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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is the Union Jack racist?

273 replies

cupcaske123 · 13/08/2024 16:53

Eamonn Holmes had a bit of an argument with a guest on GB News as to whether the Union Jack is racist.

I understand that the George Cross is associated with the Far Right but had never associated the Union Jack with racism.

Apparently people at a village hall in Norfolk didn't want to be accused of racism for flying the British flag.

I think it's madness, what do you think?

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/eamonn-holmes-gb-news-union-jack-b2595611.html

Eamonn Holmes shuts down GB News guest in fiery Union Jack row

Holmes told anti-racism activist to ‘give me a break’

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/eamonn-holmes-gb-news-union-jack-b2595611.html

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Hateam · 13/08/2024 16:54

No it's not.

The flag of St George isn't either.

Deipara · 13/08/2024 16:55

No. It is ridiculous to even suggest it.

Werweisswohin · 13/08/2024 16:55

A country flag itself isn't racist.
Racists or xenophobes could try to adopt/adapt it in some way but they don't own it.

spuddy4 · 13/08/2024 16:55

Absolutely ridiculous. I also don't understand why people who fly the English flag are always deemed as racist but here in Wales we are seen as patriotic if we fly ours.

Countries all over the world proudly display their national flags but only here in the UK would it be seen as a bad thing.

Hoardasurass · 13/08/2024 16:56

No it's not. Though I'm sure 1 of the professionally offended will be along to lecture everyone on why we're wrong

Boredlass · 13/08/2024 16:56

No. Only in England is flying a flag deemed to be racist. It’s bizarre.

EasySkankin · 13/08/2024 16:57

If the Union Flag or the George Cross are racist, then all nation and provinces’ flags are racist. It’s racist to single out the flags of particular nations or provinces as racist.

TeenagersAngst · 13/08/2024 16:57

spuddy4 · 13/08/2024 16:55

Absolutely ridiculous. I also don't understand why people who fly the English flag are always deemed as racist but here in Wales we are seen as patriotic if we fly ours.

Countries all over the world proudly display their national flags but only here in the UK would it be seen as a bad thing.

I said this to DH yesterday - the Ukrainian flag or the Palestinian flag, for example. Both proudly on display across the UK.

He said it's because we're nasty oppressors who colonialised others with our flag. He doesn't actually think this himself, just that that's the view of many who see it as racist and divisive.

Lorelaigilmore88 · 13/08/2024 16:58

No. Neither of them are.

Izzymoon · 13/08/2024 16:58

Depends on where you live.
In NI the Union Jack is almost always accompanied by UVF and orange order flags so it’s hard not to view it all in the same way.

Letsgotitans · 13/08/2024 16:59

In a word... No. No one is racist for simply showing their country's flag or even, god forbid, saying they are proud to be from x country!

Notmushroomforthis · 13/08/2024 16:59

No it's not! How is a national flag racist?

corlan · 13/08/2024 16:59

It used to be associated with racist groups like the National Front but that association has lessened now. Back in theday, if I saw the flag on someone's house, I definitely wondered if it was some jingoistic show by the homeowners.
I think the flag has been taken back for everyone now which is as it should be.

BeeCucumber · 13/08/2024 16:59

Nope.

Huggingatreedoeswork · 13/08/2024 17:00

No! No it's not. There you go, question answered

cupcaske123 · 13/08/2024 17:01

Izzymoon · 13/08/2024 16:58

Depends on where you live.
In NI the Union Jack is almost always accompanied by UVF and orange order flags so it’s hard not to view it all in the same way.

That was picked up in the debate as Holmes is from NI. However these are villagers in Norfolk worried about flying it outside a village hall.

OP posts:
RocketPanda · 13/08/2024 17:01

A flag in itself isn't racist but many places associate the Union Flag with oppression of native people by a coloniser.

EasySkankin · 13/08/2024 17:02

Nationalism and national pride is always just on the edge of xenophobia/racism though, for any region. That’s why international sports are so important. They give people a chance to feel those feelings and respectfully ‘have out’ differences.

Notmushroomforthis · 13/08/2024 17:02

I think the world has gone very anti-UK at the moment. It's also conveniently forgetting every nation has a colonialist past which I suppose the Dutch, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Chinese, Russian nations are quite happy to deflect onto us and ignore their own histories.

AngelusBell · 13/08/2024 17:03

spuddy4 · 13/08/2024 16:55

Absolutely ridiculous. I also don't understand why people who fly the English flag are always deemed as racist but here in Wales we are seen as patriotic if we fly ours.

Countries all over the world proudly display their national flags but only here in the UK would it be seen as a bad thing.

My Muslim neighbours bedecked their cars with England flags during the World Cup.

EasySkankin · 13/08/2024 17:03

Notmushroomforthis · 13/08/2024 17:02

I think the world has gone very anti-UK at the moment. It's also conveniently forgetting every nation has a colonialist past which I suppose the Dutch, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Chinese, Russian nations are quite happy to deflect onto us and ignore their own histories.

Exactly. I think ‘Cool Britannia’ backfired on us.

BurnTheBook · 13/08/2024 17:04

Another disingenuous thread. But fwiw OP, no the union Jack is not racist.

Flammekuche · 13/08/2024 17:05

Unfortunately, it’s been, like the St George flag, co-opted by far right movements, and, like it or not, those usages are now part of the flag’s ‘meaning’.

Symbols depend on context. If I see a Union Jack painted on kerbs in a NI town, it’s telling me a very different thing to what the same flag on a hat at the Last Night of the Proms would.

ClaudineMallory · 13/08/2024 17:06

You'd think the Belgians would be embarrassed to fly their flag, in that case @TeenagersAngst what with their actions in the Congo.

AgnesX · 13/08/2024 17:06

I have no issues with the Union flag, only the right wing shits who have hijacked both it and the flag of St George.