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Original poster

To think the anti-immigrations have BEEN "heard"?

501 replies

dropoutin · 07/08/2024 01:40

I posted something like this on one of the riot threads but it ws locked soon after.

Is anyone else getting really bored of people justifying racism, terror, violence and destruction by insisting how important it is that those who imagine asylum seekers are responsible for the country's problem are "heard".

Little reminder: It's exactly that particular obsession that led to the Brexit referendum in 2016, and the most radical - and destructive - political change of recent times.

There were several years in which the country barely discussed anything else. Farage and Johnson got to tell you in great detail how the reason you're poor is because of the black family down the road. And you got the choice of believing them, or not. You even got to make Johnson PM so he could "get Brexit done" and "level up" your community.

You've been taken for a ride. Asylum seekers rriving irregularly (via small boats etc) make up less than 5% of total immigration, which is coming down after peaking in 2022 (partly due to the Ukraine war, and other factors). Neither Tories nor Labour are going to radically reduce immigration because anyone having to ACTUALLY run the country can see that doing so will exacerbate the demographic time-bomb, reduce economic activity and decimate the NHS. You're poor because of 14 years of Conservative economic policy, not because of anyone's skin colour or passport.

Meanwhile: How many of us get to have a national referendum tailored around our favourite policy hobbyhorse? When is my referendum on industrial relations? On housing and land ownership? On the House of Lords? When do I get to be "heard"? Being heard doesn't mean everyone has to agree with you, or that you get to go out and beat up brown people because things aren't working out the way you imagined they would.

It's not that you haven't been heard. It's just that you were wrong.

OP posts:
PaperBeige · 07/08/2024 06:51

SD1978 · 07/08/2024 03:17

For me- and I'm not involved in rioting or condone it. The numbers may be small, but over £6 million a day is spent on housing approximately 45,000 people......with everything economically going on, with everything the government says it needs to cut back on, hearing those figures makes things difficult for me if I'm honest. They could be seen as a trigger point, but I beleive the ire is being directed the wrong way. This is from the government report, showing the amounts spent on UK citizens is significantly less per head.

The Government’s impact assessment of the Illegal Migration Act 2023 estimated that the total cost of providing public services to a UK national is around £12,000 per person. Even the most basic calculations put the economic burden on the British taxpayer of an illegal migration population of 1.2 million at £14.4 billion. That is just shy of 10% of NHS England’s budget for this year.

I agree with this exactly and I also think regularly what that money spent on hotels could do for the women and children who are mostly still left behind in the country of war.

Nobodywouldknow · 07/08/2024 06:52

Also:
immigration rules are pretty strict. It’s certainly not unfettered. If you get married to a foreign national, that person does not have an automatic right to live here for instance. I think many think it’s easier than it actually is with myths like “visa marriage”, suggesting it’s automatic.

Asylum seekers are not illegal immigrants

Illegal immigrants have no recourse to public funds and do not receive any benefits or accommodation. I promise they are not the reason you can’t get a GP appointment. They live under the radar to avoid detection.

NeedSomeAnswersPlease · 07/08/2024 06:55

SD1978 · 07/08/2024 03:17

For me- and I'm not involved in rioting or condone it. The numbers may be small, but over £6 million a day is spent on housing approximately 45,000 people......with everything economically going on, with everything the government says it needs to cut back on, hearing those figures makes things difficult for me if I'm honest. They could be seen as a trigger point, but I beleive the ire is being directed the wrong way. This is from the government report, showing the amounts spent on UK citizens is significantly less per head.

The Government’s impact assessment of the Illegal Migration Act 2023 estimated that the total cost of providing public services to a UK national is around £12,000 per person. Even the most basic calculations put the economic burden on the British taxpayer of an illegal migration population of 1.2 million at £14.4 billion. That is just shy of 10% of NHS England’s budget for this year.

For me I'd rather that money was spent on people trying to better their lives than people who just waste it 🤷🏻‍♀️

crostini · 07/08/2024 06:57

@Zet1

Yes thats true. Good point.

But we can't ignore what is still going on in Rotherham and we can't re write it to make it more comfortable for us. It is and uncomfortable truth and that's why it was/is ignored for so long. People are rightly angry about this. But I will caveat that by saying I genuinely don't believe that the rioters care about young girls. Most of them just want to fight and be degenerates.

stronglatte · 07/08/2024 06:59

I think these aren't anti immigration protestors these are far righted ill informed, not very bright thugs who all look like they aren't ready for the world of work . Most of them look on something too - what jobs could people be stealing from them. They don't want to work and are just out to commit lawless acts on hard working British citizens. Th

Izzymoon · 07/08/2024 07:00

Immigration is a faux excuse. I guarantee all these people with “valid” concerns actually have no clue what the UK immigration policy is and how it works.

