To think if you've always lived in an affluent place you have no real idea about inequality in the UK?

[Pipsquiggle]

To give a bit of context, I grew up in one of the poorest boroughs in the country and now live in one of the richest.

Had a chat with a colleague today, saying I had randomly bumped into Wes Streeting yesterday and had a chat with him and wished him well. She said I could never vote for Labour, they are terrible with money.

I then said well at least they closed the inequality gap which had been completely undone and made worse by the Tories.
She asked what did I mean so I outlined the following:
Underfunding of councils in poor area which were already under the kosh
Underfunding of schools and SEN
Lack of transport infrastructure so if you don't have a car in many towns you are fucked, which in turn can lead to wage suppression
Closure of Sure start centres
Only being able to afford UP foods and the knock effects on the NHS and behaviour at schools............

I made a few more points and she admitted she just said she had no idea. I told her that if I had lived where I had live now all my life that I probably would be a Tory too but I can't ignore the poverty in my home town.

So AIBU to think that if you have only lived in an affluent area, you don't really understand how bad it is in the wider country?

People at uni are worlds apart from people living in the poorest areas in the country.
Yes occasionally people from sink estates do make it to university more commonly now, but in the 90s it was almost unheard of. Also they will be the ones that got away, the estate my husband grew up on, not one single person he knows apart from him has been to university. Most of his school friends haven't left the estate and probably never will. They are in survival mode just to get through each day is exhausting let alone making plans to get out.
On the big estate the shops to not sell anything other than some really rotten apples and occasionally bananas and onions and potatoes. All the food is pretty much processed shite. Transport links are terrible, the school is rated badly and from DHs account not a good place of learning. Crime is so high. Shops have people walking in and robbing from them. People can't afford washing machines so have to hand wash stuff. It's a tough existence made a lot tougher over the last 14 years. Sure start centre was apparently good but was shut down. There are obviously lots of fantastic people living on the estate but they have been ground down.
The thing I like about it compared to where we live is that the kids still play out and people look out for each other in a way they don't around our less rough area.
My parents have never been to his parents place but it is worlds apart from where they live, they would be so shocked at the state of the place and the amount of people with obvious health conditions.

I agree with this entirely. What is really nasty now is the calculated exploitation of the poor. A PP talked about the support she had under a Labour government post an abusive relationship. Well try doing the same now. There is little psychological support for children affected because of waiting lists. There is an excellent chance of a woman being placed in a bed and breakfast with her children for years if she leaves. If she reports her abuser to the police, the justice system may take it forward but she can expect years before it comes to court. Meanwhile the family court will grant access to the children on the basis of laws lobbied for where the legal test is effectively there must be involvement, even if the man is violent, even if he abuses his own children.

This is one example of how unequal life can be; and how cruel our society has been engineered to be. I am sure some Tory voters might be horrified; but a lot more aren’t bothered.

I come from a very very poor area and life was better for most people like me under labour- I don't support starmers labour and I don't even know who to vote in this election- but I do know that life was significantly better under labour than the tories. There were help to get job schemes in my area, free training classes, just lots of little things. My gran used to say she'd never been better off in her life.

Now I look at the area I live in - the play park is falling apart (when the surrounding affluent areas have brilliant parks) all the cafe's and shops are closing, schools and nurseries are making their own food and clothes banks for families.

I totally agree with you @Pipsquiggle and thank you for starting this thread.

I campaigned in Blackpool for Labour MP Chris Webb and was shocked at the depravation I saw there, in some areas. Those residents were fearful and largely disconnected. It really opened my eyes.

What's needed is a sense of community and service for the good of everyone.

My DH and I come from very different backgrounds and the life he describes growing up is unimaginable to me. After 40 odd years together we still see the same world, even our own home town, through very different lenses.

I was brought up in Kent, friends with the MPs son, grammar school system, incredibly middle class. Despite doing A Level Government and Politics and going to university over 10 years ago I had no idea that people lived the way they do until about mid 2010s, despite the fact I was born and having close family in Middlesbrough.

I think it’s easy to be caught up in your own spheres as ultimately those are the things that affect you most. I think it’s incredibly easy to see the things on tv and expect them to be just that - tv, fiction, hyperbole. I still live in an incredibly affluent area as we made the decision yet I think once your eyes are opened, you are unable to forget.

