To resent that my future depends on whether a man deems me good enough

[Iwilldrawjapan]

The main source of my mental health problems has been men.
I'm 33 years old and except for my very first boyfriend aged 18, who I left when I was 20, no guy has ever fallen madly in love with me.

I'm fully aware I don't need a man in my life to be happy but I'm only human and it's natural to want a connection with somebody. Not that it's attractive to admit that, mind. You're supposed to not be looking at all and absolutely love being single until someone unexpectedly falls into your lap, otherwise you're 'desperate'.

I'd be ok with it if more people chose to be single, however I hardly know anyone who's single, every bloody person I know is with someone, especially at this age, this is the worst age for me.

Men like me and find me attractive, they just don't want to date me seriously/don't want to marry me/just don't fall in love.

Everyone seems to have some guy become absolutely obsessed with them and just really want to marry them.
Guys mainly use me for an ego boost but I'm just not the one for them.

People sprout mindless fucking clichés at me all the time 'Oh it'll happen when you least expect it!' well here's the thing, I'm not 'expecting' it at all, and guess what, nobody's fallen into my lap.

'Just go online!' like it's that easy, it really isn't.
I'm attractive physically, I have stuff going for me, I travel, I am financially independent, I own property, I have hobbies, good family relationship, I have friends. In other areas of my life all is great.

I'm really not desperate, I'm sure someone will be along to tell me I'm coming across as desperate but I have turned down men too, I would not date just anyone.
My standards are not too high, either. If anything I'm very likely considered out of these men's leagues. They're just very ordinary, average men, but I liked them.

People I've dated have either not wanted a relationship after 2 months, or not wanted a bigger commitment after a few years.

Life isn't fair I guess, people will tell me to 'love myself first ' and all the usual crap. Having 10,000 hobbies is no replacement for a happy relationship. I'm sick of seeing the happy couple photos on Facebook, posing with their husband and holding the baby.

Maybe I will meet someone, but for 13 years I've had bad luck. I've never been anyone's 'one'.

I can't have a child alone, I don't have local family, I can't afford to be a single parent financially or otherwise, period.

Honestly, my mental health has been shot to pieces. Life still has meaning, but it's unfair that I'm deprived of what seems to come so easily to other people.

I definitely have a laugh, people have said I'm funny/fun. I agree about the nice thing though, if gets you nowhere tbh

I'm not super relaxed and 'up for a laugh'. I have a killer sense of humour, but I'm not always grinning inanely. I have plenty of friends and male interest (which I don't reciprocate as I'm married!) Your husband's comment kind of reminds me of the bloke's earlier in the thread who said that women need to be 'laid back'. Also, there is a contradiction in what you say about men wanting 'a laugh' but 'don't care about nice'. Which is it?

The only bit of advice I will throw in is watch Matthew Hussey's videos on YouTube (don't worry, it's all free) but the perspective he gives totally changes your view on dating, he's really good.

I'm incredibly uptight and my boyfriend loves me. You can be told too assertive, too relaxed, too nice, too bitchy. It's irrelevant. What one person wants isn't what another wants. Looks are nothing really.
A few points

• online dating is really hard
• I know some women who've set their boundaries so low and accepted so little early on that, yes, they're in relationships but at what cost? 10 years in that passive attitude has left them lonely, doing all the child care etc. Don't bend - you'll break. Remember the person you are now and carry that into the relationship
• it's ok for you to be angry, but things aren't fair. But maybe this is an indication you need to step back
• I think you'll find someone but I don't know. And don't think "why does he like me?" but "why do I like him"
• Having needs and "being desperate" isn't a bad thing. The right person will not mind you expressing your needs

I had a few years like this in my late twenties/early thirties. To make it even worse, three of the men who dumped me after a couple of months went on to marry the very next woman they dated!!!

Like OP, I really couldn’t understand it. I was ridiculously attractive back then, had a good job, nice flat, loads of friends and interests, but nobody wanted me.

Eventually I bumped into an old school friend on a bus and we became very serious very quickly.

Looking back, I think I was giving off a vibe that I really wanted a serious relationship. But actually, what is wrong with that? It certainly didn’t make me, or OP desperate.

Sorry I don’t have any answers OP, but honestly, truthfully, romantic relationships really are overrated.

