Anyone else wobbling about voting Labour?

[MaryMaryVeryContrary]

I desperately want to GTTO but the last few years have taught me that ‘any change’ isn’t always good and things can get worse, even if you think they can’t.

I’ve watched all the debates now and Starmer is so… wet. I don’t like him. The first thing he did when women’s rights were mentioned his first thought was men who ‘identify as women’ and how ‘marginalised’ they are. When asked about immigration he squirmed and squirmed before muttering about his role as DPP (who cares? We want to know what you plan to do NOW). When asked about his support for Corbyn he said ‘but I didn’t think we would actually win..’

There’s something about him which is making me very uncomfortable and I just have a bad feeling now about what would happen if he was leader.

Anyone else? If you’re not voting Tory or Labour, who are you voting for and why? I assumed I would vote Labour this time but my gut is suddenly screaming at me not to!

Put your postcode in this website and vote tactically to GTTO

https://www.getvoting.org/tactical-voting/?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwm_SzBhAsEiwAXE2Cv1kvo4oVQP3-sczzMmiQ1FbCzv11DQhlPMpDkY3pWNfEXGR5TgwEjBoCy0wQAvD_BwE

@ChurchCats yet you dismiss Starmer who has talked about how he will increase rape convictions. Rape convictions have fallen during the Conservative government. We have seen case after case which shows the government do not care about raped women.

I'll tell you who's prioritising the trans movement over women, those who centre it in their vote for the Tories! If it is that important, they would vote for one of the parties who have been consistent in their stance on genderwoo and offer change.

But no, they're going to vote for the party that:
Imposed Austerity.
Fucked the NHS and Education sectors.
Wrecked our economy.
Repeatedly lied through their teeth.
Stretched our democracy to breaking point.
Refused to make misogyny a crime.
Practically decriminalised rape.
Brought the trans shitshow on our heads.
Partied while people suffered and died alone.

That's prioritising the trans movement over women and the whole of the UK.

@MaryMaryVeryContrary I’d listen to
that voice.

Sunak is a shit but I think he’s still better than Starmer.

…you seem very obsessed with Penises, maybe you should read some Freud 🤷

Politics is a bus journey.
No political candidate/party is likely to be perfect, so pick the one that gets you closest to where you'd like things to be.

I'll settle for a Labour national government, but locally my best option is to vote LibDem. Who are conveniently the best tactical option and the best bus for my journey.

Ps you may not need to vote Labour to GTTO. There is a tactical voting site. But I don't think MN allows direct links.

When have I accused you of being a bot?

The conservatives have really taken note of the negative impact of the trans movement to move swiftly to legislate to keep single sex spaces, and this in turn protects my children in loos, hospitals, changing rooms etc.
Last year we had a man walk in on my daughter (8 years old) when I asked him to leave he said he had every right to be there, this was in John Lewis so hardly a place I would expect to find men walking around in the Ladies. I was so appalled, my daughter was terrified. She had not locked the door properly. She is too scared to toilet by herself now.

In my area the healthcare is fine, we have lovely surgery nurses and plenty of female GPs to choose from. I am comfortable with employment rights, and feel if anything these will be eroded by Labour and their watered down plans for self ID. Again how will women ever break glass ceilings if they are in fact men!

Strangely the conservatives have excelled at offering 30 hours of childcare, this did not happen in my day! I wish it had!

Sadly I feel women will really suffer in prisons and refuges if under Labour proposals men can legally work in refuges and and rape centres. Prisons allowing trans people obviously pose a huge security risk to the women.

Overall, we feel much safer with the conservatives. Thank you for asking.

If I didn't want to back Labour, I would be inclined to vote Reform. A Reform success in the election would be the catalyst that politics needs to shake things up and implement change.

It's utter drivel isn't it?

The OP isn't a bot - Tory or otherwise, but the answer is no.

Reform will only ever appeal to a small percentage of the population the only purpose it has is to split the Tory vote

It would shake things up and change things but not in a good way for anyone not independently wealthy!

@Hummingbird75 Men already work in refuges and women's prisons. Actual men, as well as trans women. This all happened under the Conservative government.

I had a leaflet through from them today and sadly I agree with you. I think I was hoping that they would be more like the SDP under David Owen but clearly not. The one that particularly put me off was withdrawing from the ECHR. That was what finally decided me. We do have an ADF candidate. Now that is seriously scary shit.

Maybe I am. I work in the NHS and I see the devastation caused by poverty and health inequalities every day. I don’t have faith that the current Labour government will change this.
I think Starmers economical growth plans are unrealistic and he has made it clear that he will not seem to rejoin the EU, the single market or customs union. Doesn’t seem like the strongest plan for business growth either!

Absolutely!! I don't care if KS is accused of being 'wooden' / boring etc. As long as he is competent. I think he's being careful not to promise too much - he knows the UK is effectively bankrupt & it will take years of growth before there is surplus to spend on splashy/vanity projects a la BJ. He looked a bit agonised on BBC last night - I think he found RS' aggression & the host talking over him pretty frustrating. He's just fine - the best of the current bunch too.

@ExtraOnions.

You say you don't see many trans but then describe one of your daughter's friends as one.
If this trans friend is a boy, are you letting him stay because he is trans? Would you let a non-trans boy stay over in your daughter's room.

I may be uncool but there is no way on earth a lad-anyone with a penis-would be staying overnight in my girl's room and I hope you don't end up being a granny in nine months time!

@feellikeanalien I had no idea they wanted to withdraw from the EHCR. That is appalling.

What a silly remark.

I'm not voting for Keir Starmer, I'm voting for Labour. He's not a one-man band. Rachel Reeves in particular is really impressive and I trust her with the economy more than I do all the Tories put together. Voting them to stay in for another five years would be an even bigger act of self-harm for the nation than Brexit was.

@runningonberocca Starmer has said he will negotiate to change the Brexit rules so we are more closely aligned. I do not think the EU would want us to rejoin at the moment anyway.

…so her friend stayed over in her room when he was a boy, and she stays over in her room now she’s not. I have no concerns there.

Then again I don’t automatically think they anyone with a penis is automatically a sex-offender

Oh. My.Goodness.How many times does it have to be said that most women aren’t concerned about trans people being in single sex spaces per se, but in doing to you are allowing any rapist who’s prepared to slap on a dress and call himself Delilah! They are the people who we are worried about fgs! The people who are bad, and who will PRETEND to be trans purely in order to access women’s spaces. And how can we know the genuine trans from the present trans? WE CANNOT! Hence the only way to keep women safe is to keep all biological men out of women’s spaces.

Do you get it yet?????