I must add that I’m autistic so my bubble is perhaps even more cushioned than most.

Well having lived in some rough areas I have usually found that it’s the local residents who have smashed up the equipment.
Its one of those things I can never get my head around what do people get out vandalism?

This absolutely hits the nail on the head.
Areas become nice to live in not necessarily due to the amount of money in them, but the attitude of the commuinity living there.

We moved from a more expensive to cheaper area to get more space. But the attitudes and support available in the cheaper area are much better as its a commuinity which pulls together, with loads of people voluntarily setting up support groups for children with additional needs, elderly, bereaved, mental health, lots of very cheap youth groups which take children on brilliant adventures, commuinity pantry, commuinity picnics, litter picks etc. As a rural area we get way less government investment - I have never seen a police patrol here, the park got updated through charity grants and local fundraising, our local library is run entirely by volunteers, the grass verges are mown by residents, we do own street cleaning etc.

An area is truly affluent when people are invested in making it a positive place to live.

Thank you @Bushmillsbabe

It's very cost effective to engage to positively bring changes into the area for the greater good of that community. It frees up money to bring about change nationwide such as getting down waiting lists in the NHS. Benefits everyone.

We did flag up concerns for those who spoke in Blackpool. That area just needed a little more thought and yes some money.

I think you're spot on. I've never lived in particularly affluent areas, but equally I've certainly never lived in a very deprived area. The older I get the more I realise I just can't comprehend how different and privileged my life has been.

I agree with you. I have lived in some very deprived areas and now live in a very affluent one. The affluent one is chock full of wealthy or at least comfortable Tories, some of them quite young, who have barely seen outside of their window and hate newcomers moving to 'their town'. It's depressing.

Ignoring the fact that historically the economy does better under Labour governments (GDP & earnings growth & less days lost to industrial action) as well as better funding for education, given Starmer's Labour has committed to following Conservative fiscal rules, it's rather a mute point.

Gosh I'm so tired of these sorts of threads. The basic idea is that people who don't vote Labour are either thick or blinkered, and just need to be shown the error of their ways to come to the light and embrace being left-wing.

Everyone has the right to vote and align their politics with whichever party they choose. Left-wingers might think they have the moral high ground by voting the way they do, but is that really the case? They like to think they are better and more tolerant than the "other side" but threads like this show that they are ust as judgey and intolerant.

By all means disagree with someone's political stance, political debate is a healthy thing and should not be supressed. But this idea that people need to be "educated" into thinking differently and if they just tried a bit harder to understand they would also change their voting intentions - just no.

And before the accusations start flying of "oh you're SO clearly a Tory who spends her spare time murdering kittens" - actually not. Floating voter who has voted for all the main parties in my time, and this time will be voting whoever is best sited to give the SNP a kicking in my particular constituency.

This is my problem with the conservative party. I believe that all (or nearly all) of the cabinet members are millionaires and have lived lives of privilege. They just can't understand the dreadful lives some people are living in this country. That famous video of Rishi Sunak saying he doesn't have any working class friends, says it all really.
I know many Labour MPs are also wealthy and went to private schools etc, but the percentage is nowhere near as high. The also have many MPs who grew up in poverty. They have members of the shadow cabinet who've experienced poverty (I know this because I'm friends with one of them). I feel that to represent your communities you need to understand how life is for them.

Hmm but yet if someone on here is earning 3k per month they would be told they were well off wouldn’t they, as if they don’t also have bills and childcare to pay, so you can see why people might get a bit pissed off.

Absolutely. There should be a rule that you can only stand as an MP for a constituency which you live in. I appreciate they would probably still chose to live in a nicer area in their constituency, but they would still have better understanding than if live 200 miles away.
I attended NCT with a Labour MP in West London, and her constituency was up north, she went up there 2 times a month for 1 day to hold surgeries for residents. How on earth could she understand the challenges they faced there, from her million+ pound House in London.
I worked in the Borough in West London where she lived, and there was huge areas of deprivation but when I talked to her about my job it was so clear she had absolutely no understanding of the struggles some people go through daily, and no compassion for them. I think the term is a 'champagne socialist'. She lost her seat and is now standing in an affluent area of Buckinghamshire, where I hapen to also now live. I don't want to vote Tory, but also cannot vote for her due to level of hypocrisy.

