My dh has been messaging a colleague. Please can I have some practical and moral support

[PleaseVipersHelpMe]

NC but been here forever. Not really sure why as he would recognise the whole thing in an instant but I need the help and I’d rather he didn’t know. Please can I ask for some support?

I’m on holiday and finally plucked to the courage to ask my dh to let me see his phone. Told him it’s because I was feeling jealous of this woman (true). He let me, but obviously didn’t realise that he has to delete his deleted messages from the recently deleted file and I found quite a lot but only up till about 3 months ago, nothing before. Him telling her that he misses her. Texting when he was away telling me how much he misses me. Telling her that she’s one of the greatest people he has ever met. That he wants her in his life. Then arranging to pick her up from her house on his mid-life crisis car that i stupidly encouraged him to treat himself to. I feel so fucking stupid.

I took screenshots of everything and send them to myself but he’s insisting that nothing happened, that she was just his friend and he’s crossed the line but no affair. I haven’t found anything in emails or what’s app either. Is there anywhere else I can check without alerting him. I have full access to bank accounts and nothing untoward there so far but we don’t have online banking for one account (I can check that when I get home).

I feel so betrayed but the fact that he’s lying to me is worse. He’s treating me like an idiot. He insinuated in the texts that he was going to get her a company car but is saying he hasn’t actually done it. Funnily enough emails seem to be missing re this. He’s clearly been deleting calls from his call log but I don’t know whew do look to find them and I’m pretty sure they will be all gone now if not before. I know he’s lying is there anywhere I can look to find evidence of this? He won’t let me have the phone without him being there now.

I know it won’t make me feel better but it will make me feel like I’ve outsmarted him a bit and I wave him to feel as on edge as I do. I feel like I’ve been punched in the stomach and I’m trying to be normal for the kids but I’ve just been sick. I’m supposed to go out for fucking dinner with them all now and be normal. I‘m trying so hard to not upset the kids, they deserve better. This is horrendous. I’ve honestly told so many women on here what to do in this situation but I can’t believe this has happened to me. How could he do this. Any why does he think that shagging her is worse than lying to me? Thanks in advance for any help, and for reading ny ridiculous essay. I will respond to and replies as and when I can after dinner.

I am so disappointed to read this. I too hoped that it was a vain shallow ego massaging blip, and that it might not be the end of you.

From your update and his refusal to be honest, I think he has now been playing you all along, for time.
He is a liar.
His lies could simply be that he wishes to control your relationship and it will only finish on his terms.

What I find insulting when I read threads like this is how stupid liars like him are.
They really think they have covered all angles and arguments but they simply aren't that bright.

They don't realise that their lies and fabricated narrative is often so easy to pull apart.
I can 100% believe that lies more than cheating would finish a marriage.

Being treated like a fool when lied to repeatedly is not something most people forget or recover from.

You gave him/it a chance, HE blew it.
Getting good legal representation is the most important thing now, a real rottweiler who will get you the best deal as you leave this lying twat behind.

I am so sorry.

My husband had an emotional affair. It's been 18 months, we are still together. Some days it's OK someday it's not. Sometimes I feel like an actor in my own life.
It's happened and that can't be changed. Her husband dosent know and hopefully he will find the proof I have made accessible if he goes looking.

I have hidden a recorder in his car that I download every month or so.
I know how pathetic this looks, there is no one to talk to they would say leave but this is my life.
There is positive he has finally understood the meaning of partner and I do 50% and no more. I have lost weight and in many ways I am stronger, better and more confident. I can walk away but I don't want to loose the good bits and start again.

“He is currently saying that he will not give me access to his phone or anything as I will never get over it and he can’t live like this. “

Just massively Wow OP did you realise he was so controlling he is not sorry at all or he would be doing everything in his power to assure your recovery. How dare he tell you that he will be in charge of how your recovery will be managed (by him) i think he is pulling the wool over your eyes now and just wants to sweep it under the carpet and because he says so you must agree! Can’t believe your not even getting the number one basic of restoring trust ie access to all his devices what a despicable control freak he’s turned out to be. Be careful now OP he can go any way. He will try and blame you now saying he didn’t have an emotional affair, your crazy, your breaking up the marriage because of your jealousy. I now agree with other get the best lawyer you can afford and take copies off every legal document you can as well as copies of his text that other woman (as he will now deny to everyone and blame you).

Does he truly not realise you will leave him over this ??? Have you told him this ??? Just a thought maybe he wants you to leave him he has OW as a back up therefore protect yourselves and your children as the gold digger OW will get everything that was yours (tbh I’d let her have as have him hes not emotionally mature enough for you and is destroying your MH).

5 minutes after you have found out, he is already telling you he cannot live with you not sucking up his lies and bullshit and moving on from his little blip🙄.

