To think if you've always lived in an affluent place you have no real idea about inequality in the UK?

[Pipsquiggle]

To give a bit of context, I grew up in one of the poorest boroughs in the country and now live in one of the richest.

Had a chat with a colleague today, saying I had randomly bumped into Wes Streeting yesterday and had a chat with him and wished him well. She said I could never vote for Labour, they are terrible with money.

I then said well at least they closed the inequality gap which had been completely undone and made worse by the Tories.
She asked what did I mean so I outlined the following:
Underfunding of councils in poor area which were already under the kosh
Underfunding of schools and SEN
Lack of transport infrastructure so if you don't have a car in many towns you are fucked, which in turn can lead to wage suppression
Closure of Sure start centres
Only being able to afford UP foods and the knock effects on the NHS and behaviour at schools............

I made a few more points and she admitted she just said she had no idea. I told her that if I had lived where I had live now all my life that I probably would be a Tory too but I can't ignore the poverty in my home town.

So AIBU to think that if you have only lived in an affluent area, you don't really understand how bad it is in the wider country?

It depends.
You can have lived in a rich borough and had a life that has stayed firmly within your rich borough bubble and remained blinkered.
Or you can have been born in to all of that but had different experiences in school, branched out at uni with friends from different backgrounds, struggled career wise, had your own money concerns etc and had your eyes widened.

You can’t lump everyone in the same box.

Totally agree - people have zero clue. They just can't imagine why people can't just budget a bit better and then they would have enough money, completely ignoring the lack of decent pay to begin with coupled with high living costs.

I have worked in some very poor areas and still do come across people with such unbelievable lives - it definitely woke me up to the bubble I was living in

I think it's also possible that those who have always lived in deprived areas to not know quite how much money gets spent in other places.
I'm thinking about those who have always lived round me, and are used to the playgrounds having broken and missing equipment for years, with volunteer groups keeping things running compared to the (what feels like - maybe we only visit the best) beautifully maintained parks near PIL, with fully functioning equipment. The sort of thing.

I don’t understand your logic. A lot of people from poverty stricken areas vote Tory because traditionally they were a party of wealth creation. And in recent history, Labour have lost credibility by just ignoring the concerns in poorer areas caused by the policies around mass immigration. They often represent champagne socialists rather than the working poor.

Nothing is ever as clear cut as Tory = rich wanker and Labour = poor person.

I also live in a very affluent area and it is like a lovely bubble if you don't bother looking very hard. It's much easier to not notice issues.

I am involved in a project looking at why pupil premium children in this lovely area do less well than pupil premium children in poorer areas.

There are a few theories being considered. One is, in a very high employment area, to be on pupil premium, you have to have something other than lack of jobs going on in your life. Like disability or 'chaotic background'. The other is pupil premium works with a mass of pupils recieving it as individually it's a low amount, but combined it can pay for useful things. This also runs into the way charities fund things.

We also have a food back in my town.

Your friend is correct, Labour are terrible with money and in the many years that I’ve been on the planet, I’ve seen nothing improve under a Labour government. That’s not saying that the Conservatives have impressed me either.
Your employment can lead you to many walks of life, mine has. I don’t need to physically live it to understand it.

100 percent.

A ridiculous post.

Under the last Labour government, many things objectively improved. NHS waiting lists got shorter. Street homelessness reduced. Average incomes improved. The Good Friday Agreement was signed. All of these are objective fact.

I think genuinely the affluent can’t understand how hard life can be.

On the school run - parents talking about their multiple holidays abroad that year and then someone else saying with their mortgage going up they’ve got to sell (and that’s the people talking about how they’re struggling - imagine the ones who have rent, debt, using food banks.

I don’t know who is the answer but the conservatives are not and as a country we have got to start thinking all people deserve to live a decent life and not be greedy capitalists.

"A ridiculous post.

Under the last Labour government, many things objectively improved. NHS waiting lists got shorter. Street homelessness reduced. Average incomes improved. The Good Friday Agreement was signed. All of these are objective fact."

They're not really to do with managing money though, the labour government came into power with a surplus following a conservative government (not saying I agree with the ways that was saved nationally though). Improving services when there's money available is easier than improving services when there's no money available.

To your point though OP, I do think it's common for that to be the case. I grew up in an affluent area and learned academically about poverty and deprivation but it wasn't until I moved to a genuinely deprived area working as a teacher in my 20s that I realised how many things I'd taken for granted people having weren't necessarily normal. Thinks like books, cars, uk holidays, day trips etc

Yes I agree but probably not in the way you mean OP.

I grew up in a council estate in a deprived area. I still live there although on the better side of town now but overall the area is still considered deprived.