So AIBU to think that if you have only lived in an affluent area, you don't really understand how bad it is in the wider country?

YANBU but it works the other way too. People who live with deprivation have no idea that even people who earn enough to support themselves also work bloody hard and have to run the same risk of not getting treated on the NHS in good time etc etc. There is more reverse snobbery than real snobbery ime.

DD's BF is from Surrey and from a wealthy family on his Mums side (his Dad is Northern and working class). He is a lovely boy but has been at his Private school since 4 and hasn't "seen" a lot.
We live in a nice part of a gritty Northern town but he always gets a few shocks when he comes to visit. Takes it all in his stride though, never snobby about it. DD likes to tease him when he complains about only having 1 ski trip this year (because he spent 3 months in Asia travelling) and tell him that she has friends who have never been abroad!!
Even his Mum has commented that she thinks her DC have been a bit sheltered from reality

Not as tired as I am of people ignoring the evidence available.

How would you describe people consistently voting both against their own best interests & those of the majority of the country?

Leaving ideology to one side, we know that the more equal a society is the better it is, on every measurement; better health, life expectancy, infant mortality, obesity levels, crime rates, literacy scores, even the amount of rubbish that gets recycled, the more equal the society the better the performance invariably is.

"the more unequal ones do worse according to almost every quality of life indicator you can imagine. They do worse even if they are richer overall, so that per capita GDP turns out to be much less significant for general wellbeing than the size of the gap between the richest and poorest 20 per cent of the population"

It seems pretty stupid to consistently vote for governments that have no interest in working towards greater equality.

I know what you mean OP. I was brought up in a council house , mum a cleaner , dad in building trade (not own business or anything like that) big working class family. Alcohol issues, domestic violence etc . I was a single mum for 13 years as well. I worked as a social worker and I know there were collegues who felt myself and other social workers from working class backgrounds were "too close " to the backgrounds of some of our service users. This was actually said. Nice eh? This was very people from very affluent, privately educated backgrounds . And yes, they are all managers now and myself and my fellow schemie workmates have left, are grafting away as basic grade workers or (in my case) the bullying and lack of support nearly ended me and I work as a carer now. Much happier. Work on my council scheme community now still. Maybe they were right?

I think you can get that attitude from people that have grown up in poverty, especially if they’ve managed to ‘better themselves’ they don’t see the invisible privilege they may have had from supportive parents, good health or just plain old luck.
I think growing up in a nice area, might cosset you from some of the realities of life, but It’s empathy that some people lack when they can’t understand why other people struggle in life.

I would think that being able to identify either people and show real empathy would help as a SW,rather than it being looked down on?
Not quite the same, but I feel having a child with (albeit mild) disabilities has made me better at my job working with children with complex needs.

People love to make assumptions about people don't they! My parents grew up in very similar situations to you, my Dad was thrown out at 15 for now handing over his whole pay packet from his Saturday job to his Dad to buy booze with (he was trying to hold onto it to buy food for him and his younger brother as usually no food in the house). My Dad then went on to do very well for himself and I was fortunate to grow up in relative comfort, but I got so many comments about my parents being snobs who had never known what it was like to struggle.
People never know others struggles and what they had to do just to survive.

I grew up in extremely severe poverty, with lack of food and heating.
My DC are in private school now and absolutely everything I have in material sense was paid out of my salary, I've never ever received a penny from anyone.

I'm now a prime target for Labour to strip me of my savings, income and boot my DC to sink state school nearby because I can't bridge the VAT gap.
As PP said - a lot of people in my childhood place are still in dire poverty. And dare I say - it's their own fault.

Why having supportive parents is now considered a privilege? why isn't this a norm?
Why there is always assumption that poor parents are bad and unsupportive parents?

You just need to work hard at school and you can do anything you want.

Yeah right, I live in one of the most deprived areas, the only school I can get my child into is a sink school, she's too afraid to even get the school bus its that rough. Education is important but what chance does a child have to better themselves when they spend half their life living in fear or dread. When you need extra support to achieve your best but you aren't bad enough to get attention because too many others need it. Its so easy to say I just worked hard and made a better life for myself but some children are being failed so badly no matter who is in power that they aren't in a position to improve things for themselves.