Does 'gentle parenting' work ?

[flowermo]

Let me start by saying that I am not an expert at parenting styles.

I know bits and bobs from reading articles, books, talking to other mums/ grandmas and a lot of reading on Mumsnet.

I understand there are a lot of misconceptions about gentle parenting. However let me summarise my understanding- it's about firm boundaries, but doesn't promote shouting and hitting etc and generally using fear to get your kids to behave. It encourages understanding a child's development phases and what can and cannot be expected of them at any particular stage. Helping them understand and validate feelings, negative and positive ones etc.

Another style of parenting, perhaps the authoritarian style or ' traditional ' style that was used a lot in our parents generation, is a lot more shouty. Perhaps even hitting. Children are scolded for having tantrums and punished. Parents rule with fear of shouting / hitting / scolding. Kids are often scared of their parents. I remember growing up in this kind of household, as did all of my friends really.

I would say I use something in between the two styles with my children. But more on the gentler side. I don't hit but sometimes I do shout for example. I try to understand the stage of development they're at and what I can reasonably expect from their behaviour. I try to use consequences like taking toys away or denying them treats they wanted. I don't think my kids are afraid of me. I don't think I'm a particularly good parent. Or that I'm doing things right. They misbehave and I'm often stressed out. They're still small, 2 and 4 and I'm just trying to find my way.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is. I've been speaking to some other mums of slightly older kids who are also teachers. They really think that the gentle parenting approach is hurting kids and kids are out of control more than they were in the past. More authoritarian methods work better apparently and kids should be scared of their parents and should be worried about getting in trouble ( not violence ) at home, if they mess around at school. Teachers are leaving the profession because kids are so badly behaved and parents have no control over their kids.

What do you think about this? Is gentle parenting working ? Is it true that kids are so badly behaved now ? ( doesn't every generation say that about the new generation? ).

One thing I've noticed is that if I discipline my kids in public, by slightly raising my voice, people do stare. I never see any parents doing that nowadays. It was normal to get a telling off if you messed around in public when I was a child.

I'm not trying to be divisive or judge either side of the debate. I don't know what I'm doing or whether it's right. I guess I spend most of my time thinking I should be firmer, then feeling abusive when I do shout at them. I'm also lost. I really don't want to piss anyone off. So please be kind.

I would question whether the natural consequence is always the kindest.

So we went to a farm yesterday and my son put on the tap which was a bit too powerful and squirted. He'd washed his hands so I told him not to do it again. Saw him messing still while I sorted my daughter. Warned him again.

But the thing was like a big red flashing button to him and he put it on (despite having no need of water) and it sprayed everywhere.

I told him off. He looked sheepish, was a bit embarrassed and apologised. I set out that when I've told him twice and he ignores me he will get shouted at

End of. We moved on, had nice day and he was good as gold and very careful with taps the rest of the day

Was dragging the whole family home a kinder way to deal with it? We'd travelled an hour and he understands that there was a cost to get in. If I'd taken him home he'd have been really upset.

Minor misdemeanors get a quick telling off and we move on. I am not sure whether having an interview depth think about his behaviour would help. But also that if you spray another person with water they are likely to get cross (even more so if they aren't your mother!)

I guess my parenting style is somewhere between the two. I'm a long-time primary school teacher, so I am used to ruling the roost and being obeyed. I think that's carried over into my parenting. I'm a stickler for manners and things like not interrupting adults when they're talking. Some might see that as old-school. I try and get them to understand that I'm not asking them to do certain things just for shits and giggles, there is a purpose.
I'm a big believer in natural consequences and letting my children discover them for themselves.

The ‘I will take you home if you don’t do XYZ’ only really works if you have one child I think.

The natural consequence would be that he got wet

I think a lot of people mistake gentle parenting for no parenting. Proper gentle parenting is hard work, you are constantly needing to diffuse and distract and impose form boundaries with consequences that are not violence.
My Dsis does this very well but she is a trained teacher of young children and knows how to do it effectively.
Leaving your kids to run wild around supermarkets destroying everything in their wake is not gentle parenting.

But then if it’s cold outside, he’d be miserable for the rest of the day which is probably OTT for being a bit mischievous. The PP told him off and her response was normal and natural. He felt sheepish for a few minutes but then it was over and done with and they could get on and enjoy their day.
I’d far rather be a child in that sort of family.

