Shamima Begum

[Mamabear04]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm2n8xv61x3o

I'll admit I actually don't know much about this apart from it being on the news when it happened and I did watch a documentary about it. Do you think she should be allowed to have British citizenship? I mean she was a child when it happened, surely she was groomed? And now stateless, doomed to live indefinitely in a camp with nowhere to go? I think running away to join Isis is of course absolutely awful but surely she should be treated as a child that was groomed? Or am I missing something?

She was a British child. Taking away her citizenship deemed entirely inappropriate. Bring her back, put her in custody and work out if she is a risk or not and what to do with her. No one should be left stateless. I think there was a huge amount of racism in this decision and it was very knee jerk because ISIS were so horrific. A lot of other British people have done a lot worse and don’t lose their state

I think Tommy R who has been inciting racial violence and terrorism from his sunbed in Corfu should be stripped of his citizenship. They did it to Shamima so why not this right wing terrorist? She was a kid when she was groomed and joined ISIS but he's a 47 Yr old man who knows exactly what he's doing. Anjem Chowdhury was recently jailed for life for inciting violence so why not these right wing thugs who are terrorising Britain today?

Why did the government fail her?

No blame attached to Isis then.....

Not fashionable enough for the virtue signalling middle classes. Bangladesh has just turned to chaos with hindus being hunted - Begum should feel right at home.

I don't think you've got the faintest idea how grooming works.

When grooming is done successfully it's entirely through manipulation to make it the victims "idea" and "choice".

It's an illusion, one that has clearly not only rubbed off on young Shamima Begum but you as well apparently if you think a happy, well adjusted child would choose to be radicalised.

So do you think 15 years old are simply too old to be groomed? A 15-year-old who is pursued by and has sex with her teacher - is that grooming? She’s old enough to know right from wrong, after all.

The babies were the lucky ones. Who knows what kind of lives they would have had.

She made her choice. She has expressed no regret and states that she still supports ISIS and believes the propaganda.

Leaving her stateless and stranded is safer for the majority. Her wellbeing is irrelevant at this point.

A couple of silly schoolgirls with romantic ideas of finding a handsome husband. What became of the other girl?

That's quite some hysterical reasoning.

I think she is dead

I've said this several times on here before I am sure.. but I don't care if she was a misguided teen, groomed, or revels in it to this day and takes delight in the thought of terrorism.

She is a British citizen by birth. She is our problem to take care of.

I agree this is very wrong. Not just because she was a child and was groomed. Because she was British by birth, from birth. She does not get her citizenship by gift of the government; in fact the government is government by the decision of citizens.

To make matters worse, it is illegal to make any person stateless, under international law that Britain is signatory to. The British government is claiming that she has a right to Bangladeshi citizenship through her mother, but the Bangladeshi government has said she would have had to apply before she turned 19, and they will certainly not grant it now.

It's totally sinister that our leaders think they can just take your citizenship away if they don't like you. I get why they don't like her, but they still cannot do that.

And every other country with nationals in this situation has repatriated them and tried them for their crimes at home. It looks like the people in charge know they won't be able to get a conviction against Begum because there's no evidence she actively fought for ISIS and because she was a child. She was radicalised here in Britain FFS

This is exactly it. It was the handsome young men that attracted them. The ideology was incidental.

It was a legal decision, but the choice was made by a politician based on bad, politicised law.

She would be an incredibly dangerous woman to have in our prison system.

Of course I think grooming happens. A 15 year old girls ‘falls’ for a 20 year old and thinks she loves him etc. The adult should be jailed but the child didn’t hurt anyone else so she’s the only victim.

Joining a known terrorist organisation is not the same as the above example. 15 is old enough to know right from wrong regrading getting in to a relationship with someone who is a terrorist and commits atrocities. There is no justification for that in any shape or form.

Why the "here in Britain FFS"? She was presumably radicalised online. Maybe her parents should have paid more attention to her, then, and controlled her internet access.

I think highly intelligent and trained judges who've heard all the evidence know a bit more than the average MNer does. I also assume they've been well educated on the rights and wrongs of removing her citizenship.

I am not convinced that she was groomed, plenty of teenage girls do silly things of their own volition. They don't, however, generally join terrorist organisations overseas.

Womp womp. There are a million other people I could be fretting over before SB.

Sounds like a great idea.

In fact let's take it one stage further. Anyone the Home Seccretary dislikes can have their citizenship taken away.

No actually thinking about it - the Home Secretary is a very busy person - we should just have a poll on the Daily Mail website. If enough people vote that they don't like you then bye-bye passport and it's deportation time!!!

You cannot have seen her speak if you think this. She’s not charismatic, or convincing. She doesn’t seem to know much about the Islamic State ideology or particularly believe in it. She comes across as very dense, in fact, to the point that I imagine she’s far more vulnerable to the manipulation of others than they would be to her (as her history suggests).

She came for the boys and that was it.

Agree

Is the fact she married a man in his mid 20s immediately after arriving in Syria not evidence enough of grooming for you?

If a white 15-year-old married a man in his 20s would that be grooming to you?

I have no idea. That would be for the DPP and the police to determine. Judging by the opinions on here she is guilty of any manner of crimes and such a big threat she may bring down the establishment as we know it.

I believe she was an A grade student. I’d describe her as many things but dense isn’t one of them with those grades.