To be so indecisive about birth?

[forgotthewords]

I’m going round in circles and need to decide so I can start to prep.

I’m due to give birth in one of the busiest months of the year. I am low risk at the moment. Everyone I know of who has had a baby in the last 2 years at my hospital has not had a fantastic experience, apart from one person who had a Caesarean due to breech position. The others have mainly experienced failed inductions, poor postpartum care, and traumatic births to the point of needing debriefs and in some cases physiotherapy.

I understand that straightforward births can and do happen, but statistics say that’s less than 40% of the time for a first time mum. A larger proportion than this either have assisted deliveries, or inductions that are lengthy, painful and fail resulting in EMCS. A remaining smaller percentage elect for a section.

I am wondering about maternal request section and how that might be for me. Sections carry risk for future pregnancy, and a longer recovery time. I imagine they must be very painful afterwards. Planning one seems like the 2nd most desirable option after a vaginal delivery though? Predictability to an extent, avoids the risk of an emergency situation. To me it removes layers of ‘unknown’. I could deal with the unknown better if I trusted maternity care in this country more but the fact is I just don’t, not after reading the reports and knowing it’s a nationwide crisis. It seems like a coin flip situation anyway where you’re actually relatively likely to need an emergency section, which seems the worst of all worlds.

I have been recommended to look into hypnobirthing. I have looked, and may consider a course but ultimately I feel like a positive vaginal birth comes down to luck and chance and a lot of factors that are unknown until you’re actually having the baby.

Posting I suppose to see others’ birth experiences, ideally recently, so I can inform myself slightly more.

I was induced with my first and it took 36 hours and was really painful, and literally nothing happen for the first 24 hours no dilation, just pain. But the pushing part was really easy and I recovered really quickly. No forceps or cutting (can't remember the proper word sorry!) Baby was well too. And I didn't find it traumatic. I just wanted to say that because you've heard such bad experiences, it's not always like that. I'm hoping for no induction with baby 2 though.

The problem is that you tend to only hear and remember the negative stories. I gave birth at a small hospital and only seemed to hear negative experiences beforehand, at one point i even wanted to give birth at the larger hospital but it was slightly too far. My birth was amazing and I wouldn't change a thing about it.

People will tell you horror stories about inductions but my SIL had 2 and had a positive experience both times.

Ultimately what will be will be and you only have a certain amount of control over how it will play out.

@MidnightPatrol I didn’t say I’d refuse forceps so please don’t misquote me. I said I’d avoid any intervention as far as reasonably possible.

I've had two inductions with different outcomes. First, after failed sweeps and pessaries the drip. They rammed me through it way too fast, then baby got stuck and it was a ventouse. I had an epidural because the pain was horrendous which made everything worse as I couldn't feel the contractions to push. My husband couldn't talk about it for months as he was so traumatised.

Second birth at a different hospital. Wonderful. I was afraid initially because I had to be induced again, but they took it so much more slowly that I slept through the first part of contractions. I didn't have the epidural and pushed him out and it was magical. Just needed a few stitches but that is normal. There were lots I felt misled about with my first birth - taking the drip so fast, and not telling me we could turn the epidural off to push.

I don't think I was particularly better at birthing the second time round. I think the care was much better, I was more relaxed and skipped the epidural.

The 40% isn't the 'good vaginal birth' rate, it's the 'straightforward' vaginal births. Straightforward just meaning no ventose/forceps/induction. People have 4th degree tears, surgical repair and long term consequences, and it still counts as part of the 'straightforward' vaginal birth statistics.

The tearing/cut rate for first time vaginal births is 90%, though not all will require stitching, and some will be relatively minor.

For me it was like rolling a dice. I figured an absolutely horrific birth would be a 6, no tearing actually straightforward birth is a 1, with everything in between. Do I want to roll the dice or go with a guaranteed 3.

I chose the 'guaranteed 3' and personally was amazed how great my ELCS's were. I was assuming they'd be painful as I'm a wuss with pain, but I've honestly had worse periods. Equally, some people do find them harder to recover from, so it turns out there are no guarantees anyway

Totally valid to think these things through. I would say though that unfortunately even with a planned maternal request c-section (which you are very much allowed to ask for) you may not quite have the control you are seeking. You are likely to be bottom of the list and bumped for emergencies, possibly psyching yourself up a few times. And may go into labour. It’s not a reason not to do it, and it’s frustrating that this is the situation but worth acknowledging.

Everyone wants to avoid interventions - no one WANTS these interventions.

The reality is that once you are in Labour you have very little control over the outcome, and you are trusting the medical staff to make the best decisions for the survival of you and your baby.

