I can't really go back to work with H attitude

[icantfuckingwin]

Two kids- 4 and 2.

H trying to build an empire and make it big. Self employed business. Requires A LOT of hours out of the house. I do not wish to disclose the type of business it is. But it's not work from home.

He leaves at 6 and comes back at 8:30-9 pm. The commute is around 1:15-1:30 minutes.

He's been putting a lot into it for many years and is on the brink of a possible investment, let's say. To enlarge business.

I've also had quite a successful career. I went back to work after both babies. I also manage everything home related, as I've always worked from home, there was just more time for me to do it.

For the last year I held a senior position, on a pretty big salary. Not humble bragging. But I suffered from absolute burn out. I could no longer maintain everything. I was doing all night wakings, all mornings, all drop offs and all pick ups, plus dinner time and bed time alone. My kids school is also an hour round trip because of traffic. I did have the help of a cleaner and spent money on convenience foods and take aways too often, but was really trying to just get through the days somehow. We had a nanny for a while before my youngest went to nursery and she'd fill in if I had work trips abroad etc. anyway my H all the while always complaining how much money we spent on outsourcing and making me feel guilty about it.

So we recently started discussing my return to work and what was going to change. To which he said, well we can't spend that much money on outsourcing stuff- otherwise it won't be worth you working. We will be paying more to outsource than you'll be earning. This is because I suggested we have a housekeeper a few times a week, rather than a cleaner once a week, to make things easier on me. He said I never think about the finances and only about getting more and more help in.

This was part of the reason I left my job too, as I was made to feel guilty for needing help.

He essentially wants a wife who works full time on a big salary and takes care of all the home and childcare stuff with no help ( aside from nursery ) while he goes off to build his empire.

And I know what he'll say, he'll say I never supported him and he did it all alone. He already thinks that. Because I couldn't handle ' my lot '. When I was working and caused him a headache by complaining about it all.

I am sad but I don't think I can go back to work under these circumstances. He still does not get it and he'll begrudge the money we will need to speak to pick up his side of the equation.

God he sounds absolutely selfish. You are not being unreasonable, and it's impossible for you to keep stretching yourself in so many different directions.

I think in my revenge scenario I'd be tempted to cost out an Au Pair. But a young energetic male one, from Brazil or somewhere, who is also training to become a masseur.

On a more serious note, keep outsourcing what you need to give yourself some breathing space. A housekeeper sounds like a good option if they are willing to support with the kids coming back from school, making tea or a snack etc and being there in case of commuting delays etc.

If he moans, as others say, start writing up a list of chores that he needs to do, and times he needs to be home to do his share of the grunt work.

He says I don't think about finances enough apparently.

I could not sleep last night at all.

Then my two year old started vomiting in the middle of the night. H got up and closed his bedroom door and that was it.

He's working today and I've always understood that and won't bother him at night, ever. Ever since they were babies.

The thing is, he doesn't appreciate it and thinks I make his life harder. It's such a shame.

I had/have one of those. Total workaholic and I've taken many battering on here because I 100% facilitated his career and have always done everything on the home front.

I gave up a successful career when DS was a baby and sickly and I was burnt out. I had 7 wonderful years at home. DH supported the decision and happily paid for a cleaner because he was never going to do half the cleaning.

When I went back to work part-time for peanuts, DH was totally supportive. I still did all the home stuff and child stuff. He still workaholicked.

The same when I went full-time except more cleaners, an au-pair, outsourcing generally - including having the Christmas Trees put up.

The DC grew up, my role got bigger and more senior, continued outsourcing crap. DH still workaholics and we are in our 60s now.

It worked for us because DH was always supportive of me despite doing no domestic grind. He also never, ever complained about being the main contributor or paying for support. He accepted that was the price of his career.

Because we worked to support each other as a Team it all worked out and the material stuff made it worth it BUT he accepted that my input and contribution was as big as his and facilitated his job.

As a note op, by the time the DC were 2 and 5 and he was late 30s the money was coming in. Is it? Is it a pipe dream? Whilst we are both quite careful with money, I'm not persuaded that truly successful men aren't able to do a quick analysis of what needs to be spent to get stuff done whilst maintaining equilibribrium. It's what makes successful businesses work and is a principle that transfers to other aspects of life. I hope that makes sense.

This is tragic.

that he thinks this is okay and that you think it’s okay.

he sounds like an abysmal husband and father.

honestly stay in work, make plans, get your financing in order and leave

Ah, OP.

No wonder you burnt out. It's all on you, and work was the least of your problems.

I'm in a senior corporate position. I mentor younger women and I do sometimes get asked how you succeed in a senior career with travel, long hours etc AND have a family.

My answer is always: "if you plan to have children with a partner, make sure, ahead of time, that your career is as important to them as theirs".

The women I know who have this are (tired) but happy. The ones with husband's like yours end up anxious, depressed and miserable.

What outcome would you like to see? Do you like your husband, does he make you feel safe and happy? Does he have your best interests at heart too, are your values the same?

If finances can be made to work, with some sacrifices, it's not about the exact monetary checks and balances - you have to be fulfilled in life too.

Is sounds like he expects to outsource all responsibilities for home and kids on to you. For free.

You need to renegotiate his role, not your role. There’s zero reason why this needs to be about what you do and what gets outsourced, and not what he does. If he was responsible for more, he might realise the value of outsourcing.