I thought brexit was going to solve all these problems? So many things ruined in the country for the racist agenda back than and it’s still the same old shit with people claiming they aren’t being heard and others smashing in windows.

Freysimo · 07/08/2024 07:03

The NHS would collapse without immigration, ditto the care sector, but these people are coming via legal means which I have no problem with. It's not racist to be concerned about uncontrolled immigration. We haven't got the infrastructure, GPs hospitals, dentists, schools, housing etc for thousands of mainly men who will presumably have families in the future.

Mrsdyna · 07/08/2024 07:03

KitKatChunki · 07/08/2024 04:18

The major irony is they tend to vote Tory, who are the party who decided to pay out millions to house asylum seekers rather than actually process them as Labour are now beginning to do. The mess we are in is a direct result of voting for a hard-line party who were better at stirring up the hatred than dealing with the issue in any effective way.

Yes but then isn't that just showing that our democracy isn't working?

SweetFemaleAttitude · 07/08/2024 07:05

People rioting have not been heard. They are fucking thick. The majority have one tooth in their head and have used 'we want our country back' as an excuse to invite violence.

They couldn't give a shit about 'protecting our children' FFS

Oh yeah - looting shoezone and Greggs will save the kids.

They are angry and poor and blaming the wrong people for their issues.

I blame farage, because Brexit allowed people to say their quiet thoughts out loud and it's all stemmed from that.

Scarletrunner · 07/08/2024 07:07

Brexit wouldn’t have happened if there had been controlled immigration

Canalboat · 07/08/2024 07:07

Couldn’t agree with you more OP. I’m in my fifties and I feel like I’ve been listening to people banging on about this my whole life, including members of my own family and I’m sick of it. I live in a very mixed area and have two mosques on my street before anyone accuses me of living in an ‘ivory tower’ or something. DD’s besties are Muslim and I want that to continue and not be fucked up by racist bile. I’m really fucking angry.

Boomer55 · 07/08/2024 07:11

I can’t remember politicians, of any hue, regarding any subject, ever listening to voters, once elections are done.🤷‍♀️

stronglatte · 07/08/2024 07:11

@Canalboat you sound like the way forward and where we need to be . I share your sentiment, first I was scared and now I'm just getting really angry that we have to spend so much time and put these brave police people on the line plus all the decent families being terrorised so that they can turn the tv off and go for a good old destruction day .. totally hijacking lives and peace of mind. They don't want to work you can see that clearly

bergamotorange · 07/08/2024 07:13

BeethovenNinth · 07/08/2024 05:56

there can never be an excuse for dragging people from cars or setting fire to buildings housing people.

I dont think the right people have been heard. There are millions of us concerned about unfettered immigration and the worsening quality of life in the Uk and a myriad of other issues not least the impact on women but we aren’t doing the above which is never excusable.

Using the word 'unfettered' suggests you don't know much about the immigration system or how it works.

Leniriefenstahl · 07/08/2024 07:16

crostini · 07/08/2024 06:57

@Zet1

Yes thats true. Good point.

But we can't ignore what is still going on in Rotherham and we can't re write it to make it more comfortable for us. It is and uncomfortable truth and that's why it was/is ignored for so long. People are rightly angry about this. But I will caveat that by saying I genuinely don't believe that the rioters care about young girls. Most of them just want to fight and be degenerates.

They’ve not been ignored. For the last 6 years the tories brexiteers have pandered to their whims. Spouted vile racist rhetoric. Done what they wanted although it hasn’t worked as they wanted.
Funnily enough the country is still in a mess, left behind towns are still left behind. That should surely tell them something ?

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2024 07:18

I think the time for listening has gone now. You can't listen to people who set fire to buildings full of vulnerable families and hurl missiles at police officers. Those individuals have lost the right to be heard because of the way in which they have chosen to express themselves.

We should not pander to extremists or reward criminal behaviour. Otherwise chucking bricks, stamping on the heads of innocent peopleand setting fire to libraries will just become the new way of getting politicians to listen to whatever grievances people might have. What other groups might choose to adopt these tactics, I wonder?

The rioters need to know that immigration will be pushed further down the list of government priorities because of their actions. Efforts to "stop the boats" etc will be delayed as a result of the Home Office having to divert time and resources to policing our streets and creating more capacity in our prisons to accommodate the rioting thugs.

stronglatte · 07/08/2024 07:21

Agreed . What is clear is this is not a group of well meaning individuals ready for the world of work. They are barbaric thugs that any decent person would want nothing to do with. It's like that one person we see on the street they makes you shudder multiplied over and over.
They do not want a debate they want chaos

Mrsdyna · 07/08/2024 07:21

Can you say that they've been heard when we've had mass immigration for decades?

