To think if you've always lived in an affluent place you have no real idea about inequality in the UK?

[Pipsquiggle]

To give a bit of context, I grew up in one of the poorest boroughs in the country and now live in one of the richest.

Had a chat with a colleague today, saying I had randomly bumped into Wes Streeting yesterday and had a chat with him and wished him well. She said I could never vote for Labour, they are terrible with money.

I then said well at least they closed the inequality gap which had been completely undone and made worse by the Tories.
She asked what did I mean so I outlined the following:
Underfunding of councils in poor area which were already under the kosh
Underfunding of schools and SEN
Lack of transport infrastructure so if you don't have a car in many towns you are fucked, which in turn can lead to wage suppression
Closure of Sure start centres
Only being able to afford UP foods and the knock effects on the NHS and behaviour at schools............

I made a few more points and she admitted she just said she had no idea. I told her that if I had lived where I had live now all my life that I probably would be a Tory too but I can't ignore the poverty in my home town.

So AIBU to think that if you have only lived in an affluent area, you don't really understand how bad it is in the wider country?

Because they don't vote Labour do you mean?

The Tory voting working class I know ( family) are not affected at all by migration ( they live in a very white English area) but will still blame immigration for housing problems in their area.

They vote Tory because Maggie sold them a house on the cheap and would never change their minds on anything

@Againname I agree but that means people have inaccurate opinions about the state of the nation. That’s why one of the things about Brexit was that some fairly affluent remain voters didn’t understand how much the Tories but especially Cameron and Osbourne were loathed up here because their towns had been pretty much left behind and starved of investment.
That’s why sometimes I read with incredulity some of the posts telling us how amazing the Tories have been. They must live in a very different area to me.

My Mother said that pre war we were a nation of Have and Have Not.
The Haves don't have clue.
We're back there again.

The problem was that voting brexit because you didn't like the tories or certain politicians was rather daft

Cutting your nose off to spite your face

I don’t think the poster meant that actually. Some people have clearly not voted in their best interests. Left behind areas voting to leave the EU and subsequently for the tories when at the same time their inhabitants were shafted by Tory austerity and have now lost EU funding never to replaced because of Tory Brexit. People are entitled to question their political nous.

There's some truth in that @greencartbluecart

However, it was the Conservative Party, Cameron, that implemented the rather stupid yes,no referendum. Ironically to unite the party. Stupid boy 😂

There he showed a great lack of understanding of the state of the nation !

Nope.

People in my neck of the woods are simply oblivious of how unequal the UK has become and how some towns are riddled with poverty - but you knew that I meant that and are determined to twist my words.

There’s kids (well ok people in their 20s) with great qualifications and work ethic who are doing a job well beneath their skillset. Mostly because there isn’t anything relevant available locally and their families can’t afford to support them to go to London. What’s more, they can’t even imagine going somewhere like London to live and work even if they could afford to as nobody in their family and immediate circle can even envisage such an idea. Very much still ‘not for the likes of us’ attitudes and lack of opportunity/ funding.

I’m really pleased my employer has decided to create lots of jobs outside the SE as it combats regional inequality. But regional inequality of opportunity is still unreal.

I was just embarrassed when my mum came to visit from a country with next to no homelessness and we were walking near Trafalgar Square at night as people started rolling their tents and sleeping bags out. She was absolutely shocked when she realised what was going on.

In the UK we think that’s normal now. It’s not normal. Another Tory government and we will basically become the USA where people go bankrupt when they dare get sick, and get no maternity leave if they don’t die giving birth, or 14 days annual leave. It’s not normal and ‘oh well, you get what you’re given’. It’s a choice we as a society have a say in.

I also grew up in a very deprived area and this is absolutely the case for the majority of people I know/knew. I was the anomaly and wanted more in life. I’ve managed to go to uni, get a good job, get a good wage, buy a good house etc and I no longer live in deprivation. The opportunities are there for everyone, just not everyone chooses to take it.

I agree that it’s often the very middle classed population that don’t believe this to be the case.

@Goldenbear Theres been great initiatives but you cannot make dc successful who don’t want to be. Huge 6th form colleges do get lots of offers as independent school offers have gone down but London dc are very well represented at Oxbridge. Parental influence is huge and this is where London scores. There’s obvious reasons to do well. I find people from deprived areas don’t always make the best of their degrees either. Low ambition from too many. Coasting at an average uni and staying local, doesn’t lead to much quite often. Therefore we need alternatives that work.