Stunned at these comments, incels, crud, I mean good god. Do people actually think before typing; what’s the odds she’s only met incels and crud for thr last 12 years and what would it say about her if she could only attract incels or the crud. What a bloody insult.

the op is asking why men don’t wish to be in a relationship with her. My view is she is struggling to understand what a relationship entails.she even tried to get men who are fading out to agree she’s their girlfriend. Which says she’s focused in the goal, not the relationship.

clearly something is up and it simply won’t be she’s incapable of attracting anyone who isn’t an incel or the crud.

and lots of men in their late 20s are happy to commit , it’s ludicrous to suggest it’s as they are at a different life stage so won’t commit, whilst in the same breath saying all the good ones settled down. In their 20s.

its also clear the op isn’t engaging in this conversation. She’s simply making random comments and a few answers. Is she like that in real life? Maybe, if so there’s the problem. Self focused and not interested in others?

I am expecting a lot of trolling for this, so apologies for any derailing. Don't bother trolling, because I won't answer.
There is a book called 'The Rules' by Ellen Fein.
Not the new books, but the original. It changed my life. It might do nothing for anyone else, but if you are looking for a relationship, and wondering why it's not happening I think it is worth a read.
Still doesn't sort out the limited men on offer, though.

I listened to a podcast interviewing this guy who makes his living as a “dating consultant” for women in your situation. His most crucial piece of advice was that women shouldn’t have sex in relationships for at least the first few months. It weeds out the men who are mainly with them for sex, and it communicates that the woman is someone worthy of being pursued romantically as opposed to just sexually.

He said all his clients get mad and complain that it’s sexist, but it works.

There is a ten year gap between 20 and 30. Early twenties, freedom, uni, girlfriend coupledom.
Late twenties they are in a couple or have discovered the sweetshop.
Pardon the analogy OP, but late twenties, early 30's and they have discovered that they 'don't have to buy the cow.'
Yes, of course, not all men, but it's finding that needle in the haystack.

Oh OP your frustration comes across loud and clear in your posts. Many men are shits and it's very easy to let that get into your psyche. Society and social media conditions us to feel we are entitled to marriage kids etc. But none of us are entitled. Ask yourself, what is it you really want a man for? Is it so you can have the big wedding and the picture perfect rosie cheeked kids and instagrammable life? If the answer is yes, these are the wrong reasons and men will smell it a mile off. If the answer is along the lines of you want to find a guy to connect with and share your life then I think this is a better way to approach it. That doesn't need to look like marriage. .Also you actually don't need a man these days to have kids (just a sperm donor!) so if your life is as good as you say and you just want kids well you can do that without a man. I get why you feel angry, life isn't fair. Men can have babies basically in theory at least until they die , thats not fair. Women tend to visibly age more quickly and it's less acceptable societally than for men to age, that's also not fair.. Men are societally conditioned and often watch pornography of younger women so feel entitled to be with younger women, that's not fair. You can choose to dwell on these things or you can choose to live your best life as you are and consider a man as a 'nice to have' but not essential. Once you accept life isn't fair and lose the anger and think about wanting a nice guy just to have everyday fun with and shelve the marriage ideas I think you might find it easier. I'm very direct too OP, I actually find men seem to respect this more, unless they are cowardly arses with fragile egos, you don't want to be dating those types anyway. Start enjoying your life and figure out what makes you happy without a man as we never know how long we've got. Then a man will just be a good extra addition instead of an end goal to making you happy! Book yourself on some singles holidays, join some clubs that interest you, challenge yourself outside your comfort zone. But don't just do it to stand out to some man, do it for you. Your life awaits, it has already begun, don't waste precious time waiting for a man for your life to start..

FFS! Some people are just incapable of getting it.
You embrace singledom. You go on the singles holidays (though my friend met her man in Tibet)
OP wants to be part of a loving and equal couple, as does most of the world.

No @gardenmusic you don't get it, fine to want to be in a long term partnership, but that's never going to happen if you pin all your hopes and put your life on hold waiting to be in a couple..because it can make you dull, angry and frustrated if it doesn't happen. And dull angry and frustrated doesn't appeal to many people generally. Taking a break from dating however and using that time to become an interesting person in your own right who doesn't long for this hypothetical man is what just might get you what you want long term. I get that in itself is frustrating as you want to be in a couple yesterday (presumably because your friends are etc etc) but if it's not working then it's a sign things need to change. The time I met my long term partner was when I was at my absolute happiest and most confident just being myself and wasn't looking for a serious relationship at all. It cannot be faked. If you have an agenda, men know. Online dating is full of men and women with agendas, often hiding their real selves, that's why it often doesn't work. I bet your friend was happy and loving her best life in Tibet when she met her SO @gardenmusic . Real love and connection is a outcome you cannot control or force. But you can help create the circumstances by finding what makes you tick. This is how it's worked for 99.5 percent of the people I know in long term relationships.

its also clear the op isn’t engaging in this conversation.

