Starmer, JKR, what's most important to most women?

[PupInAPram]

In my more than 60 years, decades of being a single working parent, many experiences of being on the bones of my arse, Labour Party policies have made huge beneficial differences in my day-to-day life. Worrying if there is a man in the next toilet or feeling uncomfortable with a trans woman has literally never been on my radar. If I'm making a decision about voting for the politician who can bring about the greatest good for the greatest number, it's Starmer every time. I wish JKR would just pipe down.

I ask this following question many times, never had a satisfactory answer from people who think that transwomen are women. When I was 15 I was brutally raped by a 27 year old man who I was having a ‘relationship’ with.

Nearly 30 years later he is a lauded transwoman, running groups for gender questioning children. He has stated he always felt like a woman since he was a little boy.

So my question is, was I raped by a woman? Should this man be anywhere near children? The answer to both is obviously ‘fuck no’ but funnily enough TRA’s don’t really want to even engage with my questions.

And I don’t write this post to elicit sympathy, I have dealt with the trauma and have a good life now, I genuinely want to know what the people who think that this is all about toilets have to say.

This is the core of the issue. If a male bodied person was in your local swimming pool female changing room (or any other single sex space you may use), how do we know whether they are a “genuine” transwoman (and no one has defined what that means), or the next Katie Dolatowski?

Short answer, we can’t. Which is why for years the social contract has been that everyone accepted single sex spaces. Good Men stay out so Bad Men stand out. It wasn’t personal, I am friends with and have worked alongside some lovely men, but I wouldn’t want to get changed next to them, be in the next bed to them while ill or injured, or disclose very personal and distressing experiences in a mixed sex therapy session.

Do what you like with your gender identity, smash all the sex stereotypes you like (please do), but my boundary is based on the reality of your sexed body.

the loss of sure start, austerity, underfunding of schools and hospitals, the ever widening gap between rich and poor in our country, entrenched social inequalities.

Almost none of these affect me.

So.... I wish you would pipe down about them?

Doesn't really work.

YABU, I'm glad JKR keeps speaking up, and grateful that she's willing to put her own neck on the line to do so. Even if you disagree with her I find it quite suspect that you want her to "pipe down" just because you disagree.

It is an issue regardless of her speaking out, and one I'm currently struggling with. I want the Tories out, the tactical vote in my area is lib dem but their gender views feel like an utter red line. Not sure what I'm going to do yet.

For the record if a man wants to wear women's clothes and go by a feminine name then think that's fine and I'll respect that. They shouldn't be anywhere near womens single sex spaces though. Pretending there is no difference between women and trans women is insane and politicians that indulge it are either idiots or liars. Neither is a good trait for leading the country.

I agree JKR should pipe down - in the sense that does A LOT of flapping her gums or pounding the keyboard without offering suggestions! And to suggest SK hasn’t done enough - as a victim if DV he’s clearly on the side of woman. JKR falls into the category of being divisive when she could be using her voice in a more effective way.

of course she has the right to speak!! I did not think OP meant that literally.

I'll bite.

What are the thoughts and feelings that all women have but no men do?

Without peeking into their undies like a weirdo, you wouldn’t know.

Oh there we go, as always those who think TWAW go for the peeking into undies trope. Why is that? Why are they so obsessed with genitals? Very odd.

Peeking into undies is not necessary in any way, shape or form. TW are not women, women's spaces, services, sports, refuges, etc., are not theirs to access.

💐

How dare you @PupInAPram violate the MN code that means that you MUST think that this is the ONLY issue you should consider when choosing who to vote for. That all other issues like the economy, health, policing etc that have a massive impact on women’s lives are merely side shows to this all consuming issue.

And if you dare stick your head above the parapet and say that you will base your vote on other issues you will be chided, patronised and labelled as someone who must hate women.

Honestly I think it’s a disgrace that MN allow this. It amounts to bullying.

I like you will be voting Labour based on the fact that I think they will be the most positive to help people - particularly women - across the board. I don’t agree with all of their policies (even though I’m a member!) but I think they most broadly represent my views and what will help most people.

I agree OP, I wish she had kept quiet about the issue at this time.
The Tories are desperate to have a bunfight on this issue and she's played right into their hands, at a point when Labour have been doing a reasonably good job of talking about other issues. Increasingly I feel like she's got sucked into the quite frankly batshit twitter wars on this issue and it's a real shame as her essay was extremely reasonable and I agreed with it.
I don't agree the best thing for women at the moment is to vote for parties that "know what a woman is". They invariably know what a woman is and use that knowledge to screw us over. It's like turkeys voting for Christmas

🤣🤣
Whoops I forgot

So, to confirm - in your opinion all non-passing transwomen are men in dresses and should stay out of female only spaces.

Transwomen who are visibly indistinguishable from women can come in. In your opinion.

JKR is the very best advocate for women. Some women must be living in a cave to not get this.

Surely the easiest thing would be for the Labour party to acknowledge her concerns and ditch policies which are of no interest to the wider electorate and relevant to a tiny, tiny proportion of the population then.

Violent and abusive men will use any and all methods to access vulnerable women. Which is why trans identifying men in women's prisons are 8 times more likely to be convicted sex offenders than the men in the male estate.

Safe guarding works by having one rule for everyone, which means keeping all men out of places where women are vulnerable, including, but not limited to, hospital wards, prisons, toilets, changing rooms, refuges.

Exactly JKR doesn’t have a practical solution to men’s violence against women, she doesn’t have decision making power when it comes to resources for women, medical support, mental health and education. She is just another loud mouth directing hate at a minority.
Meanwhile women have become worse off under a Tory government.

You blame JKR for the fact Labour have sold out women?
Okey-doke. Pipe down JKR, like women have always done. Your fault that the Labour party is full of shit!

Ain’t that the truth.

It doesn't matter, does it? Because women weren't prepared to stay after the rule had been made that they had to admit trans women. And that is the problem - that women-only groups have been outlawed and women have had to kick off to get them back.

As it goes, I agree that women will maybe get a better deal under Labour than under the Tories - mainly because women tend to be poor and overly burdened with caring responsibilities. But if it's illegal for women to have single sex rights, they may lose on the swings what they gain on the roundabouts.

Trans women aren’t beardy men in dresses they are women.

What like Alex Drummond of Stonewall? Sports a very fetching beard.

I applaud JKR for forcing Labour to respond to her points and grudgingly say they will protect spaces for women. Labour and LibDems have been thoroughly captured by the trans lobby.

Small story from me which typifies some men's attitudes - I belong to an innocuous online group which is made up of fans of certain books mainly read by girls and women. 99% of the readers in the group are female. A new person joined. Very feminine name but from their profile it is obvious they are a transwoman. They immediately start discussions quite different in tone to the other discussions in the group - mainly speculating about the sexuality of some of the characters in the books. Many group members are uncomfortable with these themes. People stop posting. A moderator has a word with the trans poster who then reports the group for being anti-trans. Etc.

But you said there are transwomen who we can't possibly distinguish from actual women, and there are men in dresses who might be bad.

What did make up?

https://gendercriticalqrproject.com/2020/06/13/these-are-not-our-crimes/