And be wet and cold all day? Natural consequences are frequently rather unkind.

I don't like the term 'gentle parenting'. It conjures up pictures of wishy washy people uttering 'please don't do that' to their children instead of actually managing the situation.

I prefer authoritative parenting, natural consequences and age appropriate parenting.

I am not a fan of authoritarian parenting that is all about forcing children to comply and punishing for behaviours that are developmentally appropriate for their age.

I think most of us try a range of different methods to see what works with our children - and for mine, different methods worked for different children. Each of my children has presented different challenges, and has required different ways of managing them - I have made many many mistakes along the way but I'm always looking to improve my parenting skills.

I think parenting is a set of skills that need to be developed over time. I don't think it's a one size fits all or that you can develop them all before you meet your children.

We don't shout unless they are likely to injure, endanger or massively fuck up something or themselves and their attention or the need to stop is immediate.

This is key. If I'm shouting, then it's an emergency (eg. 'DUCK!').

I do also have the 'do not mess with me right now voice' which signals that negotiations are over.

BUT to me, gentle parenting is recognising that these are little humans, who will screw up (just as I do sometimes) - eg. If someone breaks a glass, then there might be a yell 'STAND STILL!' so they don't cut their feet, and if they broke it because they were being silly, then I'll feed that back with some of the mum voice that next time don't do that, but then we'll just tidy it up and get on with our day. I break glasses and spill things too. Accidents happen.

It's all about being reasonable in my mind.

I guess I'm not a gentle parent, but an authoritative parent - but still, I see that as gentle - there's plenty of hugs, no yelling, never needed physical punishment or consequences (beyond natural ones that I probably warned them about), 'no' is rarely needed because reasons are already explained, so I think it's gentle too.

What is my problem? Kids hitting my child. It has happened. The anecdote I've described has happened.

I'm so sorry that happened but that is definitely not gentle parenting, that is bad parenting!

For pp I was pointing out that the natural consequence would be getting wet, not getting in the car and going home. Of course a child shouldn't be left in wet clothes all day.

I have worked in education for 20 years and my own observation is that gentle parenting is misunderstood and turns into permissive parenting. A gentle parent should have firm boundaries but be patient and calm in how they are enforced. They pick battleswiselyandgive appropriate choices. A permissive parent is scared to say no and does anything to keep the peace. Unfortunately it's this I am seeing too much of.

I've been wondering what gentle parenting is, so thank you for your explanation, OP.

My DCs are 20 and 22 and i would say my parenting style is gentle. it works.

Both my DCs are very polite and hard working and always gave been. So much so that they still meet up regularly with their head of 6th form.

i think the problem your teacher friends are talking about is a lack of boundaries. i have come across a few kids in my time who do not seem to have any rules to follow - no bed time (or a ridiculously late one), no household chores, no teaching of simple manners such as how to eat nicely at the table.

The other thing that comes to mind is some parents just do not put in the effort to spend time with their kids (exDP i'm looking at you). i'm not necessarily talking about big days out but i do i mean simple things like reading stories and taking the time to talk to your children. i think this makes them feel more secure.

You parent the kids you have. I fit the gentle parenting type, my kids are kind and well behaved and even now my eldest is - teen I regularly get compliments on how lovely they are.
I think permissive parenting is damaging for both parent and chidk and is often mixed up with gentle parenting.

I just had a stern word with my daughter, which I'm sure wasn't gentle parenting.

I'm putting my 2 year old down for a nap and my 4.5 year old does not want to be left, even in the next room to wait a few minutes until I put the 2 year old to sleep.

I said she can come in, if she's quiet and plays with a toy/ iPad. She keeps talking and is starting to cry because she wants him to fall asleep faster, as she wants to play a game with me.

She's starting to have a borderline tantrum about it. I told her she can watch the iPad quietly, yet she wants it on loud.

I said 'I know you're frustrated ' but I need you to be patient until we can play together when your brother falls asleep. She keeps crying / screaming. Of course eventually , I said ' if you don't stop, you can wait in your room'.. i also said, the longer you cry and keep him up, the longer we stay here. She did settle down eventually and my two year old is just falling asleep now.

