Not trying to be inflammatory but why do people *need* more than two kids?

[ConstantlyFuriosa]

Just that.

It probably works both ways. I’m one of 2 and then desired a larger family.

When they are 80 and surrounded by children, grand children and great grandchildren they might consider that actually being a full time mum was a great 'job'. There will come a time (if you live long enough) when your career and how many holidays you went on and how many gucci bags you have etc will matter a lot less. I think women who sacrifice their jobs (because most people have jobs not 'careers') to have children and raise them full time are awesome and in the long term it will all pay off for them in older age when they have a bunch of people still around who care about them.

sunflower of course it's great when it works well but you can't assume that just because you have a 'large' family you will end up surrounded by grandchildren and great grandchildren who all love you and want to spend time with you. I spend quite a bit of time volunteering with elderly people and many of them have zero contact with their adult DC & DGC ... yes, maybe some of them are toxic and difficult but surely not all of them. There are no guarantees in life.

Oh just ignore all these comments and opinions. It's just noise!
Couples get criticised of if they have only child, if they have two boys or two girls, if they have more than two kids, if they have no children. Someone will always have a negative opinion. Sometimes it's jealousy, sometimes they're just mean spirited people who like to criticise. You enjoy your family.

Maybe baby number 2 turned out to be twins?

It’s hellishly busy, that’s for sure. But my husband is self employed and works to his own hours so school/club/social runs are shared. We’re both on call for homework etc. We’re both very organised people, which helps! We’ve both been, without exception, to every class assembly, play, parents evening, sports day etc of each of our children so I don’t think they’ve missed out. It’s a busy life, but not a hard one. For us, obviously- not speaking for all parents of big families!

I ve always felt really sad for people who don't get on with their only sibling. My elsest sib did once accidentally say our parents had too many children. The youngest quipped "which of us would you send back?" and we all laughed. At one of our crazy big gatherings that we have three or four times a year.

Maybe it's less intense as there are so many of us.

I don’t know anyone from a large group of siblings that has decided to have more than 2 or the occasional 3 themselves.

My mum was 1 of 7 & had 4, her siblings have a mix of 3 & 4. physically, financially and logistically I think it’s quite hard to have had more than 4 then or even 2 these days. My mum would have liked more but met my dad quite late (in those days). I would have had more but physically don’t do well with pregnancy.

My mother was the youngest of ten (by five years), one died in his 20s but the other nine married. They did not have big families, mostly two children, three had one child, two had three (the last baby unplanned).

I feel like it can go either way. Either you loved growing up in a large family and want one yourself or hated it and want peace and quiet as an adult. My partner's cousins are an example - there were five of them. The eldest has three kids, the next one down is absolutely adamant he doesn't want any at all!

My grandma (dad's mum) was one of six. Three of her siblings went on to have four children and one had five.

People don't 'need' children. Our planet is stuffed.

It might be a biological 'need' that many fulfil but it's ultimately the most selfish thing you can do, because you're doing it purely to satisfy your own personal wants. Not saying that like it's a bad thing btw!

OP, are you a journalist or government official trying to test public opinion on the two-child limit on universal credit 😉.

In any case, it’s pointless scrapping it without scrapping the household benefit cap too. Or those families struggling the most won’t get the extra money and will be no better off.

I can’t understand why anyone would have a view on how many children people should have. It’s an entirely personal choice. People who don’t have children are constantly asked why, especially women. Then, people who have a child are asked if they want another. Then, people who have more are judged as having too many 😂.

In terms of social security, I want to live in a society where families with children who are struggling financially get the help they need to live a healthy life. Denying enough help to parents, based on an arbitrary moral judgement of what’s acceptable, means the children suffer.

What more important thing is there to spend tax money on than children growing up safe and healthy?

Children really should be capped. Cannot stand all this govt payout to families. Earn it.

….. and for households like ours, who do earn it and have never taken child benefit…?

And alot of people aren't in a position to provide for the number of children that they have

How odd to describe the concern about avoidable child poverty as “hysterical shrieking”. Hyperbole to say the least, and the sign of a very callous nature.

Never had a penny in child benefit, for any of my 3 children. Am I allowed to
keep mine?

I'm one of 4 and DP one of 5. We have 2 and all our siblings have a maximum of 2 or none at all.

I think large families these days are a lifestyle choice. More so than having 1 or two.

I'm in the thick of it currently with 2 under 2. I've met a couple of mums on maternity leave on their fourth or fifth. Ive met one of her seventh!

They've all varied in terms of class/income. But one thing they all have in common is that it's a way of life. I'm NOT saying this in a bad way btw. But it has to be. Currently my life is hectic with 2 under 2 and really full on. But I know it's just a phase. In 2/3 years it will be completely different. I'll resume my hobbies and social life. I may go from 3 days a week to more days. My dining room will have an actual dining table in it and no longer be a playroom. I will no longer have a huge nappy bag/prams etc whenever I leave the house.

But with big families it isn't a short life phase. This hectic/busy phase is it. It's a way of life and you've gotta be 100% in.

These mum's I've met including my own mum and in-laws (not met the dad's) live this busy in 'the thick of it' way long term. The mum's I've met have been wonderful, kind, knowledgeable women who really adore family life. They'll have the full sha'bang, all in. They'll have the family pets (dog, cats, hamsters, guinea pigs etc). They'll have house set up long term for kids e.g swings in the garden installed into the concrete so can't be folded away. Everything is set up long term for that lifestyle.
Their social life is usually other mum friends or family. Their hobbies are volunteering at their kids hobbies etc.

To be honest I don't think you can have a big family and not be this way, especially if you want to be a fully present parent. These mum's love it and it's their lifestyle choice.

So long as the kids are cared for and loved it's no issue really.

I didn't 'need' any of them but had DS & wanted a sibling for him & then had twins. 🤷‍♂️

As you said, you are not taking child benefit. You can afford to have children without help.

Seems a stupid question.
Why does anybody need to go out for dinner?
Why does anybody need colourful clothes?
Why does anybody need ice cream?
Why does anybody need friends?
Why does anybody have anything they can survive without? Does not needing something mean you should not have it even if you can get it?

Yes, people do tend to get offended when someone makes offensive and inaccurate assumptions about their family.

I could easily say only people who have two or fewer children are only doing so because they are unable to parent adequately. Maybe your children would suffer if you had more than two – that cannot be applied to everyone. You have a very immature perspective on life if you really can’t comprehend that not everyone is the same.

Because somebody is going to have to be in the workforce, paying taxes, to make sure you have a reasonable old age.

If you want to see what happens when people don't reproduce take a look at Japan.

Some friends of ours “had to” have a big family because they both came from big families. Now they just complain about how expensive 4 kids are and regularly talk about how badly their childhoods have affected them.

We also have no benefits but pay a lot of taxes as we need to earn well to afford our children.

also from a large family myself and all siblings also have what you call large families now