To think Jewish people are the scapegoats of humanity?

[FactsNotFictionOnly]

I have not posted on the CITME board as although the current conflict is relevant, that is not the main point of this thread.

I do not mean to cause any offence to Jewish people. In fact the opposite.

IF THIS POST IS DELETED BECAUSE IT OFFENDS NON JEWISH PEOPLE, THEN PLEASE RESPOND WITH WHY YOU FIND IT OFFENSIVE BEFORE REPORTING.

I am an atheist and think all religion should be consigned to history books so have no affiliation with any faith but I found the reaction to Oct 7th shocking with almost immediate protests against Israel (the victim) in favour of the ‘freedom fighters’ (the agressors). The denials that atrocities happened, the antisemitism, horrifying comments on SM which are still allowed to stand to this day.

Never before in my life (and I’m getting on a bit) have I seen that reaction of hatred to any country that has been the victim of any kind of terrorist attack or act of war anywhere in the world. Never before have I been aware of the kind of atrocities committed in Israel on such a large scale by a neighbouring country, filmed by the perpetrators, either.

I had heard comments made about ‘the Jews’ at various stages in my life, how they run the world, the banks, the media etc but never really thought much about it or believed it.

I noticed an absolutely blatant lie that popped up on SM yesterday with thousands of comments agreeing with the poster so I responded (never normally do) saying so with evidence and the abuse I got was unbelievable.

That made me do a bit more research on the persecution of Jewish people through history and I was pretty shocked that they were blamed for the death of Jesus, murdering Christian children as sacrifices to be baked into flatbreads, the Black Death, World War 1, 9/11, Covid. All totally false and a lot of the time because it was a way of debtors not paying money they owed to the Jewish people who were the world’s money lenders as it was prohibited in Christianity and Islam and Jewish people were prohibited from other work.

Each time they were blamed for something whole communities were burned to death or had to flee. They were banished from England in the 12th century as well as lots of other European countries. Now I understand why there is so much hatred from the UK and Europeans as these ‘legends’ persist.

Of course in the Middle East from 586 BC they were persecuted where they were killed, forced to convert to Christianity (or pretend to to stay alive) before Islam took over, treated as 2nd class citizens, subject to high taxes and strict rules, regular pogroms and were also forced to leave their homes in their hundreds of thousands.

This was all before a return to Israel was even a thing so there was no ‘Zionism’ then which is currently the excuse for the widespread hatred of Jewish people.

Even before this current conflict there seems to have been a deliberate misunderstanding of the situation in the Middle East with a lot of relevant history missed out out.

Such as the Ottoman Empire ruled the area directly before the Mandate of Palestine and they referred to it as Southern Syria. There were no Palestinians only Arabs. Why didn’t they ‘freedom fight’ the Ottomans for their own State as surely they were occupied under the Ottomans too if they believe the land is all theirs?

I have never seen references to Palestinians being ‘occupied’ by the British either. Weird as they believe the land is theirs and always was theirs - from the River to the Sea.

Why do a lot of people ignore the constant terrorist attacks as the reason why not only Israel, but Egypt too, had to blockade Gaza after a terrorist group with a known mandate to annihilate Israel and kill Jews was elected to govern it by it’s citizens?

Why are people not understanding that this war is not a ‘normal’ war with normal rules of engagement between two uniformed military forces where civilians are afforded protection by their government, military hardware, munitions and bases are placed outside of civilian areas and civilians including children are not involved in military action by firing rockets, RPGs, shootings, stabbings, throwing IEDs, holding hostages in their homes and taking part in barbaric murders, rapes, burning people including children alive and taking hostages?

It is absolutely horrific that civilians have been killed in such a high number or at all but a lot of the deaths can be explained as above and are all due to the war Hamas started.

Why are Hamas not being publicly pressured by Palestinian protestors to give themselves up?

The only (and tiny) Jewish State in the world is now even being persecuted for defending itself against massive neighbouring states who want to wipe it out.

Has there ever been such a forensic examination of any other war while in progress as in this one?

The propaganda and false information circulating before and during this conflict has made it all too clear to see how the Holocaust happened and it’s terrifying to see. I used to watch films on the subject and wonder how could so many people have stood by and let it happen. Now we can all see how.

How can a tiny race of 1% of the population who have achieved more than any other race alive today, be so hated.

Is it jealousy of their success or the hundreds of years of lies that have been brainwashed down generations?