Izzymoon · 07/08/2024 07:23

Scarletrunner · 07/08/2024 07:07

Brexit wouldn’t have happened if there had been controlled immigration

And yet as was explained at the time, we could always chose our own immigration policy for the non EU countries, which let’s face it, are the ones these people rioting or with hardline views actually care about.
Brexit was never a solution to Muslims in the UK, despite what Farage managed to convince a significant number of people. Now what a surprise, a few years on Brexit hasn’t changed that.

Izzymoon · 07/08/2024 07:26

Mrsdyna · 07/08/2024 07:21

Can you say that they've been heard when we've had mass immigration for decades?

Is there a reason the people who scream the loudest should be given a louder voice?
If the majority of the country had these views on immigration then the Reform vote would have been louder. We’ve had fucking countless votes during the past 8 years.
They’ve had ample opportunity to be heard.
What they want is no immigration from non white countries, it’s unrealistic, it’s not the that popular and it’s not going to happen.
Screaming about it doesn’t validate their views more.

christmaspudding43 · 07/08/2024 07:26

Meadowfinch · 07/08/2024 04:16

Another way of looking at it, is that the govt (of both parties) proceeded with European integration between 1975 and 2010 while ignoring the concerns of the electorate. We live in a democracy, people were entitled to their say, and the mess that is Brexit is the result.

On immigration, people have been expressing their perfectly valid concerns and being belittled, insulted, called racist or ignored since Gordon Brown and his famous 'bigoted woman' remark.

Rioting is criminal, completely unacceptable and those involved must be prosecuted, but there is understanding & some support from a wider section of the public because people are worried about a soaring population, about their inability to access services and housing. About communities being undermined and about their children's futures.

Politicians need to address those concerns head-on, and stop pretending that there are no problems.

OP, telling people they are 'wrong' is you acting like Gordon Brown. If we are to resolve this we need to address people's concerns.

If this is an issue caused by decades of policy it seems only fair to add in to the pot consideration for Britain's colonial past and the vast impact that has had on various political, geopolitical and religious issues around the world. It's hugely complex but as a country Britain was happy to exploit many others historically. Something tells me the people who think stealing gingerbread men from Greggs is a political statement aren't considering the nuance in the current immigration situation though.

Snorrrring · 07/08/2024 07:27

Nobodywouldknow · 07/08/2024 06:47

True. And girls from deprived backgrounds have been sexually abused and exploited since forever but people only sit up and take notice when it’s Asian men doing it. When I was at school, several girls of 13-14 would have 24 year old “boyfriends” who would pick them up in cars. Looking back, the girls were very vulnerable and it was so wrong but nobody did anything.

Show quote history

No one cares about those girls they are seen as trash - that is why the police do nothing - they don't care about the victims. The victims deserve what they get. The police are fond of a bit of racism too

Mrsdyna · 07/08/2024 07:29

Izzymoon · 07/08/2024 07:26

Is there a reason the people who scream the loudest should be given a louder voice?
If the majority of the country had these views on immigration then the Reform vote would have been louder. We’ve had fucking countless votes during the past 8 years.
They’ve had ample opportunity to be heard.
What they want is no immigration from non white countries, it’s unrealistic, it’s not the that popular and it’s not going to happen.
Screaming about it doesn’t validate their views more.

Show quote history

Well no, the conservatives promised repeatedly to bring immigration down so these people haven't been heard, they've been repeatedly lied to.

INeedAnotherName · 07/08/2024 07:29

Have they been heard properly though? Or heard and dismissed?

As of 10 July, 14,058 people had crossed the Channel in 2024 - above the numbers for the same period in the previous four years.
In 2023 as a whole, 29,437 people came to the UK this way.

That was a big drop from the 2022 total of 45,755, external, which was the highest number since figures began to be collected in 2018.

Since 2018, nearly 120,000 people have come to the UK by this route.

Where the fuck are we putting them?? That is a hell of a lot of bodies to house, feed, access medical care. And there's more every day.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53699511

marmaladian · 07/08/2024 07:29

Not in UK, but get seriously peeved when people leave their Islamic nations because they are so ( terrible, poor, abusive, corrupt etc) and then move to a Western nation and are upset it's not like it was back home! I'm sure this will offend some people and it's definitely not everyone but their are some Imams here who are frankly disgusting and if they weren't Muslim would be charged with hate speech. It is true but nobody wants to admit it. It's sad.

The pendulum has swung way too far.