Going into labour thinking ‘I’m not going to have any interventions’ IMO leads many women to feel like they’ve failed / be unable to understand what’s happening to them etc.

Instrumental births were barely mentioned during my NCT - a third of first time mums have one. It’s a likely outcome and you need to be prepared for it!

Hi OP. Your feelings echo mine exactly. I’m due my first soon. I personally don’t think it’s necessarily down to the unit itself. I really think it’s luck how it turns out for you, because many women used to die in childhood. It’s clearly a flawed method for humans so intervention is often required.

My experience of midwives so far has been varied and I’m quite terrified of putting mine and the baby’s life in their hands. Equally, I know they’re the experts so I need to relinquish some control. I’m also medical so my obstetric and anaesthetic friends tell me horror stories which I know are the minority but still, it’s hard to ignore.

I think my plan is to ask for an ELCS sometime around the 40 week mark ?maybe just after. If my baby comes naturally and I have a good birth then great. But you’re right, statistically, the odds do not stack up for this.

I was induced at 38 weeks because baby was “big”. She was 8lbs in the end. Went in Friday ended up with elective c section on the Monday as I was tired and fed up and nothing was happening and I’d set myself my own personal limit before hand in order to protect my mental health.

C section was my worst case scenario as I hate medical stuff but honestly I’d opt for a section next time in a heart beat. The actual c section part was amazing!!!

My SIL just had a baby and he’s got issues because he was stuck in the birth canal too long - seen a picture and he had a crazy alien head which has gone down now but he’ll need an operation to correct. She ended up having a c section after 48 hours of baby being stuck.

Obviously doesn’t happen to everyone but it’s close enough to home for me that I’d have a c section next time to avoid this risk to baby. I can’t imagine how worried my SIL is.

I also had terrible post partum care they actually forgot to discharge me and I stayed in longer than I should’ve. Could go into more detail about this but it’ll be an essay. I get it the nhs is underfunded but I felt so neglected and ill informed. Although I think a lot of it could’ve been solved by having the same medical professionals dealing with me rather than a different one every day. I was in 6 days in total and not once did I have the same midwife or doctor.

I had a planned c-section (breech) and loved it BUT it was a factor in my secondary infertility as I had fluid gather where my c-section was and also scar tissue that acted like a natural coil (although that one possibly wasn't from the c-section, but was the main fertility issue). It look us 6 1/2 years ttc, loads of money, heartache, unnecessary ivf and surgeries to fix it. I had another planned section for my second child (for a few medical reasons) and although it was straightforward enough I ended up having to go home with a catheter still in for 5 days as I couldn't wee after it was initially taken out. The actual procedures and being handed the baby was magical both times. Recovery wasn't too bad for me.

I'm all for maternal choice and I guess I wouldn't have done anything differently as I wouldn't have a natural breech birth personally.

This! I do genuinely believe there is a lot you can do, to increase your chance of a normal/straight forward birth. Although possibly too late for you now OP as I think it starts wy back even before you're pregnant

I have 2 children. First was spontaneous vaginal delivery at 38 +1 and active labour of 3 hours and 30 minutes of pushing. No drugs, no stitches or tears .

My 2nd (3 months ago) again spontaneous but at 39 +1 active labour of 5 hours (I got to hospital at 4cm this time but was 8cm the first time so probably was similar in truth) and 15 minutes of pushing. Again, no drugs or stitches or tears.

Both times I've had a high bmi. This time I also had GD but yet my baby and body still managed to play ball.

I was out and about within 3 days both times, my friends who have had c sections have had a very slow recover in comparison - something to consider.

I don't know. I was honestly a bit jealous of SIL she just recovered so quicky. I know it's not necessarily the same for everyone. I personally really wanted a water birth but every appointment I had my risk level went up and options went down.

I'm really interested in those who think you can influence things. In what way? As I said in pp I had a very long but really happy and incident-free birth, apart from keeping fit I didn't prepare at all. What could or should I have done? I'm 12 weeks now so maybe I can do better with the second one.

One of my biggest fears about labour was hanging around the house for hours in pain but not wanting to go to the hospital in case they sent me away.

They offered me an induction the day after my due date and I jumped at the chance (I didn’t know anything about the horror stories at this point). They originally planned a pessary, but I was already further along than they thought so they went straight to breaking my water. My epidural didn’t work, but my labour lasted 7 hours from breaking water to the birth, so felt pretty quick, especially since my SIL had been induced in the same hospital for 4 days a few months prior.

I didn’t find labour too bad overall, and would much prefer to go through it again rather than the first trimester. I really struggled with that.