I get frustrated by the narrative of all the hard working, good hearted people in areas like this, just struggling to get by if only they could have more money.

The actual fact is a lot (yes not all - like I say I grew up in it so I know it’s not everyone but I would argue a majority) are lazy and work shy, they drag up their DC and any extra money given to them would be spent on alcohol and drugs.

I think people who have never lived in these places are the ones who don’t believe this to be the case.

There's no real evidence in recent history that Labour are any worse than the Tories at managing Government finances. In the last labour government, the debt increased significantly due to having to bail out banks in the financial crisis (the Conservatives would have had to do the same thing). In the present Conservative government, debt increased massively because of schemes set up during the coronavirus crisis (Labour would again have had to do the same thing). The truth is both events were largely outside both government's control. There will be spending pressures in either Government due to ageing population. There is likely to be more pressure on Labour governments to spend more on education and health due to the makeup of their voters though but not sure that makes them worse at managing finances.

Agree that affluent don't understand plight of poor. But most people want to believe they are rich due to hard work and not due to luck of the draw.

I think it’s possible to understand but that many people choose not to.

Yes I agree if you are affluent you are probably less aware / unaware of the realities of life for people on lower incomes.

But - I do also notice on moment that people in ‘cheaper’ areas are also often clueless about the costs of living in technically more ‘affluent’ areas.

So eg:

• why can’t the person in the cheaper area get a better job? Ignoring the job opportunities there
• thinking the person in the more affluent area is incredibly wealthy, while they are spending vastly more on housing, childcare, travel etc.

I’m sure some privileged people don’t realise how unequal society is but of course it’s possible to understand inequality without actually having to have lived in the poorest and the most affluent parts of the country. You just need to be inquisitive and know how to process information.

I get it. We live in an affluent area and are largely unaffected by a lot of issues, because we’re cushioned by wealth. We paid privately for education and health. We don’t need public transport as we have decent cars. If something breaks, we replace it. We’re insured for most things. We have savings and pensions. Our house is nice, as is our life. We don’t see much crime or poverty here. There are good schools and facilities.

But in the past we have been so broke that we couldn’t afford Sky TV - I’M JOKING - but we didn’t know if we had enough for our rent or bills. We’ve lived in shit areas with police helicopters circling some nights. So just because we’re comfortable now doesn’t mean we don’t get it, we do.

So just because we live in an affluent area doesn’t mean we don’t get how shitty life is for a lot of people. We do, but we aren’t actually living it which is an entirely different matter.

Labour doesn't have the faintest clue about sen either.

Sure start should definitely be reinstated and access to speech and language therapy etc.

No one in the Europe is happy we are in a proxy war with Russia and we have come out of covid.

• I had my most shitty life times under the last labour gov, not due to them but legal aid was cut I had no help in courts, my mum was crucified by sw for using the wrong terminology about her own son... grilled and patronised about it all.

I think sometimes, yes, people who've always been wealthy and have always lived in wealthy areas can lack understanding of poverty and inequality. Although not everyone, as plenty of people are aware and/or concerned about it even if they haven't experienced or seen it.

However, I don't think the second part of your OP is accurate (wrt voting inclinations).

There's always been lots of so-called 'working class Tories'. That goes back way before recent times. Partly because some felt let down by the last Labour government, but also because the UK has traditionally been more small 'c' conservative than some other countries.

Equally for decades (maybe longer?) there's been a lot of so-called 'champagne socialists'. People from wealthy backgrounds who live in wealthy areas and vote Labour.

There will be spending pressures in either Government due to ageing population

Life expectancy is no longer increasing (and I believe it's actually started to fall).

Also, if people don't want "the pressure of an ageing population", perhaps Labour should tell everyone to increase their boozing, smoke loads, eat only junk food, and stop exercising when they hit 50. Then lots of people will have massive heart attacks and die young. DH and I are considering it, after seeing all the recent Elderly Bashing threads on here (yes he sometimes has a look at MN). Our kids will be upset but seems lots of other people will be happy.

But anyway the economic issues are absolutely not 'all down to old people'. It's actually because of decades of false economy.

If there was a genuine desire from whoever forms government to help the economy and tackle inequality, they'd do the following:

Well-funded public services, more social housing, supportive benefits system, improved child support system, and job and training opportunities.

People would then get effective and timely help, so have less need for state help.

You’d have to be monumentally thick not to grasp that inequality and poverty exist even if you don’t see them in your cul de sac.

@QueenofTheBorg

So actually you haven't always lived in an affluent area, which is my point.

If you had always lived your current life, do you think you would have any idea how hard it is if you lived in a high deprivation area?

@Triskeline

I do think there are a lot of monumentally thick people in my neck of the woods