I initially said something more like : I can see you're having trouble waiting for your brother to fall asleep and it's really tough when we want to play but need to be patient. I'm going to help you by going to your room with you and you can watch your iPad in there. ' it didn't work at all and she got even more worked up. Had I continued to be patient, have more conversations, validated her frustrations even more- it would have taken forever to get my son to sleep. Had I forced her into her room or out of the room, she would have gone absolutely nuts. This would have resulted in me being very frustrated, my son getting no nap, my daughter being distraught. So on one hand, I'm being permissive. Allowing her to come in the room with us, on the other hand I'm being authoritarian, threatening to remove her from the room unless she shuts up.

I'm sure my example can be pulled apart any which way. The first thing being, why do you need to stay with your two year old until he falls sleep ? Why can't you just pop him in his room and he sleeps ? Why can't the 4 year old just play in her room for 5 minutes alone ? There's a lot to unpack here but just wanted to give an honest example of our lives.

I'm a teacher of similar number of years experience and I'd agree with this completely.

Gentle parenting in my of itself is respectful, empathetic, and relies on boundaries.

Permissive parenting is weak, fearful and lacks boundaries.

You haven’t u aerators natural consequences. A natural consequence was he got wet.

Taking the whole family home is a million miles off a natural consequence.

I come across lots of children. Well behaved children really do stand out.
You need to teach your child that there are times when they need to be quiet. That other adults doing work do not want to hear them, that the adult working is speaking only to mum/dad and they have a job to do.
Teach them that they are not the centre of the universe and quite frankly other adults are concentrating on working.
This might sound harsh but for example the mechanic carrying out an MOT is not there to give a running commentary on what is happening. Neither do they appreciate a child being left to scream or shout In their work place. Or touch equipment.
Whatever this type of parenting is, it is very lazy.

@flowermo I've been a teacher for ten years and currently have a 3 year old and a newborn. I think I would have done similar to you but probably issues the consequence of 'if you make noise and keep your sibling awake, mummy can't play with you'. I would look at it as 'maybe she goes nuts today and he gets no nap'. But if I address this now then in future this won't reoccur.

I think my parenting is gentle - no shouting, hitting, we blame the behaviour not the child. But I think the difference between that and ineffective parenting is parents who choose not to address the behaviour now and let the situation continue each day at nap time which teaches the child no boundaries. You did tell her not to do it which is a good thing. Some parents don't and the kids in school struggle because they just don't have boundaries. It's really hard to think of a related natural or appropriate consequence that will kick in soon though. I don't like the 'we will go home' one and try really hard to think of alternative consequences e.g. 'you have to sit in the trolley for running off' before using the nuclear button of going home.

I have sympathy with stress of her 'going nuts' though. My toddler has been know to lose it for a solid hour and a half before the situation is resolved. I'm just hoping that the fact the same situation doesn't repeat means she is learning the boundary effectively.

This, 100 per cent. I brought mine up to know that no meant no, no argument. A teacher who took DS1 on a European trip spelled out to parents that this trip is not a democracy. They will get up when staff say they need to be up etc. Well said.

You need to put the work in during the early years so they know what you expect in terms of behaviour. If NT, they should then be able to sit still and eat a meal, with reasonably good manners, for example. When they’re older, it’s then much easier than dealing with self-centred, indulged kids.

For really little ones the fewer words and more simple the better. I use 'first and then' 'first I'm putting baby to sleep then we play' quiet like a mouse or you have to wait in your room.
Depending on understanding you can then chat afterwards about the situation.

Well, yes, you can pull it apart untill the cows come home but if you strip it back this is what you have done:
-offered her a limited number of choices
-outlined the boundaries
-acknowledged her feelings
-gave her a chance of correcting her behaviour
-removed from the situation when she failed to self- regulate
-remained consistent with your boundaries

All things consistent with gentle parenting.
Permissive parenting would have been to play with her on demand and authoritarian parenting would be to shout at her without explaining the boundaries and giving her a chance to correct. Authoritative parenting and gentle parenting are not mutually exclusive.

Nobody is saying that gentle parenting is a magic bullet that works immediately and without fail. It's a process allowing the child to learn and develop over time. The only thing I would question is whether the way you worded your request to her was age-appropriate. Now she is calm, I would go in and have a chat to her about why she got upset and see if you can come up with a solution for the next time.

As a teacher I say no. The children come into school and can't follow rules. There needs to be a balance.

You don't need to shout and I never shout in class but kids need clear boundaries and consistency.