#:~:text=Rather%20than%20insult%20or%20put,gaslighting%20all%20to%20their%20advantage.
Unlike out-and-out nasty narcissists, who want other people to see them as powerful, many covert ones are obsessed with other people thinking they are a good person - but instead of going to the trouble of actually BEING one, they use passive-aggressive behaviour and gaslighting to make people think they are. Take it from me, it’s exhausting to deal with and not worth your energy. I would have walked away years ago if she wasn’t my mum.

@IveShaggedSomeMingers what has it got to do with her being single or not?

Most of my female friends, including all of the 4 of those who have joined us on this holiday at various points, are single/going through a divorce, as I have already said. The others don't annoy me at all. So I dont see the relevance of that factor. And this lady was always a "don't mind about me" person even years ago, long before she split from her XH. It just reached a bit of a pitch at this holiday, I think, because she was actually staying with us and so I spent more time with her (and also her son didn't come this year, which may conceivably meant she was more anxious as was on her own). Hopefully next year will be better.

YADNBU

I think she was trying to play up and attention seek to irritate you, because she's jealous of you and resents you.

You have what she hasn't got.

You have a great way about you (no nonsense, just live and enjoy). You have a great DH, DS and lifestyle, and she doesn't anymore (apart from her DS).

With people like this, they are never true genuine friends.

The condescending remarks about how well you and your DH cope with your DS, say it all to me.

Talk about wanting to rub it in, I would honestly feel like telling her to foxtrot Oscar.

I will be working on creating a positive response to the parts of her I do like
Parts of her you do like? So gracious OP!
Perhaps this woman would rather know you don't like her, so she can spend her holidays and time, with those who actually want to be in her company?
I'm sure as you love sincerity so much, you'll have no trouble conveying how you really feel towards her?

This is me on holiday with my sister in law . She won’t make any suggestions and if I do she says ‘that’s fine’ . It drives me batty

Nothing suggests this woman is a narcissist! Lol

We know she's indecisive and her ex-husband is domineering. She is most likely anxious.