While I agree that educating yourself may lead to a more positive birth experience, it still doesn’t eliminate the multiple factors which are out of your control. As mumsnet likes to remind us, “women have been giving birth since the beginning of time”. Some of them would have had easy births, some not and some would have had significant morbidity. All of these women would have been uneducated by today’s standards. I don’t think we can pretend that educating yourself absolves risks (but I do agree it’s sensible to educate yourself). It literally comes down to is your pelvis and vagina going to allow a baby to come out in timely and safe fashion, and no one know the outcome of that until you’re in the moment.

I agree. I’m a FTM so as uneducated as they get, but also I have to wonder if people who say this are just the ones who were lucky but tell themselves it’s because of something they have done. A bit like those whose babies sleep through the night? 😄

I was induced with my first and it was a good experience, I largely put that down to insisting on the epidural ASAP.

I had twins this time around, they are 3 months now and I had an elective c-section. Had no desire to try and birth two babies vaginally. Another good experience.

Doesn't everyone though? Noone chooses intervention for fun, it's for the safety of the baby and/or mother.

I feel as well that some of the talk around education and choice can make mums feel like it's their fault if they didn't get the birth they hoped for.

It's your choice. If you don't want to have forceps then just say no. Just in the same way as these days so many women choose to opt for c-section. Women's "right to choose" now trumps everything it would seem.

As a previous poster said, it is a big decision, and one I understand as I had the same dilemma a few years ago, with exactly the same questions going through my mind.

I went to nct classes and did a hypnobirthing course, and I felt the majority of my friends & family who I discussed my feelings with were very much in favour of ‘natural/ vaginal’ birth. As others have said, if a ‘natural’ and safe birth could have been guaranteed I absolutely would have chosen that, but the fact remains that there really is an element of luck as to how it is going to go. I agree there are things which can be done to influence the birthing process but to suggest that a person has control over it (and I did hear opinions like that) is irresponsible.

I ultimately opted for the elective C section, I felt supported by some of my family/ friends/ professionals but not by everyone. I had not had a straightforward pregnancy and I felt so exhausted by the emotional strain of that that I just couldn’t cope with the unknowns of ‘natural’ birth. I felt it was difficult to tell people ‘I chose a c section’ because I do feel there is a stigma attached, but the notion that people opt for it for ‘superficial’ reasons (if there’s any such thing) is just not true. I wish I hadn’t taken on other peoples opinions so much- I really didn’t need to. I thought very long and very hard about it as you are doing, so that you can make the decision that is best for you and your baby.

You are doing the right thing to consider every option from hypnobirthing to elcs, and as you weigh up how comfortable you are with the unknowns of birth/ how much anxiety you have about those vs the drawbacks of c sections you will work out which option sits best with you. In my experience the recovery was fine. After she was born I did now & then wonder about how the birth of my daughter might have been, but I don’t really anymore. I am extremely grateful that she arrived safely. If I were to have another I would most likely make the same choice again.

Good luck OP, you will work it out and make the decision that is right for both of you.

Hi OP. I had an ELCS and it was everything I hoped it would be and more. Calm, straightforward, quick, and the recovery was fairly easy. I've got one planned for my second too.

There's lots of threads on here with different experiences re ELCS. When I was deciding on how to deliver my DS, I went through so many of these threads, and found that the vast majority of women also had positive experiences with ELCS.

Please be aware that some posters will miss that you're asking about ELCS and speak of their emergency cesarean experiences. ELCS and EMCS are completely different and their respective recovery periods are not comparable.

Here's a good and thorough thread to look at if you're concerned about recovery following ELCS

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/pregnancy/4787211-how-soon-could-you-do-the-following-after-elective-c-section

Whichever form of delivery you choose, I wish you all the best xx

First time i had ventouse delivery, off my face on pethidine. It was fine, don't remember much and was out of hospital in 24 hours. I gave birth twice after in a lovely mw led unit. Very calm, relaxed. First time on all 4s and second time squatting I lived about, I tried pool. Hyponbirthing music. Stayed overnight in room gave birth in.

I had a very long chat with mw in the mw led unit around second birth and they were amazing. Talked me through stages, how staying positive and mentally in control during a straight forward vaginal delivery and not giving into the natural panic can help.

Although c sections are relatively safe ans winderful when needed they still come with more risks for the mum than vaginal delivery as its surgery- infections, blood loss, clots, anesthesia complications. Risk of injury to baby and increased risk resp distress.

I have a friend who does a lot of work with women with birth trauma. She consequently elected to have two ELCS. She has nothing but good things to say about her experience.

I had a very long labour then forceps. Beforehand I really really didn't want forceps but actually it was both necessary and fine.

I wouldn't want to be induced after my friend was induced then kept at 5cm for three days due to more urgent cases coming in and lack of midwives! And that was in a good hospital.