Very few dc get an apprenticeship. Rural dc cannot even get to them. No trabsport. Each apprenticeship is a separate application. They are hugely competitive so average results (not sure what average is when 50% of A levels are Astar,A or B) won’t hack it. C and D is below average so we should accept uni isn’t the right HE route.

Low ambition or low self belief ? Or lack of contacts and knowledge about how things work ?
Coasting or being pleased at the progress they have made ?

There is always multiple ways to look at these things

What contacts? There are umpteen careers events at uni. Students should go to them and uni should level up. Dc need to grab opportunities or whets the point of uni? Waste of money.

Coasting is not the same as making good progress, even if a student thinks it is. Schools are aware of this and try and get dc to make the best progress they can.

Aiming high is copying the best and getting out of your comfort zone. It’s how we make a difference to society. Not bothering is comfortable but there’s little progress to be made on social movement if you earn less than your unskilled dad. I am afraid conditioned behaviour does restrict dc even when dc see others doing better. Some simply don’t want it. Any old job will do. They have been given the tools but don’t pick them up.

No, incorrect - their 6 form college is nothing to do with independent school offers decreasing, this is what private school parents like to believe but respectfully it is nonsense, contextual offers don’t work like that. My DS only knows one friend with contextual offer to Oxford. We are not in London, that is an exceptional amount of offers, it is not typical of 6th form colleges that aren’t particularly selective to have many Oxbridge offers it is one of the best state sixth form colleges in the country! I think it probably has quite a few well off students but not wealth that you see in London- I think the educational attainment of the parents is probably a large part of it. i don’t know any 6th formers going for apprenticeships mainly because this is pretty liberal area and I think they are seen as too corporate. It is quite hard to achieve A* at A level by the way and really unfair on the 18 year olds efforts. I know and can compare as my son is pretty much studying what I did at A level, sometimes they are harder. I don’t think that an A has deflated that much.

Absolutely. There’s this belief often amongst those who should know better that individuals who end up unemployed or in poorly paying jobs are somehow at fault. That they lack ambition. A decent work ethic. Grit. Often there are multiple factors that come into play. Undiagnosed learning disabilities (high percentage of the prison population have them), generational experience of abuse, poverty, drug and alcohol addiction, mental and physical ill health. Sometimes it’s just bad luck.
I find it sad that the very folk who should empathise can’t or won’t.

No, I just wondered if it was that which would make you call people 'monumentally thick' as it is pretty offensive.

Not everyone has to achieve the same, equality of opportunity is important but people value different things. My Dad became an Economist and came from a working class background but he wasn’t really interested in earning loads of money or what went with that- nice house, nice car etc, he valued non monetary things and was very heavily involved in politics My Mum was similar and won a famous poetry competition and wrote songs as well as being a teacher, she was arty I suppose: Money wasn’t the focus but we were comfortable.

Yes I completely agree with this - middle class blinkers on.

i don’t know any 6th formers going for apprenticeships mainly because this is pretty liberal area and I think they are seen as too corporate

This is truly dreadful! Degree apprenticeships are brilliant and absolutely something to aspire to.

My son has friends who went to our local uni which is fairly low in the league tables. They’ve mainly got degrees in comp science. Some are still working in the retail jobs as they had as students. They’re struggling to get IT jobs because they’ve haven’t got experience, even for first line junior help desk posts on <£19k a year.
None of them can just up sticks and move to London where no doubt opportunities are better. They simply can’t afford it. Some don’t drive so that’s limited where they can apply locally because public transport is so poor.
I find your comments a bit tone deaf to be honest and very patronising. We’re talking about people here. Some have to work in any job because they have don’t any choice. No bank of mum or dad to rely on.

Yep totally agree.

Ah yes. If you have all A*s. Only a tiny minority manage to get these. Incredibly competitive.

I agree that you are more likely to be unaware/ ignorant if you have lived in affluence all your life. People who live in an affluent area but work with the general public/ have an enquiring mind/ an interest in others within the society rather than just themselves can be well aware, however.

I don't see this as a Tory vs Labour thing. There are plenty of lifelong Tory voters in very deprived areas.
There are a few hopelessly naive posts I've seen on here which are rather demonstrating @Pipsquiggle's point.

Agree. There are so many parallel lives going on and as they are rarely represented in mainstream drama they go under the radar for many.