THIS is the real him revealed. Really shocking to find out after a long marriage, but it is what it is.

Take this as a very strong indicator of what a prick he may be when a financial agreement is being agreed upon.

You are going to really see him clearly I would think, and realise you never knew him.

You need to stop thinking about protecting him and his relationship with your children.

Your responsibility is to yourself and them and that he has chosen to cheat on you and the family.

Get very quietly organised and consider a forensic accountant as a business is involved.
Don't allow him to fxxk you over financially.

Keep posting OP, we are here for you.

"Take this as a very strong indicator of what a prick he may be when a financial agreement is being agreed upon."

I completely agree with this. When you seek legal advice, maybe go to a couple of different solicitors. He will not be able to be represented by anyone who has spoken to you. Make a note of all potential joint/marital assets and debts - savings, pensions, investments, the business, property, inheritance ...

I would want specific advice regarding the business. Do you have any involvement or own shares? Are any assets owned by the company e.g. cars. Could you negotiate less interest in the business so that you get more interest in the other assets - property/savings/pension?

You may feel it too soon to be thinking and planning in this way but, even if you do go on to successfully rebuild your marriage, it would be good backup information. It may also help to focus H's mind if he realises now that a divorce potentially means losing half his business, pension, house and savings!

What do you tell teen aged DC? You let him tell them.

When my father had an affair when I was 16 my mother told us - he was in the room, but she made the mistake of bearing the brunt of all the emotional labour involved. He just sat there and cried.

Let him take responsibility and the consequences. 30 years on and I still think my father is a weak man. I don’t seek out his company - he’s reaped what he sowed.

So please @PleaseVipersHelpMe let your husband tell his children.

I agree.
HE tells the children.....in your hearing.

Do not allow him to tell more lies.

Oh dear. The poor little lamb is struggling to adapt to the life he has chosen for himself. Twat. If he wanted to be trusted, he should have been trustworthy. And he knows that somewhere in himself. I’m so sorry op, I know that kicked in the stomach feeling all too well.
Me? I’m an optimist. I’d go to therapy with him in the hope you get a good one who will hold his feet to the flames. Best case is he realises exactly how much of a thunder cunt he has been. Worse case is that you get some guidance on how to separate amicably (for the children obviously, I’m sure you don’t feel remotely amicable at the moment)
What ever happens op, you are hardcore, and you WILL rise from the ashes of this. With or without him, you will chose the life that is best for you and you will thrive, I have no doubt.

So sorry to hear the update 🌺🌺look after yourself.

As you say, its not the possible affair, its the constant lying! I would never be able to trust someone who lied to me constantly despite having numerous opportunities to tell the truth. You cant trust a word that these people say.

Honestly, living with someone like this isnt worth it.

Get advice from a solicitor, finances in order etc then move on on your own terms.

Thank you, I agree. We have counselling tomorrow so we will have to see what they say.

I managed to get hold of his old iPhone (only changed handset a couple of months ago) and that completely supports what he is saying. The messages were overfamiliar but definitely no worse than the most recent ones. He’d been deleting even then (found them in deleted file) but given only those messages I’d have struggled to find an argument to put a stop to it (although it was all far too friendly for my liking). So why is he feeling the need to delete things and block access?

He says that I’m being ‘controlling’. I said he could have access to anything of mine at any time, plus this isn’t a forever situation so I don’t feel that it is unreasonable to make me feel better in the short term. I don’t want to be checking his shit forever. If I can’t trust him after a period of time I will call it a day. But he’s still refusing ‘unless they tell me that it’s required in counselling’. I’m telling him that it’s essential but for some reason that’s not enough. He seems to have chosen this hill to die on. Although this is symptomatic of his attitude to me at times which we have also discussed in depth.

You are quite right. Trust is sacred and I’m struggling even though I do believe him.

I genuinely don’t think he’s messaged her again. He’s copied me on the very odd email he has sent her and forwarded me what she has sent him. I believe that it’s over. But the fact that he is denying me this is making me so suspicious. It feels as though he would rather make his point than ‘give in’ to me. That hurts tbh.

This is exactly how I feel expressed far more succinctly that I am managing to do - thank you.

He thinks that he knows best, even when I’m telling him exactly what I need.

How dare he think a random counsellor gets to decide what you get to see.

His cheeky fxxkery is breathtakingly arrogant.

In your place, I would be absolutely furious at his presumption.

OP, I am so sorry, but this is not a man that is sincerely regretful, and he doesn't respect you the way a good man should.

I think you are far too good for him.
I don't think he deserves you.

He's telling you you're being controlling? That's a good one, Jesus he's got some brass neck. He will only let you see his devices if the counseller tells him to?