Holy fuck, can you hear yourself? Would you engage in pleasant conversation with people piling on to attack you, ripping apart your character and every sentence you type, and generally revelling in their own spitefulness?

I sincerely doubt it and I am embarrassed for you and all the other people on this thread having such fun attacking a stranger who's struggling.

Sorry but please give it a rest with the 'I met my partner when I wasn't looking/when I was enjoying being single'. That's fantastic for you, but it doesn't always work like that.
Stop assuming that women can only attract a man by doing this. Being open to dating someone is not 'having an agenda ' jesus.
There is nothing wrong with wanting a partner!

With all due respect, taking a break, 'working on myself' whatever that is, is not the solution. I have a very full life, I'm not constantly out looking for someone or always on the apps. Stop making random assumptions.

@Iwilldrawjapan

Did you think that my suggestion of volunteering might work for you, OP?

I'm thinking that, the more people you come into contact with, the more likely you are to meet someone who appeals to you and who would like to get to know you.

https://www.liverpoolwomens.nhs.uk/get-involved/become-a-volunteer/

What are your mental health problems caused by men.

I agree with the poster about not sleeping with a man too soon. I think definitely wait 3-6 months. After 3 months a person of either sex should be able to say whether they see a long term future eith the other person. Yes not definitely get married straightaway but able to say they can see it going somewhere not just recreational. I also think around the 3rd date you should very casually mention that you are looking for someone to settle down and have a family with. Yes men will find it scary and some might run. But actually it needs out the one who definitely don't want that. I said it to my husband quite clearly on. He reminds from time to time and laughs about me being a psycho. However, although unnerved, he liked me enough to stay and commit to me and we got married a year and a half after meeting.
I really think hold back on sleeping together. Be nice because men do want a nice girl to marry and be the mother of their kids. However have boundaries. Not only will men use you for sex they will so use you for company, comfort, if they dont fancy going to an event cinema football match by themselves etc. Good luck.

Namechangey23
Your post is full of assumptions. I cannot be bothered to answer them all.
My friend was actually grieving, not living her best life.
I managed to meet mine over 20 years ago, I was looking. He was the needle in the haystack.
OP does not need to work on herself - how patronising is that.

Oh op! You need to find the confidence to be single & not accept mediocre men. 80% of my friends are ‘settling’ & not happy. It doesn’t matter if you don’t know many singles, hold your standards high.

I am currently single, I could go out & get ‘someone’ (or change my FB status to single, that gets them crawling in🤣) but I refuse to just get anyone.

Strengthen your friendship group & enjoy your very short life. You’re still very young really. You sound lovely.

OP is perfectly confident. She is not accepting mediocre men.
Op does not need advice on how to be single. Most people wanting a relationship do not need advice on being single.
It is extremely patronising to tell people to embrace their singledom.
Good advice would be suggestions on how to meet decent men, or advice on unexplored opportunities.

I've read the thread and I agree with others it sounds like you need therapy and to decenter men and the male gaze from your life. I'm soon to be 26 and my oldest friend is 38 I know plenty of single women in their 30s

Once I decentered men from my life honestly it was refreshing focus on your career and friendships you can never have enough friends!

Can you pay for therapy?

'I've read the thread and I agree with others it sounds like you need therapy and to decenter men and the male gaze from your life. I'm soon to be 26 and my oldest friend is 38 I know plenty of single women in their 30s
Once I decentered men from my life honestly it was refreshing focus on your career and friendships you can never have enough friends!
Can you pay for therapy?'

and ignore the goad. After you have decentred the male gaze, of course. FFS!

The woman says she is almost driven to suicide because she she thinks she 'cannot get a man' and you think she's absolutely fine then? No therapy required to work on herself according to you? Ok then... Funny how a lot of people are saying the same thing as me. People with the benefit of hindsight. If you don't want to hear peoples opinions on how to help because you find them hard to hear, don't post. I can only answer base on my own experience and of people I know, that was my experience. Under natural conditions and not online dating, people met when they were feeling happy and confident. This is when you are most open I guess? I don't know why it works.

The OP sounds obsessed with getting a man she needs therapy