And there’s no reason why costs for childcare should be based on your earnings. He also wants to earn money rather than do childcare, so his salary should cover the childcare he’s not doing by going to work.

Your financial independence is invaluable - do not give it up especially for a man who has such a selfish attitude. He sounds very controlling.
i would do a breakdown of all the chores/ tasks that need doing every day and ask him which ones he is going to take on if you can’t have help.
stay strong on this and let him know you will carry on working so either he helps out or you get outside help.

So what are you going to do OP? I think he has ground you down, treating you like a skivvy, as did the situation you were in when you last worked and you weren’t able to do your job properly due to having no support. I really really think you should find a job as a priority and make it the best paid, to secure your future. He really doesn’t give a shit about you if he can close the door on you when your child is vomiting?! He is a reprehensible human being, I am actually in shock reading that.

What is this ‘partnership’ actually bringing you? You’d be better off as a single parent as at least you wouldn’t have his washing, dirty plates, cooking to deal with. And he would have to contribute to the kids’ childcare in some way then, having them a night a week etc or contributing financially. I’d seek legal advice asap if I were you.

StormingNorman · Today 00:33
icantfuckingwin · Yesterday 23:17
It's not going to cost more I earn.
Show quote history
To which he said, well we can't spend that much money on outsourcing stuff- otherwise it won't be worth you working. We will be paying more to outsource than you'll be earning.

I must have misunderstood your OP.

He is catastrophizing, OP knows her salary, and it won't.
Even if it did not leave much to spend, she will have her pension contributions, some money, security and upward mobility.

Fuck that. Your career and achievements are just as important as his.

Get a job. Outsource the work. Don't take his criticisms to heart. He's chatting shit and you know it. Every time he complains say "I still do my half of the housework, I'm outsourcing your half becuase you don't do it, I won't sacrifice my career for yours."

That's exactly it. He's just kind of making a point, rather than it literally being my entire salary.

A housekeeper isn’t going you help you out. They would help you both out. Is it not his house? His kids? Why does the outsourcing come from your wages?
This isn’t a partnership or a family, it’s a patriarchy.

👌

Then reframe it. The kids are 50% your and 50% his. He pays for (or does himself) 50% of childcare. He pays for (or does himself) 50% of cleaning, etc. It’s not actually your salary paying for your joint children.

Look at it like this: you’re working, running the house, doing pick ups and drop offs, night wakings etc. The ‘outsourcing’ covers his lack of contribution to family life. It’s in lieu of a proper partner. If he steps up, you can scale it down. Until then, if he wants to continue with life as it is, it stays.

Did he not want children? His attitude is very weird - I don’t know any man of our generation like this. It’s like he sees the children as some sort of intense hobby you have chosen to do which is absolutely nothing to do with him.

He will simply not be doing his share of childcare and housework, regardless of what the OP needs. She cannot force him. He will walk away from it/ close the door, when she cannot.
O P, outsource as much as you possibly can.
Get absolutely on top of any figures from his business. Do not let him use the house as collateral.
This looks as if it will end with you being his servant, or you parting from him.
You do not have to use any knowledge, but it adds to your strength.

It’s all his wants isn’t it.
what about your wants and needs ?

This man needs to step up instead of expecting it all from you . This standswhether you work or not.

If he doesn’t then make your life easier by leaving him .
You sound worn down . Decide what YOU want and tell him how it’s going to plan out .

If he complains about mess/laundry 'yes, that's your half that's not done.'

So sorry for you situation. You must be shattered. Hope you can get a nap today

I had a situation, not dissimilar.
Husband had the 'big Job', I had a good job too but was expected to do everything thing at home, on the premise that his job paid more. He never got up in the night once I can remember etc. Thing was whatever I did it wasn't right/goodenough. Work/not work - also I wasn't motivated by money, I wanted a life with a bit of joy in it, and we divorced.

In the marriage I burnt out and it hurt my career big time. But the kids and I have been quite happy with everything not being perfect. I did work and moved near to my family for help, but I don't earn what I would have.

I could see where it was going and did not think it would improve.

You might just be having a bad patch, and its so tough with young children. but you need to protect yourself financially - and mentally you need support and encouragement, as he does I am sure. I would suggest relate counselling. You are at risk financially, but he has a lot to lose if you decide its easier to do it alone.

What a prick.

I'd be telling him to pick up his half of the domestic load or shut his trap.

Oh he is one of those, the ones that want the wife to earn money and contribute financially up to 50/50 plus the majority of the child based stuff because being the only one who earns is hard, but their job is so important (even though they only pay 50% of the bills because of course it is unfair they work so hard and don’t get a chance to save money or make big purchases on themselves) they can’t possibly do any child or housework but neither should they have to spend money in it because you are there and you should be able to do everything and to a high standard

and I suspect you have a massive 4/5 bed house to take car of and garden because he wanted it?

leave downsize to a smaller house and make sure you stay

From the sounds of it you don't want to outsource your half of domestic work... It's effectively his half that's being outsourced.

He thinks you don't consider the bottom line enough. I think he's very short sited. The bottom line is that if you have a nervous breakdown because you are doing everything he will then need to outsource everything and will have no income from you either.

He's thinking about money more than your emotional wellbeing and mental health.

I like the ideas of the very simple message to him

'It's your half of the housework/childcare that needs outsourcing. I am easily doing my half. So it's entirely your choice - you do your half or we outsource it.'