I'd guess that he's realised you're more switched on than he is, and he's not willing to risk you finding more. That would be the absolute end for me, how does he think treating you like you have no agency is going to help right now?

He is showing that he has more respect for a random person who is a counsellor than you, his wife, who he claims to want to do everything to remain married to.

Out of interest, what is his response to you pointing out that you are prepared to end your marriage over this?

OP. It sounds like there is still something you don't know about. I wish I had been like you when my ExH had an affair. You are incredible.
He was exactly the same as your husband and minimised everything. We did try to make a go of it but then other lies kept coming out and I realised that he would never be honest! I could not live like that and ended it.
I don't know it's just a gut feeling but the element of control suggests there is something he is still hiding from you.
I dug and dug and dug into the affair and it destroyed me. I wish I had just accepted he was a lying knob and walked away earlier. I felt like I needed to know every single thing and I felt myself going mad as I realised I was becoming controlling and needed to constantly check everything he said and did.
Eventually, I could not take it anymore and left him!
I wish you well and thinking of you!

Sorry….but DH needs to understand (and the therapist need to affirm, if they are a credible relationship therapist) that the “victim” of the cheating gets to choose the new boundaries they are comfortable with, should they choose to remain in the relationship. That can take on many forms…100% access to emails, 100% access to phone, tracker on phone, etc. It is not “controlling”. It is the new boundaries put in place for the other party to be comfortable to remain in the relationship. If he can not agree to you setting the new boundaries and is labelling you because of it, then he is not ready to make amends and the repair cannot happen. He should be bending over backwards and agreeing to whatever you need to make it work.

A few days ago he said that ’he is desperate to make things up to me’, yet now he is calling you controlling for having recovery requirements??? He gives no credence or worth to your needs/boundaries.

@PleaseVipersHelpMe, his need to dominate is staggering. The very idea that he has the right to block your marshaling as many facts as possible to be able to make decisions is beyond the pale.

Being in charge and keeping you in the dark is the same entitled mindset he had while cheating and robbing your agency/consent/choices. It is a contemptuous mindset of devaluation and subjugation.

If he were ‘desperate’ he’d be an open book and moving mountains. It appears that he is confident that you are going nowhere.

Good luck with whatever you decide. Personally I would contact OW - I would expect her to move on with her career elsewhere too.

You can check locations on an iPhone that he was been to regularly.

That's how I caught my ex.

personally i think this is sensible

if you are giving something another go, then to know every single gory detail isn’t going to help.

He has been very quick to jump to being the 'victim' of your 'controlling'.

He doesnt seem to realise that, if you do decide to stay together, this is a new marriage. He doesnt have your trust or respect because he hasnt earned them yet.

Now he is an old acquaintance, not the man you married, not a friend. He is someone you know a lot about. Without your shared history would you even date him knowing what you know now?

I'm coming to this late @PleaseVipersHelpMe but have read the thread and think I understand your total devastation.

My situation was different, exH used a different playbook ("no one else" "just want to move on" "it's me not you" yada yada - he did marry OW once we were divorced). My children were the same age as yours though - and it took many years for them to forgive him and get their relationship back onto a good track - because he lied, and they found out his lies for themselves. I am VERY happy with my life, but if I could go back in time and head off the divorce at an earlier point, repair the marriage, then I would.

What I did want to say though is that 30yrs ago my DSis found out her DH had cheated with a younger employee. She threw him out. She made sure that everyone, inc his friends, knew the real reason. She told him that she would consider reconciling if HE went into individual therapy and worked out WHY HE had done this. Nine months later he moved back in and they began to rebuild their lives. They were together for another 25yrs and very much enjoyed their retirement, travelled widely and had adored grandchildren. I know she was happy with him and her life and had no regrets taking him back. However, when she was diagnosed with terminal cancer she told me that her fear was he would somehow reconnect with THAT woman after she had died and move her into the house. She carried that for 25yrs. I don't think I could have, but we were close enough for me to be sure that she was happy.

Whatever choice you make now there will be regrets, hurts, that linger. You will not wipe them out - but you will go on to be happy again. You can be happy with him, or without him. It will be your choice whether or not that future includes your H. Good luck.

What I find insulting when I read threads like this is how stupid liars like him are.
They really think they have covered all angles and arguments but they simply aren't that

Sorry for the delayed response I’m struggling to find a minute to myself now that I’m back at work.

This has occurred to me too. My dh is a very clever, very astute man. But I found his old phone in his bloody sock drawer. I’ve easily caught him out with pretty much every lie and I pretty much know now exactly when he is telling the truth. The phone supports what he has said. I believe he isn’t speaking to her. So why the fucking secrecy? I almost think that he just doesn’t want to have to discuss anything else and that’s more important to him than my need to get to the bottom of it all. But his attitude is really not helping and I’m sick of it.