AIBU?

https://www.historytoday.com/archive/why-were-jews-persecuted

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews

I give up entirely - people are just stupid. To your point 79Helene I saw that and just reminded me you can’t argue with stupid.
This forum is on the whole extremely anti-Semitic but I also noticed a huge amount of Islamophobia on the burger thread so it’s a case of equal opportunity racism

But no one actually called you anti-Semitic? So it's actually you putting words in people's mouths, not the other way around?

It is the logic gymnastics again kkloo - I read it the way you did too

:)

As I said this is too easy.

Can't even respond.

Oh ok lets do this.

You are so easy. It's unreal :)

Lol.

Yet your critique only goes as far as tik tok knowledge and gotchas that don't work.

Many many people... Me, me and, oh shit, have I lost track of my name changes? Hilarious 😂

Lol making things up again now you got called out :)

You didn't call me out, as said we had been discussing a particular point and you used a red herring to change the point.

But, that is your standard

Is there a difference between accusing someone of antisemitism and calling them anti-Semitic?

Lol this is too easy

:)

@CaliMZ

"Yet Israel uniquely intertwines race, religion, nationality and identity "

Only when its convenient for posters to make this claim, when other allegations are made its a multicultural liberal democracy.

I agree.

You were shown only to care about sexual violence when its against one side in this conflict which shows where you are.

Yes, that thread and the subsequent one were awful. A few of us on here upset about anti-Semitism were also on those threads complaining about Islamophobic comments being made. As you said, it's equal opportunity racism which means it's best fought from multiple directions rather than just being fought by those currently under attack.

Lol you're still making things up

unreal

Not at all, I asked if you condemned it when it had been used against Palestinian women and girls held in captivity by Israel.

You still haven't yet you've raised it's use by Hamas, which I have condemned, on several occasions.

Lol anyone can hit quote history and search "condemn". No question to me.

Unreal.

But were you actually accused of antisemitism? Or were you challenged to explain why you only care about this one conflict?

But the population of Gaza is overwhelmingly very young, and many pf them would not have been able to vote in 2006. So you are blaming young people for the actions of their parents
.Do all Brits deserve to die because they voted for someone who then went rogue and started an illegal war?

Many indigenous people have had and still have the same prosecution. Usually over land related to power.
Muslims Native Americans Africans Aboriginals The Irish were starved to death in the most appalling act of genocide the list is long.
The most disadvantaged is usually women everywhere.
There will always be war and prosecution with men in charge pulling the strings. They create aggression in order to kill more innocent people and the world is too thick to realise

Several people have made the same points, stretching all the way back to an early post from Meraas on this thread and I post on multiple threads - hence can't remember if the point in question was one I made on this thread or another one. Sorry it upsets you that so few people agree with you, that you now have to invent name changes to try and make yourself feel better - sad.

Constantly attempting to bait people in order to try and have opinions you disagree with cancelled is why many many people question what is being called anti-semitism and not just on this forum but in the MSM - so I won't be playing your game as it is too obvious.

Fuck, ignore this, I didn't read your post properly.

You were asked if sexual violence only mattered when it was used against one group.

I stated:

"Sexual violence as a weapon of war is ALWAYS to be condemned in the highest way.

But were you doing this when there was evidence of it being used on Palestinian women and girls in captivity before October 7th?"

Lol where? State the time of the post.

I apologise if I'm stepping out of line as I don't want to unintentionally offend anyone and I'm not Jewish

Israel wasn't created in 1948. The modern state was, yes, but arguably that was regaining independence. And regarding violence involved in regaining independence, very few if any decolonisation and regained independence from occupations has been without bloodshed. Israel's independence was less violent than many, maybe most, others.

I'm interested in history, and the recent opening of my eyes to antisemitism has motivated my interest in the history of both Israel and separately antisemitism.

Maybe this is a controversial viewpoint, but I wonder if antisemitism is linked to the thousands of years of occupation of Israel (the original kingdom, as well as the re-established modern state) and the forced disapora of Jewish people from Israel?

(Although as has been pointed out on this thread some Jewish people never left Israel and have maintained a continuous presence there for thousands of years).

I think the Maori lady in the article I linked before makes a good point. Anti Israel attitudes are sometimes or maybe often influenced by antisemitism.

That said, OP and you are right that antisemitism goes back long before modern Israel's independence in 1948, and also it's appalling that British Jews are being abused because of the current conflict.